What do you think when you see a minister with a luxurious lifestyle. I am not talking about simply being rich. You can be rich and still drive a Ford Fiesta because you choose to. I am talking about those who wear Rolex watches, drive Mercedes, and live in expensive houses full of expensive things. Only a small minority of ministers are able to live luxuriously and some who could choose not to.

On one side people will say it is a poor witness. Money that could have been better spent on Gods work. The other side says they should be able to enjoy God's blessings like anyone else. Also some of the items are gifts from people appreciative of there ministry. I can see both sides and can not make up my mind. What about lay people with luxurious lifestyles?

In Christ, Nathan Paujo

-- Anonymous, May 19, 2001

Answers

Rather than being constantly called upon to take sides in issues that are not necessarily Black and White, I'd rather look toward the ministry and see its fruits. There are some ministers who indulge at the expense of the flock. There are others who reaping temporal rewards and expressions. But what are the fruits? Is their ministry producing love, true kingdom growth, holiness, and relationships among the sheep with the savior? Or is their megachurch a revolving door - 300 joining this sunday, 12 leaving at the same time?

By their fruits shall you know them.

-- Anonymous, May 19, 2001

God is the only one who is the ultimate judge. And he knows the hearts and minds of all his children. Let's keep our eyes on Jesus Christ and ask him how we can best serve God. Christ calls us to love one another. Not to Judge one another.

-- Anonymous, May 19, 2001

I must agree with both of the above statements. I came from a church where a vast majority of the pastors had very lavish homes and cars. This was in part because the people felt that the pastor should represent the best of the community in all aspects living from the home to other things. Today there are megachurches that have the ability to pay their pastors competitive salaries and then there are those preachers of the prosperity message who just live off the money of the people. I believe all pastors should be blessed by their congregations and should have nice things, but I cannot see how they would go to great lengths to display such luxury. For example one doesn't need a Rolex watch to prove one is prospering nor does one need a million dollar home to prove that one is blessed. I believe that our connection is one of few Black denominations that provides both housing and salary for our ministers. Many use Psalms 35:27b to support their lavish lifestyle. It states: let them continually say "The Lord be magnified who takes pleasure in the prosperity of his servants." That passage actually deals with the vindication of David from his enemies and David's prosperity as king and God's servant. This doesn't mean of course that God doesn't want us to havenice things, but not at the expense at causing someone to stumble in the faith or never to come to the faith because they believe the preacher or the congregation is greedy.

-- Anonymous, May 20, 2001

I must agree with both of the above statements. I came from a church where a vast majority of the pastors had very lavish homes and cars. This was in part because the people felt that the pastor should represent the best of the community in all aspects living from the home to other things. Today there are megachurches that have the ability to pay their pastors competitive salaries and then there are those preachers of the prosperity message who just live off the money of the people. I believe all pastors should be blessed by their congregations and should have nice things, but I cannot see how they would go to great lengths to display such luxury. For example one doesn't need a Rolex watch to prove one is prospering nor does one need a million dollar home to prove that one is blessed. I believe that our connection is one of few Black denominations that provides both housing and salary for our ministers. Many use Psalms 35:27b to support their lavish lifestyle. It states: let them continually say "The Lord be magnified who takes pleasure in the prosperity of his servants." That passage actually deals with the vindication of David from his enemies and David's prosperity as king and God's servant. This doesn't mean of course that God doesn't want us to havenice things, but not at the expense at causing someone to stumble in the faith or never to come to the faith because they believe the preacher or the congregation is greedy. My last point is that for too long of a time it has been that the laymen have been allowed to accumulate massive wealth yet it is somewhat taboo when the minister does the same thing legally and with God's approval. That separation perhaps should be abolished within our church.

