#5 most popular in lusenet,it has over 10,000 posts in it,I just checked the most active list.

-- Anonymous, May 22, 2000

Answers

Yes, I know. Although, Xeney is quickly closing in on me. In the future, you can use e-mail to send me a quick message like this one.

But since this thread has already been created, let's change it into the "move the forum up to number 4" if you want. just post your asses off on whatever thing you'd like to contribute.

(see, if this was xeney, i'd do something provocative and clever like change it to a thread about menstruation, but it's late and i'm not thinking so cleverly.)

-- Anonymous, May 22, 2000

You could change it to, "How did you discover masturbation," since Xeney pretty much already covered the "how often and how" end of the activity.

-- Anonymous, May 22, 2000

How did I discover masturbation? On god, that would require me to think back to around 1987 or 1988. I don't think I can remember that far back. No, sorry. I can remember discovering it about that time, but how I did so is a blank

-- Anonymous, May 22, 2000

You want to drive up the posts for the forum, huh? Well, I'm here to help.

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? I say it's murder but that the state shouldn't legislate it.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? I say it's helpful to minorities, as long as it's not a straight quota system.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. I was a freak and didn't figure out how it all worked until my first lover showed me. Then I was all like, "OH! That's what that's for!"

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics?

Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society? I say the latter.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw?

That should about do it, I think.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Jan stirred the pot with:

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay?

I think it should be legal, but I wouldn't say, "Yay abortion!" It's a choice out of three, I'd like it to stay that way.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay?

Personally, I'd be pissed if I got a job based on anything but my qualifications and skills, but I can also see the benefit to affirmative action laws. I'm wobbly on this one.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned.

Uhhhhhh. . . A particularly well place stream of water in the bathtub awakened me. And that's all I'm saying.

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics?

I dig Catholicism, but I don't have the faith or the politics necessary to be a Catholic. I think it would be nice to believe in something, though.

Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society?

The latter, but Andrea Dworkin is doing her best to make people believe it's the former.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw?

All kinds of fun to give. Just keep your hands off the back of my head. I know what I'm doing.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Best way to boost your numbers: start a nasty gossip-y thread about "the journalling community."

Nope. Not gonna do it myself. No way.

I'd much rather talk about ebay and comedy and The Trouble With Men. :)

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay?

~~~Keep it Legal

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? ~~~Does more harm than good, in the long run.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. ~~~A Long Time ago, in a galaxy far, far away

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics? ~~~~I was raised as one, and I still can't answer this. Topic #5: Feminists. ~~~As long as they quit harassing me, I don't care.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw?

~~~~Fun, fun, fun.

To add a question: Spit or Swallow?

Teehee.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

um..... let's go by the numbers:

1) I can't quite figure out why this is still a topic for debate. Roe v. Wade was decades ago. The decision was made. Case closed.

2) Affirmative Action was created to provide a stepping stone to boost minorities through a barrier that had been created against them. When the barriers are gone, so should the policy.

3) Masturbation. This is not a yay or nay topic is it? If so.. Yay.

4) Wasn't it the Dead Milk Men that said "Catholic School Girls Rule"? Have you heard of.... what do they call it? Perpetual Adoration? Where they have someone in the church praying 24-7. A friend here at work does it sometimes and will go up to the church at 3:00 am to pray her 30 minute "shift". Funny stuff.

5) Blow-Jobs. Yes, I find them sexually satisfying. Yay!

For the write in #6 about spit or swallow. You forgot about "shoot". Guys prefer the swallow, but not if it makes you throw up all over them.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

OK, so here's my question: why the heck do guys prefer the "swallow"? Why is it supposedly so much sexier? (For the record, my SO says he doesn't care one way or the other.)

And as for abortion, it's still a debate because some people think it's murder and some people think it's not. FYI.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

One of my favorite stories......

