Help me with this, I recall reading somewhere there was some sort of problem with Pastor Floyd Flakes changing the name of Allen Chapel. Well Now when did the AME church star to assign eives as co-pastors? Rev. Dr. Elaine Flakes is now co- pastor of which Rev. Floyd is pastor. Has Allen pulled out from the AME Connection?

-- Anonymous, September 19, 2003

Answers

I believe some of the controversy was because Allen is now called "the Cathedral" and usually a cathedral is where a bishop resides in charge. They may have adapted the name partially because Bishop Ming pastored there before he was a Bishop, but I am not sure. As for co-pastors, Ebenezer also has a husband and wife team co- pastoring and there are many larger churches using ministers as assistant pastors, youth pastors, executive pastors, etc. I don't think this is actually recognized in the discipline nor is it legally binding as far as creating a line of pastoral succesion. I would think that the pastoral appointment would only have one person's name on the appointment. I think it is done mainly as a way for the pastor to delegate certain duties and to have the congregation recognize that delegation.

-- Anonymous, September 19, 2003

they are very much still apart of the ame church. even on the broadcast its shows its ame. alot pastors and young preachers like my self who are looking to start churches. alot of times we use cathedral. thats what allen is its not a chapel its a cathedral. however, it is not unlikely that husband and wife who are in ministry share in the roll of pastor. so dr.floyd is simply letting us know that his wife shares as pastor to.

-- Anonymous, September 20, 2003

I would like to addendum to Rev. Green's comment. The AME Church at present makes only one appointment per congregation. Unlike other denominations which have more than one appoint at a church e.g. UMC, Episicopal, Luther, Catholic. The AME Church Discipline does acknowledge multiple ministries within a church. If the Pastor is secure in his/her faith development and knows what the Lord has for him/her to do he/she will be happy to use others in the ministry/ies at the church. This will help curtail burn-out,nerves break-downs and a lot of other aliments so common to the ministry when a person tries to do it all.

Those churches that have a large enough budget can pay to have full time ministerial staff besides the Pastor. Everyone is not called to be a Pastor but many are called to the ministry in different facets. Remember, there are many members but only one true PASTOR which is JESUS CHRIST.

-- Anonymous, September 20, 2003

The word "cathedral" has evolved in common parlance to mean " a large church building". Examples: The Crystal Cathedral, which is a Reformed Congregation, and the former "Cathedral of Tomorrow" of which Rex Humbard was pastor. The building is now owed and "pastored" by Ernest Angley.

-- Anonymous, September 23, 2003

I visited the Allen Chapel website at allencathedral.org, and there was no sign that it is an AME Church. Check it out.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2003

My point exactly, can a pastor come in and revise an AME church to one of non denominational and forget about the Discipline? I watched him on BET this morning and there is no evidence that this is an AME Church.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2003

I'm sure the ultimate evidence that this is an AME church is the HUGE conference claims he must be paying as a result of such a large membership. Something in the neighborhood of 15,000...

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2003

In defense of the Allen Cathedral of New York, they need no defense regarding God's work and Word speaks for them, However: If you will go back to the web site again, click on the link to Cathedral History and you will find two documents that clearly reflect that this is an AME Church.

Be Blessed

Pastor Paris

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2003

If you look at the website, it not only clearly states that Allen Cathedral is AME but they also explain the history and the name Allen Cathedral Church. Another issue that larger congregations are dealing with is the connection to a particular denomination when it comes to grant funding for community ministries. There have been several churches to drop the listing of their denomination so that they may qualify for the grants. Now my question is this: If you have 19,000 members, why do you need grant money? If everyone simply placed $1 during the week that is an annual income of $988k. Is that not enough? Just wondering.

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2003

Carolyn -

The short answer to your question - No. QED

-- Anonymous, September 24, 2003

Carolyn, A somewhat longer response to your question- Under Pastor Donald Ming, Allen AME, Jamaica NY built a beautiful new facility to accomodate the congregation of that time (approximately 1968). With tremendous organization, skill, and programs to support christian development, Allen became a force visible in the connection, and in 1976 the General Conference recognized its pastor by elevating him to the Bishopric. At that time, the new bishop oof the First District, Richard Allen Hildebrand, who himself was elected from the First (Bridge Street, Brooklyn in 1972), took the radical and daring step of appointing the then unheralded Floyd Flake to the charge. Rev. Flake had served as the assistant pastor of St. Paul Cambridge MA, while he was working at BU's MLK Center, and later served as the pastor of Mt. Zion Newport, RI, a small congregation of about 34 members. For Bishop Hildebrand to send this "untried" pastor to Allen, which at the time had roughly 1400 members and a sanctuary that seated 800, seemed to some an ungainly promotion. In the 27 years of the Flake administration, the church has:

• grown from 1400 to beyond 14,000 (see their site for the current count)
• built and operated a senior citizen center
• built and operated a private school serving grades k-8
• developed a "business district" and a philosophy to encourage, develop, and export entrepreneurial spirit, ownership and self-help - a concept espoused in the Free African Society era of its namesake, Richard Allen
• totally revitalized the Merrick Blvd area of Jamaica
• built an additional sanctuary, the "cathedral" in question, that seats over 3000.

It is these activities, and many more too numerous to mention, that suggest a budget of $988K would be insufficient. And yes, Allen does pay one of the largest assessments in the connection, along with First Los Angeles, Ebenezer Ft. Washington, and I believe St. Phillip, Atlanta.

-- Anonymous, October 04, 2003