-- Anonymous, May 20, 2001

Interesting comments. In my twenty plus years in the ministry, I have never been provided with a parsonage. In fact, my churches have never been able to provide a living wage. Yet God has provided. Some might say I live a life of luxury, two new cars (Eldorado, Nissan Maxima), house worth more than $150K, wife owns mink coat, but we worked hard, give above the tithe. {A member of my congregation did say my wife ought not to wear mink, and I told her . . . she colud wear whatever I could afford.] But we have also been poor, lived in the projects at one time but never accepted welfare or food stamps. God has blessed. We realize it could all change in an instant. However, one's lifestyle or material worth is not evidence of God's blessings. We were blessed living in the projects waiting for the next payday too. A pastor must be economically consistant with the parish. The church should see to it that the pastor is paid proportional to the work and its ability to pay. "The ox that treads out the grain should not be muzzled". That's how God feels about it. In other words, pay your pastor in proportion to his/her work. What they do with the salary after thier gifts to the church is their business.

God Bless

Pastor Paris

-- Anonymous, May 20, 2001

AMEN...the money could better serve the community. What does the bible say about luxurious lifestyles?

-- Anonymous, May 21, 2001

What did Judas say about the costly perfume? Jesus said that the poor would be with us always. I think he meant that singular efforts however wellmeaning would not eliminate poor but a corporate (the church) would be the vehicle to combat the problem.

We are not called to a life of poverty.

Pastor Paris

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2001

Great teachers are called to a life of service...

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

Two things I ask of you, O Lord; do not refuse me before I die: Keep falsehood and lies far from me; give me neither poverty nor riches, but give me only my daily bread. Otherwise, I may have too much and disown you and say, "Who is the Lord?" Or I may become poor and steal, and so dishonor the name of my God. Proverbs 30:7-9

If Jesus serves as our example, then we are not to be concerned with worldly possessions. Was it not Jesus who said it is easier for a camel to fit through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter into the kingdom of heaven. (Luke 18:18-29).

Matthew 6:19-33 states that we should not sure up for ourselves treasures on earth where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also. Do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more important than food, and the body more important than clothes? Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them.

In Matthew 10:5-10 Jesus instructs His disciples not to take along any gold or silver or copper in your belts; take no bag for the journey, or extra tunic, or sandals or a staff; for the worker is worth his keep.

Jesus, the Son of God, walked this earth as a lowly carpenter to spread the love of God to all people (rich and poor). How right can it be for His servants to spread the Gospel from a luxurious lifestyle? How would the heart of the message in the Beatitudes reach people if it were being delivered by a gold sporting, Versace wearing minister, driving a Porsche living in an opulent part of town?

Jesus ministry should stand first. Nothing should separate any pastor from ministering to God's people. When a lifestyle diverts a pastor's love of God from God to the love of his worldly possessions that is when the problem occurs.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

Say Amen Somebody!

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

The Bibles teaches us to be temperant in all things. In fact one of the virtues of the "Fruit of the Spirit" is temperace. It goes on to say against such (temperance) there is no law.

It would be insulting for a preacher to go out to minister to the lowly wearing their gold and diamonds and driving a porsh; unless of course he is taking along with his spreading of the gosple substance (money) to help. Jesus said in so many words, that if a man is hungry you can't tell him anything about the kingdom of God. But to feed him first. The miricle of feeding the 5000 with 5 fishes and two loaves of bread came about because the Bible says Jesus was moved with compassion.

I do however believe Jesus understood about having nice things and during his humble life here on earth was privy to nice things. They were given to him. As a youth, the gifts from the wise men were very costly; Mary who annointed his feet, did so with precious costly perfume; The feast at the last supper was served with elegance. He sent his disciples to go into the city and everything needed for the meal would be supplied; The upper room of John Mark's mother's house was not a shack. My point is Jesus had everything he needed. Even his burial, Although he only needed it for a few days, a wealthy man loaned it. We have a poor mentality of Jesus. He was poor in spirit as far as humility, but God provided through others everything he needed.

His friends Lazarous, Mary and Martha were not poor people. Lydia (the seller of purple) was a wealthy lady. She opened her home to Paul on his 2nd Missionary Journey.