I was drinking with a bunch of my brother's friends one night and they got on the subject of masturbation. They all started teasing this one kid Zac who claimed, and still claims I believe, that he had never masturbated. They were teasing him and basically telling him they didn't believe him.

My brother's friend Chris, who I adore, said, "look Zac, I just don't believe you, because even if I HAD NEVER masturbated, and then found out I could, I WOULD, like the second I found out about it".

I still love that.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

I'm not really sure why it is considered sexier, and sometimes, it is not. It is kind of like when you get out the leather and chains... or is that just me? It is not something that you do everytime, just sometimes when you are having mad, jungle sex. During the soft, tender times, the swallow is not necessary.

And murder is illegal. Abortion is not. Whether or not you agree, it is the law. That is really all there is to it. For me, I can't help looking at it from a slightly different scenario. The world is overpopulated, and the US passes a new law that says 2 kids, max! Anything after that, you have to abort. The law is strictly enforced, and someone else limits your freedom to choose the path your life is to take. How bad would that suck? Essentially, passing any legislation that forbids abortion does just that. It takes away your right to choose and places it in the hands of someone else. Scared of that!

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Spit or swallow--- I just think that spitting is terribly rude. "Ew! I don't want to put it in my mouth!" You knew what you were getting into, there, is all I'm saying. That and if you want the favor returned, there's really no "spitting" option, if you know what I'm saying. So suck it up and deal. Sex is messy. That's what makes it fun.

I'm so glad my parents don't really understand the forum.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Ditto with Pamie on the swallowing. But every once in a great while it should be okay to run to the sink and spit if you are about to die of choking because it hit you straight in the back of the throat!

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

You know, if you very gently cup the testicles, you can feel them draw up right before orgasm. Then all you have to do is flatten the back of your tongue against the back of your throat to keep from choking when the deluge hits.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

I cannot believe I just posted that.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Damn, that is hard core.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

If more people swallowed, there'd be less of a need for abortions. To birds, one stone, everybody happy.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

oh, jeff is going to hell for that one.

straight to hell.

(by the way, i'm truly enjoying this "Taboo Topics" thread)

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

*************************************

Boss: "So, WeepBoy, what did you accomplish today?"

WeepBoy: "Well, with the recent acquisition of our largest competitor, I think we need to develop a website to improve our customer relations."

Boss: "That's a great idea!"

WeepBoy: "Thanks! In fact, that is what I have been doing today. I think the first thing we need to do is get some ideas on what our target market finds appealing and has an interest in."

Boss: "Okay. And what did you learn?"

WeepBoy: "Well, apparently blow-jobs and abortion are hot topics for the youth of America."

Boss: "I knew I shouldn't have bought you that fucking computer"

******************************************

Hahahhahahaahha.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

um. some people are allergic. i'm just sayin.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Spoo allergies? That's just wrong on so many levels...

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

allergic?

really?

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

yeah. really. boy, was that a strange discovery to make.

-- Anonymous, May 23, 2000

Leigh Anne- polyeurethane condoms, non lubricated, like Avanti. Unlike latex, they genuinely have no flavor at all, as well as conducting body heat much more effectively. (And, they're stronger, so they're much less likely to tear.)

I foisted a bunch on my guy friends and told them to go forth and not be fruitful (out of sheer curiosity,) and report back to me on whether they liked them more, less or the same as latex. All but one of them switched immediately, for good.

(The longer this thread goes on, the worse I sound. . . )

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

umm I haven't seen the polyeurethane condoms for a while, but last I did they weren't approved (in the US) by all the health places/commissions/whatever that latex ones were. I think for prevention of stds. is that diffrerent now?

