Thank you to all for your thoughts. In my desire for self sufficiency, I trully wanted to exclude myself from the power company's control. After much consideration, however, I do suppose you're all correct and that the better route is to keep the electric and simply minimize the usage. Currently, I'm super-insulating the house; adding a new wood burning cookstove; eliminating most high energy consuming appliances; and adding some solar. Amazingly, my city allows most livestock, even horses. I have a decent sized lot (for a city lot), but unfortunately it seems that the quantity of pollution would find its way into my gardening efforts. So, I'm off to a start towards compromise, moderation, and balance...as much as one can do in a city.

-- (arbitrage@usa.com), December 07, 2001

Answers

IF you go to all solar, check into the power company 'having' to buy at fair market rate what you do not use. The Federal and/or State will pay for half the cost of purchasing a whole house solar system. Do check into that.

The pollution problem is probably less now then it was during the industrial revolution. Don't let that stop you from gardening! What ever you grow is better then what you can purchase anywhere. Purchase meat, vegetables and fruit when it is on sale and preserve/can it.

Funny how one has to spend money to save money!

-- westbrook (westbrook_farms@yahoo.com), December 07, 2001.

Our power company (BGE) charges minimum customer charges that just about nulify frugality :( Our house does pretty well in terms of passive solar heat. The two things we would need to go off grid would be a kerosene or propane heater for frigid days, and a water heater as our local codes call for hot RUNNING water.

I'm curious what city allows livestock. If you don't want to be specific even a county and state would give me an idea. In our Baltimore county in Maryland you need 3 acres to keep a duck!!!

-- Rick (Rick_122@hotmail.com), December 07, 2001.

Consider small chicken tractors to 1)provide you with eggs, 2) eat the garden bugs, 3) provide fertilizer and 4) eat the plants after the veggies are harvested.

Don't fret about pollution--it falls on farms as well as city property. Do what you can with passive solar too (consider a small greenhouse that can open to a window or door in your home and provide heat in the winter.

-- Ann Markson (tngreenacres@hotmail.com), December 07, 2001.

I agee with the chicken idea. A few hens are not that noisy, remember, you don't need a rooster to have eggs. Also a garden would supply you with fresh veggies and herbs. If you are into it, meat rabbits would be an easy project. Good luck to you!

-- cowgirlone (cowgirlone47@hotmail.com), December 07, 2001.

So, uh, what do you mean by pollution? Are you talking about . . . ahem . . . manure? You know, that stuff that every gardener buys in little sacks for exhorbitant sums of money? I too live in the city (six blocks from the courthouse, city of 30,000) and have chickens and goats. Twice a year, when I clean the sheds, another portion of my property becomes incredibly fertile and gets planted with more "edible landscaping."

So far, we have blueberries, cherries and numerous flowers, along with a young filbert and three young apple trees, in the front yard. (Blueberries are really striking in the fall with their red leaves.) In the back, we have a three small deep beds for vegetables, and permanent grapes, currants, loganberries, raspberries, rhubarb, roses, lilacs, artichokes, strawberries, a decent herb garden, and six fruit trees: asian pear combo, european pear combo, apple combo, peach, apricot, italian prune, for a total of 18 different tree fruits, counting the cherries. And more going in all the time. Oh, yeah, there's also the goat yard, the chicken/greenhouse, and the composting bins.

This is on a corner lot (lots of wasted space for sidewalks) just under 1/4 acre with a sizeable house. So you see, all that "pollution" really can come in handy when working toward self- sufficiency. If I ever do have extra someday, a couple of people have already asked if they could have some. So far, I've said no. Selfish, I guess. :o)

-- Laura Jensen (lauraj@seedlaw.com), December 07, 2001.

I'm stuck in the suburbs of Dallas(Richardson to be exact). My problem is that we rent a house. Any thing I want to grow has to be in containers. My daughter is begging for a silky chicken for christmas. Do you think I could get away with calling it an exotic bird and hiding it in a portable green house? The land lady does allow pets.

-- buffy (buffyannjones@hotmail.com), December 07, 2001.

You might be able to mix in a few quiet ducks (Indian Runner or Khaki Campbell) - the occasional "quack" doesn't seem to carry as much as a triumphal carry-on from a hen that's just laid an egg. You might also be able to run Japanese quail in a cage in the garage - maybe under rabbit cages. Eggs and meat from Japanese quail are about as productive as you can get - better than most hens or ducks; and easy to pass off as pets. And the more variety the better.

-- Don Armstrong (darmst@yahoo.com.au), December 07, 2001.

I would like to learn more about Japanese quail. Anybody?

-- pc (jasper2@iname.com), December 07, 2001.

As always, you can try google for information with a search phrase like "Japanese quail raising". One of the best sources is from my country, my state, and my public service ( http://www.agric.nsw.gov.au/reader/201 ) - not that I'm prejudiced, you understand, but it's a simple dispassionate fact that we're so very VERY good. However, you might need to adjust any information there for the fact that you can get much colder winter temperatures than we do most places - even as cold as Japan.

-- Don Armstrong (from Australia) (darmst@yahoo.com.au), December 07, 2001.

For those that can't have livestock, including chickens...try rabbits!

-- westbrook (westbrook_farms@yahoo.com), December 07, 2001.

...by pollution, I mean: oil and gas leaks; sewage, chemical contaminants, exhaust, etc. Not much manure around here (pop. 1,000,000+). It's a transitional area about 8 minutes walk from skyscapers. I thought it would be great for a homesteader to infiltrate the city.

-- T (arbitrage@usa.com), December 07, 2001.

pc- Japanese quail (also called coturnix quail) are very tiny birds (about 6 oz). They are easy keepers, and very prolific layers--up to 300 eggs a year. 5 quail eggs = 1 chicken egg. The incubation period for hatching is approx. 17 days. In cold weather, the birds do need to be kept warm. Since mine live in the barn they're under a heat lamp most of the time.

-- Mary S. (1deal@quik.com), December 08, 2001.

There are alot of people homesteading in the citys and suburbs,alot of the latino cultures try to grow all they can. Gerbil [ sure miss her] told me of a great book were a group of people in berkley [ heart of yuppie town] calif took a old house and home steaded in it. Instead of lawn they grew alfalfa, raised rabbits, chickens,and fish, and bees! There is a fasinating chapter on how the bees help feed the fish. The book is called the Integral urban house, by the farallones institute. And they rerotated there bath water to water somethings with. Hey jd or ken if you have read the book it would make a great artical! got my copy of the book on ebay. I live near berkley and one of these days I want to drive over and see if it is still there.

-- kathy h (ckhart55@earthlink.net), December 08, 2001.