it turned out to be 11 times in five weeks, four vets, lots of money on wormers. I kept going back to vets and they would say worm overload, give me another expensive wormer and I would fence in a new pasture. Clean everything in site with out any inprovements. Finally I started studing all the wormers and the vets were selling me cousins of each other. I went into a new class, Tramisol and guess what one time worming took care of the problem. I am angry for my entire summer being wasted with this problem, and the sheep losing alot of condition and time. Breeding is coming up and I don't feel the ram will be ready enough. Lesson to be learn, teach yourself and be your own vet, not all vets care about sheep or goats.

-- Debbie Wolcott (bwolcott@cwis.net), August 10, 2000

Answers

Hi Debbie,

It was nice to see you on the sight. Sorry you had to go through all the hassle. Glad to hear the Tramisol took care of it. We always rotated between Tramisol and Valbazan or Panacur and recently started incorporating Ivomec as it takes care of external parasites too. Hope you and your family are enjoying your new place and farming venture! Blessings to you!

Amy in Nora

-- Amy Dorsch (mstydale@aeroinc.net), August 10, 2000.

Tramisol (which isn't recommended for goats) is related to Safeguard, Panacur, Valbazen, Synathic, Levamisole they are all bensazoles so if you are switching amongst these it is not a true rotation. You would have to use Ivermectin, Dectomax, Cydectin etc. A good vet is worth their weight in gold in your management, switching from one vet to another would just confuse the matter more, since I have found that local vets are very competetive. Fecal sample before worming, worm, use a probiotic product to protect the rumen flora, refecal 7 to 10 days later to see if that product and that dose worked for you, with sheep you really out to use pipevet.com Pipestone Vets have a great catalog and great info Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), August 11, 2000.

Hello Vicky, I was working with one vet office that has four vets in. The only vet office actually in a 30 mile range. I had called Pipestone who told me Tramisol was not related to Panacur, Safeguard & Valbazen which were three wormers not getting to the worms. I also had used Ivomectin two to three times without success. Tramisol worked. Now I am confused if tramisol is related to panacur. I also talked to Pipestone Vet not Tech and had been for the whole time. They were quite confused but with their help saved the lifes of two the the sheep a young ram and an older ewe. I then called a few Universities plus reading Maryland Universities sites which is extensive on the subject. I will have to reread because I believe they say their is three classes of wormers and tramisol was one in its own. But I could be wrong and in which case who knows why it was the only wormer that worked. I also read that Ivomectin didn't have parasite immunity yet, but it didn't work for me and I used more than the weight allowed for the sheep. With the panacur,safeguard,valbazen I did three times the amount allowed for weight(per vet advice) and it didn't get the parasites. These sheep had been on fresh ground, rotated pastures without animals on it before so maybe it won't happen again but I am nervous. Thank you for your response, it will make me study further on the subject. Debbie

-- Debra Wolcott (bwolcott@cwis.net), August 11, 2000.

We always take a fecal before worming. Without one you simply dont know which parasite you are dealing with. Wormers usually work on the parasites they are intended for. None will kill them all. im so glad the Tramisol worked. Dont be too hard on your vet although he/she probably should have ased for a fecal. Fecals are sure a lot cheaper than wormers that dont work or cause too many side effects. Good luck

-- Susie Stretton (nightsong@beci.net), August 12, 2000.

I was using fecals. Being charged 5 bucks each, some days I would bring four in at a time. I have a microscope and a professor out of Ok. State. Univ., is going to teach me on how to identify each parasite. I have ordered an out of print book stricking on the subject also. Pipestone isn't thrilled with tramisol because it is not a broad sprectum wormer, but apparently our parasites are immune to what I was using. I intend on using it again in other week, take another fecal and see where I am at before rotation of wormers again. I wan't to get these sheep pregnant in Sept. but the ram need more weight so I will wait until Oct. Thanks, Debbie

-- Debbie Wolcott (bwolcott@cwis.net), August 13, 2000.

Debbie, also visit saanendoah.com they have excellent photo's of what you are looking for and basic information. Don't go buying an expenisve microscope, all that is needed is a basic one with its own light source, no reflectors. I picked mine up at a Pawn Shop hear a teaching hospital, though others use the one from Toys are us and it comes with everything but the McMasters slide! And it was under 50 $! Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), August 13, 2000.