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

oh, i probably should've kept my mouth shut. but if it's for driving pamie's ratings up, i'm in. how shall i put this delicately?

thanks for the tip about the polyurethane, but my husband and i handle the unfortunate situation with the third option someone mentioned above. it's better than me becoming violently ill, after all. that would just ruin the mood altogether. (i'm speaking from experience on that one.)

and it's not all that uncommon of an affliction, actually. i'm also allergic to caffeine, and i've only heard of two other people with that allergy. whereas with the spoo, i've heard (and read in cosmo!) about more.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

OK.. back to the questions from before... 1. Abortion.. I feel its a life that is being taken too soon.. there are way too many people out there that want children yet can't have them (i.e. conceive) to let a child go like that. I do think that if the mother is in some sort of danger by the pregnancy, it should be allowed.. and I don't like the idea that the government can decide... so I guess I don't have a firm decision. hmm

2. Affirmative Action... I would have to agree with an earlier post.. in so many words.. it was a good idea when it was needed, its not needed anymore.. let it go..

3. Masturbation.. if you don't know how to take care of yourself.. how do you expect anybody else to be able to. You have to know yourself & know what you like.. keep everybody happy.

4. Catholics.. crazy folks! The ones I know have these attitudes that they are better than everybody else. What they think is right.. is right.. and you are evil to disagree. I have problems with a lot of religions simply because they will tell you that any other religion is completey wrong.. HELLO.. I thought the idea was NOT to judge..

5. Feminists.. fight for your right girls..

6. Blow Jobs.. I can't say that I actually get a thrill out of doing it.. but making my man happy makes me happy. I've swallowed.. didn't like it, but I'd do it again. I actually prefer to use it as just a teaser to get things going.. I give you a little love.. you give me a little love.. then we give each other lots of love.. ok? :o)

I think I've said it all

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Poly condoms are indeed approved by the FDA to prevent pregnancy and the transmission of STDs. Lamb or sheepskin condoms, however, are only approved to prevent pregnancy. Then there's good old fashioned latex. . .

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Well, my personal experience with lambskin condoms is that they're more likely to fall off. Believe me, nothing is less sexy than lying there in the lovely afterglow of good sex and realizing, oops, my poor defenseless uterus is now under attack by billions of aggressive little sperm cells. Argh.

I've found that I'm slightly sensitive to either spermicide or polyurethane; I'm not sure which, but one of them makes me itch. Also non-sexy.

And regarding blowjobs, I'm with Pamie on this one. If you're goin' down there, you better know what to expect. I've never been able to figure out the whole spitting thing, anyway. Is it like, right afterward you just sort of turn your head to the side and hawk a big sperm loogie onto the floor? Do you hold it in your mouth, run into the bathroom, and spit into the sink? Or what? The whole scenario just seems really unappealing to me.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Two words - angel kisses.

More commonly known now, since the release of Clerks (or was it Mallrats) as snowballing.

Now that's fun.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay?
-Personally? Nay. For every other woman on the planet? Whatever works for you. Definitely pro-choice on this issue.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay?
I don't know. I lean toward "whoever is best for the job."

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned.
I figured out how to go about it, and that it felt good, in my early teens. I was finally successful and understood the word "orgasm" when I went away to college at 18.

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics?
Some of my best friends are Catholic.

Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society?
Feminsts Schmeminists. I'm a humanist.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw?
With the right person it is incredibly fun. I've never thought of it as gross and have never done anything but swallow. But, yes, it can be a big pain in the jaw. The pain, however, is worth it. Particularly when, as Pamie said, the favor is returned.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Um... 1 pro-choice, 2 no comment on affirmative action 3 proud owner of that electronic pink thing with the beaver people always point at at Forbidden Fruit and more of a porn collection than my boyfriend (research for my self- appointed Adult Industry Analyst title) 4 recovering Catholic 5 Lean more towards Naomi Wolf as far as Feminists go - Want to drown Andrea Dworkin in a shallow ejaculation pool 6 I'm with Pamie on this one - you get what you give. Not only that - it rocks me, too

Cheers!

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? I'm going to have to go nay on this one. Even without all the conflict between killing/not killing, etc., I've seen what parents go through to adopt and I think that's the best option for unwanted children.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? It sounds like a good idea, but never seems to work well.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. Started out with a massage wand on a pulled hamstring, and wow...