It is about what we are will to do with our gain. Would will be willing to sell all if the ministry called for us to do so? That's where the sin comes in.

The Bible does say it would be easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to enter heaven. Why? Because that camel has to be stooped, be stripped of all of his baggage and then enter. How easy will it be for man to humble themselves and strip himself of his worldly posessions to go about kingdom work.

Yes God wants us to have, and He is even more pleased when we are temperant with our substance. There has to be a balance.

In Christ, Carmen

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2001

Hmmmmm.......Mary's last comment indeed warrants an "AMEN". I don't think anyone desiring to serve humanity and spread the redemptive message of love and reconcilliation wishes to indulge in ostentatious lifestyles [Rev. Ike, notwithstanding] The Decalouge teaches that to covet material possessions is sinful. Paul stated his maturity in Christ taught him to be content. Contentment is the antithesis to accumulation. Contentment signals satisfaction. Accumulation signals insatiable wants. The former attracts folk to the Gospel whereas the latter repels potential converts. QED

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2001

Do the same rules apply for layperson as well as preacher. I do not think there should be to much difference between the two. The goal of the Christian is to live 100% for Jesus whether clergy or laity. I can not think of why there should be any difference except for a few minor rules. Mostly the qualifications Paul laid out for elders. Should ANY saved person live luxuriously.

In Christ, Nathan Paujo

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2001

As long as you live within your means, it is perfectly all right. Wealth in itself is not sinful. The Bible teaches that the LOVE of money (material things) is the root of all evil. Money is just a counting system. Take the case of the widow with only one penny: If she had withheld that for the wrong reasons, it would have been wrong. If she had given for the wrong reasons, it would have been wrong. Our motives that govern our actions (where our heart is) is far more destructive/constructive than our actions. Jesus taught that the desire to do wrong was as bad as the action itself. I don't beleive God has called anyone to a life of poverty, notwithstanding some religious orders that take vows of poverty. However, if one takes such a vow, fully convinced that that is what is right for them, they are obligated to keep it. The do not however have the authority to judge those who have wealth and choose to enjoy all that comes with it. That is not to say that one should use their resources to "lord" it over others. It is only necessary to have one nickel more than someone else to be guilty of that.

Blessings, Pastor Paris

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2001

I believe that when preachers get caught up by the world's standards of plastic success, they create ministries in which 1. enthusiasm is more important than substance 2. style is more important than content 3. Dress is more than virtue 4. And what we drive is more important than where we're going.

For what is a man profited if he shall gain the whole world and lose his own soul?...Seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness.

-- Anonymous, May 29, 2001

To be rich and/or comfortable does not mean that one is "caught up" in the world standards. Jesu said it is hard, not impossible, for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. The world is full of people who have riches that are much closer to the kingdom standard than others who are so pious with their words but do not do the things of God. Jesus said something about that too.

Blessings

Pastor Paris

-- Anonymous, May 29, 2001

I am tired of hearing pastors try to rationalize/justify the pursuit of wealth. I go to a church where the pastor is a multi-millionaire (fellowship church in Dallas) and it just makes me sick to see how he gilts people into giving their money to church while he goes off and uses the money to live a life of luxury!! Non-christians see right through this and want no part of it!! I think if Jesus was here today He would drive most of them out of the church with a rope, like he did in the Gospel when people tried to use His Father's House as a place to make money for themselves. The only time Jesus got angry (we know about) which resulting in Him inflicting physical pain on others was when they were using a place of worship for their own benefit vs. the service of the Lord. I think a pastor should get paid the avg. family income of the city he/she lives in. And if he is really good (mega church), pay up to 2x plus the use of a house while serving the church............this is quite a comfortable living given the fact the house is free and salary is tax free. The avg. family would have to make 6x pastor salary in order to live the same lifestyle, after paying tax and house payment! Any pastor that wants beyond that should leave the ministry because I do not see how his heart can be in the right position to serve God and his congregation!

-- Anonymous, November 25, 2002