I need some advice on what to give my yearling doe....she just had twins, but was in labor for almost 2 hours before I had help get here....we had to pull them out, they were totally jammed inside.

So far, babies and momma look good....I gave them all a dose of ID-1.

I have penicillin.... should I give it? how much should I give, and can I give it subQ rather than IM?

I also have Fortified B Complex, would it be a good idea to dose her with it as well?

Thanks!

Tracy

Oh and the babies were one doe and one buck!

-- Tracy (zebella@mindspring.com), April 05, 2002

Answers

We're you really clean when you went in? If so then I wouldn't worry about the antibiotics. B complex is a great idea. Here is a a paste on Penicillins from Saandoah:

THE PENICILLINS There are 4 classes of penicillins from narrow to broad range of effectiveness, based upon their ability to kill various types of bacteria.

Natural penicillins and penicillinase-resistant penicillins: Penicillin G and Penicillin V

Various brand names include: Penicillin G: Penicillin G Potassium, Penicillin G Procaine, Pen BP-48, Dual-Pen Penicillin V: Pen-V Not useful against penicillinase or beta-lactamase producing bacteria or most gram negative bacteria

Aminopenicillins: Ampicillin, Amoxicillin, Cyclacillin, Hetacillin

Not as useful against anaerobic bacteria as natural penicillins. Aminopenicillins are not effective against those bacteria that produce penicillinase or beta-lactamase.

Extended-spectrum penicillins: Alpha-carboxypenicillins: carbenicillin, Acylaminopenicillins: piperacillin

Brand names include: Carbenicillin: Geocillin (oral), Geopen (oral and injectable) Extended-spectrum penicillins are not commonly used. They are prescribed for certain bacterial infections when other antibiotics are ineffective. Extended-spectrum penicillins treat similar infections as the aminopenicillins but have additional activity against more gram negative bacteria. Susceptible to inactivation by penicillinase and beta- lactamase producing bacteria.

Potentiated penicillins: Amoxicillin-potassium clavulanate, ampicillin-sulbactam

Brand names: Augmentin and Clavamox contain amoxicillin plus potassium clavulanate Potentiated pencillins have potassium clavulanate and sulbactam added to reduce inactivation by beta-lactamases. These additional compounds increase the types of bacteria against which various classes of penicillin are effective. Potentiated penicillins are often used in skin infections. There are many forms of penicillin, and dosages vary greatly

PROCAINE PENICILLIN G Extra label in goats Various brand names 300,000 units Procaine Penicillin G/ml DOSE: 10,000 units/lb twice daily with higher doses for well established infections. DOSE: Kids - 1-2ml SC (SQ) for baby goats (8-25lbs), 1 or 2 times daily. DOSE: Adults - 6-10 ml SC (SQ) for adult goats, 1X or 2X daily. You can double recommend maximum dose on first injection, then divided daily dose and inject every 12 hours for 2-3 days, then 1X daily thereafter. STORAGE: Refrigerate (36°-46°F, 2°-8°C). Protect from freezing. To prevent procaine toxicity, keeping procaine penicillin at proper storage temperature and following shelf life recommendations are recomended to avoid any degradation of the product. WITHDRAWAL:

MILK: Extra label in goats. Goats: 5 days given SQ at 10,000 - 20,000 IU/lb/lb once daily (SOURCE- 10-12, 2000 Wool & Wattles, AASRP). Dairy Cattle: (at label dose rate) 48-72 hours. Note:Penicillin G is distributed into milk; in food animals the distribution is sufficient to cause violative residues. However, (label dose) the concentrations of penicillin produced in milk are subtherapeutic for most bacteria. In sheep, 0.11% of an intramuscular injection of sodium penicillin G was distributed into the milk. MEATExtra label in goats Goats: 14-20 days given SQ at 10,000 - 20,000 IU/lb once daily (SOURCE- 10-12, 2000 Wool & Wattles, AASRP)

BACTERICIDAL Interferes with cell wall synthesis Classes of Penicillin

Pennicillin references

Saanedoah basics Page

This really is an amazing site.

Congrats on the birth!!! I know how wild it is the first time, and I am glad it all worked out well for you!

-- Doreeen (animalwaitress@yahoo.com), April 06, 2002.

Yes all over the counter antibiotics should be given subq. You can do loading doses if you like for quick blood levels IM but it is totally unnecessary to give the rest of the shots IM. I don't use antibiotics for helping deliver unless it is really invassive or you aren't clean. Like when John, DH, helped me he was leaning on one hand while fishing with the other, then switched hands!!! :) The doe ended up with a very invassive delivery so she was put on penicillin, and because of the manure hand up inside her even if it hadn't turned out so badly she still would have been put on it. Now I do put them on Pen if I have to go up inside to check for more kids, and the placenta or a placenta has already been expelled. This is why all my customers think I always use pen after the does kids, because I am called after kidding to guess :) if she has more kids in her, I go in and check, no kids so you get to put the doe on pen for 5 days :) Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (Nubians) (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), April 07, 2002.