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics? There's something up with us?

Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society? Crazy women who want more than they can have.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw? I've never done it, but I'm seriously considering it. Suggestions?

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

What are Angel Kisses / Snowballing? I'm old and just not "hip" anymore.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

I don't know either, but was afraid to ask.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

A "snowball" is when he ejaculates into your mouth, and you kiss him and transfer the semen back into his mouth.

I learned this from student teaching, which is also where I learned the meaning of the term "tossing someone's salad."

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Erm, just to clarify that last post, I didn't actually DO either of those things with the students, I just overheard a lot of conversations. But you knew that, right?

Also, re feminism, I've heard that "humanist" thing before ("I'm not a feminist, I'm a humanist"), and my personal feeling is that it's ridiculous to hide behind semantics. If you're using "humanist" to mean the same thing as "feminist," you're a feminist. If not, then you're not. Also, I definitely believe that it's possible to identify yourself as a feminist and still 1) have a boyfriend/husband, 2) like men, and 3) shave your legs. Just in case there was any confusion.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

I dare somebody to ask what felching is.

(Wow, it's like high school all over again!)

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Hey Saundra, what's felching??

Huh huh huh huh huh huh. Heheh. Huh huh huh.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

You don't want to know what felching is. Trust me.

Pamie's right, if you go down there, you know what your getting into.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Felching:

1) Deposit semen in anal cavity during anal intercourse. 2) Remove semen from anal cavity with oral orifice. 3) (Optional) Deposit semen in partner's oral orifice.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

ha, im 15 and even I knew what that was. yucky.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

You kids today and your encyclopaedic knowledge of bizarre sexual practices. . .

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Yeah, polyurethane (I can't spell) condoms have now been approved for preventing STDs. That's fairly recent, though.

Now the questions ...

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? -- Yea. In fact, I'll go further than most of y'all went and say that I am actually pro abortion and not just pro choice. Too many people have babies that should have rethought the situation. Too many people have babies, period. And I'll buy that "but it's so hard to adopt!" argument when there are no more older, non-white, non-perfectly healthy kids growing up in foster care.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? -- Yea. I agree with whoever said to keep it around while it's needed and ditch it once it's not, except I'm not so sure it isn't needed anymore. I want some empirical evidence before I agree with that assessment.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. -- Uh, about age nine, I think I was just messin' around.

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics? -- I probably can't answer this question without indulging in hate speech, so I'll refrain. Some of my very good friends are Catholic. I know some lovely Catholics. I think the church itself is fucked up and responsible for a lot of what's wrong in the world ... and the fact that the church also does a lot of good doesn't really change my mind about that.

Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society? -- The latter.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw? -- Well, honestly, sometimes all of the above. They were a lot easier to give when I was messing around with 19 year old boys who came if you just looked at them funny. These days, man, sometimes my jaw feels like I'm going to be paralyzed for life. There are drawbacks to mature men, girls. Enjoy your youth.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Oh, jeez, I can't believe I posted that. Saundra, you're a bad influence.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

I am the chaos seed! I am the corruptor! Welcome to the gutter, Beth! :)

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

I'm with Jan on that lame "humanist" qualification. It bugs me when someone says that. If you're a humanist, you're a feminist. If you have to qualify, I prefer someone to say they're not a radical feminist. At least that makes a little more sense.

On to the questions:

1)Abortion-Should always be legal. But I think its rarely the best option for most situations.

2)Affirmative Action-I think it still serves a purpose, but I think we're getting somewhat closer to not needing it. 'Course, we don't need labor unions anymore either, but they don't seem to be going anywhere. (Teehee, I just added another controversial topic. I'm sneaky like that.)

3)Masterbation- what Amanda said: know thyself.

4)Catholics- Was one. Now I'm Unitarian Universalist, and love it. But, in some ways, once a Catholic always a Catholic. That's ok with me.

