i know this may sound silly but i need to know. I have a buck that has horns and he is the father of a buck my doe just had can i keep the little buck and breed him to his sisters and mother. I want to keep him if he doesn't have any horns.

-- gail akins (gakins@simplynet.net), February 10, 2002

Answers

I have heard of people doing what you suggest. I had one accidental breeding of son to mother and was VERY unhappy with the results. If there is a defect in them you can almost count on it being doubled when you breed that close.

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), February 10, 2002.

Really Gail the answer should be no. In a large herd that is really up on the bloodlines of the goats they have, yes imbreeding like this is done. But you have to understand that you will end up with some small stock, you can also end up with birth defects, and problems later on in life. Are you willing to kill an infant girl at birth? How about finding someone else with goats in your area and trading them a buck for your buck? There are just to many nice animals around, which would be an improvement for you. Improve his mom and his sister! Even in my herd I use very few bucks that I have born here. No matter how good you think your goats are, there are other herds with better does to buy bucks from. Where are you located? Most dairies and larger herds have some sort of buckling program, ours is buy the buckling the day he is born or shortly afterwards and get him, paperwork and all for 50$. Obviously programs like this are not for the best does kids, but 1st fresheners etc. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (nubians) (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), February 11, 2002.

He will probably have horns unless you disbud him. Polled goats are not real common, and you can't breed two polled goats together without the risk of getting hermaphrodites. Like Vicki said, sometimes close breedings are practiced, in fact I bred a doe to her father this year, first time I've done this. I did it for two reasons. When I took her to the gate of the unrelated buck, and looked at her feet, and then his, they both had the same fault, and her father does not. I just couldn't brng myself to breed her that buck! And, I am using her father a lot on my herd. He himself is linebred, and I want to know what sort of recessive genes are lurking in ther background. Breeding him to his daughter will do that for me.

But- I am fully prepared to cull any doe kids for meat if they are not of good quality, when I say good quality, I mean better than the dam. If you are going to inbreed, you need to know the lines you are working with, what to expect, what you are looking to improve by inbreeding, and the will to cull any kids that are not the best. There may be just one in ten kids that are of a quality to keep, that means that the others would have to be culled, no matter how colorful or pretty. Upside is that linebreeding and inbreeding give you consistent, predictable results. Maybe predictably bad, or predictably good, but the more linebreeding is done, the fewer surprises, that's my two cents. :)

-- Rebekah (daniel1@itss.net), February 11, 2002.

Vicki, just for the record.....I did not say emphatically NO because of Frosty Marvin and several other products of inbreeding. I personally would NEVER do it on purpose myself. I think your advise to gail was very appropriate. :>)

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), February 11, 2002.

Shoot Diane, you give great answers! I went in behind yours only because you can put things, like Bernice, much gentler than me! I tell my new customers absolutly NO, then do it myself. I really think that if you need to ask the question than you do not know enough about genetics to take the risk. Now.....that answer is worse and snobbier than the first! :) Have a great day! Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), February 12, 2002.

Vicki, I am always amazed that you just answer them all. My "snobbishness" if you want to call it that, comes out in other ways. (like how often to do you every see me on a pigmy thread) ;>)

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), February 13, 2002.

Diane, did you spell pygmy, pigmy on purpose? I spell sable, saable all the time :) I am just bored right now, usually am through kidding, shaving for the stock show and busy busy busy, not kidding for another 2 weeks. Then I won't be answering "every" :) question! I was a little hard on Chandler, honestly forgot he was a young-un over on Countryside, until I read his Gay Dog thread! Brother! I do have something pretty cool going on right now, a boer herd by me has decided to let the ole dairy lady broker their boers, going to put the bred does out in the woods pen. Probably will just keep them. And........a trip weekend after this to Vivian Proctors up in Leaky Texas, friend of mine is going to look at her old milking equipment. Vivian and her deceased hubby George were Cadillac Nubians, Nubians for about 50 years at least. She is also an long time ADGA director and the Nubian History person, how cool to talk to her! I have conversed with her before about things, but never just a visit! Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), February 14, 2002.

Way cool Vicky......I am green with jealousy!!! You must report back about your visit. Yes, spelled wrong on purpose. Never cared much for the little buggers and sure don't like trying to get their kids out for people that just can't help themselves and keep them. Finally just started telling people to call the vet and save time. 300 DOLLARS for a c-section................sure can't make any money that way.

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), February 14, 2002.