Sometimes I feel like I am way out there in the cold. My approach to the present war situation seems to be a minority opinion. Then, I run into something like the link below and feel cheered up. Rep. Ron Paul made a presentation last week and he is saying just about everything I have been thinking. Wish there were more like him around.

Link

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

Answers

Gordon, I'm with you out there in the cold. I haven't been participating in Currants recently because I'm tired of the endless bitch-slapping of my political perspectives. It's just been too hostile here for me to want to visit most of the time. I prefer to spend my time elsewhere where I can get access to information that has more depth than t-shirt slogans.

One source I just discovered is The American Politics Journal, which has a fascinating collection of quotes.

I prefer to read the British paper The Guardian for political analysis and better journalism than I find in US sources.

While it is too filled with partisan sandbox bickering, the Capitol Grilling has a lot of access to timely information too.

Be well, stay grounded and heart-centered.

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

what is currants?

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

Thanks, Firemouse, I needed that. And thanks for the links too!

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

I LOVE Ron Paul! He is a singular voice of reson, sanity and Constitutionality in a world gone socio, psychopath police state. Glad to see some more folks reading him!

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

I'm sorry you feel as if you've been "bitch-slapped," FM, because I've always enjoyed your wit and insight. I assure you anything I've posted was not intended to "bitch-slap" anyone. It's no secret that the political emphasis of this forum is conservative, although not nearly as extreme as some forums, so it's a bit mystifying when people complain about it.

I came to my political perspective via a long route, beginning with a father who was a Labour councilman. The first thing I read at home was the Labor Party platform for that year. In my adult years, I worked in community action programs for a long time--very non-conservative. My last stint of volunteer community service was with the local Food Coop, which I quit about six years ago. It's only relatively recently that I've acquired a conservative tinge and I still have what can best be described as liberal tendencies. Since I've never been a rubber-stamper I opine that your remark about the forum's content having the depth of T-shirt slogans is in itself about as deep as a T-shirt slogan.

The Guardian has been a leftist newspaper, more so than the New York Times, for as long as I've been reading it, which is about forty years or so. The journalistic expertise you perceive it has is matched, if not exceeded, by the Telegraph, Economist, and Financial Times, among others. The London Times is no longer to be trusted but sometimes comes up with a pearl. The BBC is a bit suspect also these days. But you know that from your time in England.

You might also like the Irish Times and Irish Independent. Le Monde is also a good source, although only if you understand French--the International Herald-Tribune will do; it's published in Paris but has an English language version. Der Spiegel unfortunately has no English version. Russia has, of course, Pravda (but no longer Taas) in an English version and the St. Petersburg Times is of interest.

The Iraq News Agency (INA) is heavily propagandistic but still worth a look to see what Saddam is thinking. There are several English-language Indian newspapers--the Times of India and Hindustan Times are good ones. Pakistan also has several good newspapers too--you might like the Pakistan Observer.

There are many other newspapers available from all over the world--it would be a shame to limit reading of overseas newspapers just to The Guardian. And Al Jazeera will have an English version on-line shortly, I hear.

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

From the American Politics Journal recommended above by Firemouse:

The Big, Big Boycott List!

American Politics Journal calls for the boycott of ALL sponsors who ponied up cash for the "Un-auguration" of the Usurping Pretender presently occupying the Oval Office, Ex-Governor George W. Loserman Bush -- until such time as he and all his handlers are voted out of or removed from office

Link

-- Anonymous, November 02, 2001

While the general feeling here is that Bush won the election, fair and square, that sentiment is not shared by a considerable segment of the population. I should think the point would be to examine what happened and accept the dirty laundry that surfaces. Our last presidential election was the most embarrassing example of failed voting I have ever witnessed in a national US election. It should have been revoted and let the chips fall where they may. Anyone who stood in the way of an honest revote is merely supporting anarchy in my opinion. Politics should not be a tainted or dishonest game, and anytime we contribute to it becoming sordid we undermine our liberty.

-- Anonymous, November 03, 2001

My posting of the excerpt was more to point up the irony of its immature and childish phraseology than it was to disagree with its content. I am equally disdainful of similar conservative descriptors; however, Firemouse had bemoaned the "T-shirt slogan" content of this forum. . .

-- Anonymous, November 03, 2001

Gordon, if anyone in this country is still bemoaning a re-vote, they are not the ones that need to be voting in the first place.

There was no way that a re-vote would be done. None. Nada. Zip. forget it.

The verification system Florida had forchecking votes was up to the individual commissions, and no one else. All the legal wranglings were attempts to override the process that Florida had in place.

There were some commission members who, having never had to deal with it before, did not understand the procedures. But, after we all looked at the laws, and I know I posted most all of them at Currents EZ, we [I thought] knew this was so.

SCOTUS ended it because the continued debate of the election was jepoardizing the country.

The election is over, for good or bad. Each recount has indicated that George won.

-- Anonymous, November 03, 2001

Barefoot, I agree the election is over and it will not be revoted now. And while Florida took the brunt of the criticism there were numerous other states that were equally questionable. The point is that the election process broke down badly and was not corrected for the good of all. Any voting system that introduces errors by the very nature of the way it is constructed is not a valid indicator of the will of the people. You remember that statement, Of the people, By the People, For the People. Unless the electoral process is actually furthering such a principle the results are a sham.

I realize how hard it is to see our own candidate defeated in any election, anywhere. Still, if there is evidence that voters were denied their vote, even due to their own unintended errors, their inability to follow the instructions, stupidity, whatever, then we don't have a valid election result. You say the recount continues to support Bush, but does it really? What happened to that major media look into the ballots and related voting rules? They were ready to release their findings just after Sept 11th and have now witheld the report indefinitely. Why? How would validating Bush hurt anything now? Conversely, would casting doubt on his victory be a very bad omen for the country at this moment? Aren't you suspicious of this?

Personally I think the report will get leaked and it will forever leave us wondering who really won. So far, after following that matter in great detail, I don't think that Bush can be considered the winner without doubt. And if there is doubt there will be upset and anger from the other side. I voted for Bush, as I have said previously, but I truly doubt he won it. I seriously suspect that a revote would have put Gore in the driver's seat.

-- Anonymous, November 03, 2001

Gordon, one of the reasons we'll never know who "truly" won is that so many absentee ballots were never counted.

I think what I found especially silly about the fuss about individual votes in this past election is that, for all extents and purposes, we had a tied vote. A few either way may be a technical way to break a deadlock, useful for logistical purposes, but it's not like either candidate ended up with a mandate.

-- Anonymous, November 03, 2001

Firemouse, I wasn't aware there was any "bitch-slapping" going on on this forum, sorry to hear that. I thought we were making an effort to be courteous to each other, no matter what point of view.

-- Anonymous, November 03, 2001