5)Blowjobs- Yep, if you're gonna do it, follow through with it. I love giving them. In my early 20's, I used to do that run to the sink and spit thing. But now, well, its all good.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Personally I think the word "feminist" is rather limiting.

I think there are far too many gender related issues to claim "feminism." I believe everyone is entitled to equal rights regardless of sex. This includes (but is not limited to) men, women, androgynous, transgendered and homosexuals.

I support everyone's rights to equality.

-- Anonymous, May 24, 2000

Affirmative action: somebody said it best, but I forget who - once the barriers are down, so should this law be.

Abortion: I hate to bring it up, but for those who feel that it should only be allowed when the mother needs it medically or for cases of rape/incest... who decides that? Doctors? Lawyers? Courts? Then it goes right back to where it was before Roe v. Wade - rich girls go in pregnant, get a "D & C" and come out not-pregnant, while poor girls have a kid who they can't support anyway.

And as far as churches go.. I'm trying to find the one that best fits what I already believe and feel - does anybody know where I can find a website or book or some other resource that will let me compare different religions? ie: sort of a pro and con type list. email me at mildew@dork.com if you do... thanks.

Blow jobs - definately going to swallow. And I have felt that damn jaw pain.. sometimes you just gotta (no pun intended) suck it up and focus on the fact that your s.o. is moaning his freaking head off and deal. :)

Knowing the gross sexual terms may seem wrong now, but they will allow you to have some really fun conversations right in front of people who don't know (ie: parents, uninformed friends, etc)

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Beth, I wouldn't have answered better, and I am definitely sure now that I agree with you (in general) whatever you say. ;-)

And Julie, what is this story 'bout not needing labor Unions anymore? More than sneaky, sounds scary to me...
Hey, all of you, thanks for the new words [& the ideas as well]!
Pamie, I'm sure you'll make it to #4 :-). Let's keep going.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

ok, I'll stop here and go revise my Html tags before i come back. I swear.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

re: feminism

But it really bugs me when people say, "But you're not a feminist."

Anyone who knows me knows that I cannot stand girl-bashing. I may cook dinner for my boyfriend, but he does it for me, too. And I kill some of the bugs around here. I've changed my own tire. I don't like being referred to as "honey" at work. I've taken shit for sticking up for women, and I cannot stand it when a woman says that "a feminist" reminds them of "hairy armpit women." wasn't that sarah michelle gellar? I think that's why i never bothered watching buffy.

I can't stand the girl-bashing-girl stuff, either. Lowering another woman for her success (jeff, my hatred of andi macdowell isn't because of her womanhood, it's more about her ruining films i would have liked with her monotone drawl, so shh).

I was raised to be pro-everyone. My parents were good enough to raise me without me even knowing about their prejudices. When I got old enough to figure them out, I was genuinely shocked to hear about them.

re: condoms

you're probably allergic to the spermicidal lubricant. i'm just sayin'. woah. crazy itchy. sux. I didn't even know at first. I thought that was a part of having sex. Thank God my school's gyno was like, "Uh, no. You shouldn't be in pain and itchy every time you have sex. Use these condoms. And take this pill. Damn."

i hope all of my family and eric's family doesn't read that. oh, hell. whatever. I have sex. There. It's out for all to see.

What am I, twelve? Geez.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Okay, I hate to be anal about this...(HA), but technically (if slang can be technical) felching is a catch-all word used when describing anything being inserted into the anus (and generally being expelled as well..preferrably not at the emergency room with x-ray proof). It can be used to describe rimming, all the way to a Richard Gere special; hamster lovin'. By the way, No personal experience was used in the acquisition of this knowledge. Just an uncanny talent for remembering useless data.
Geez, where were all you enthusiastic swallowers when I was actually available? As it stands, I like to give more than I like to receive. Did I say like?..I meant LOVE! Definitely my favorite thing in the world to do. How can a guy not want to do this and do it right? Not something I will ever understand.
uhhh..I think I've said quite enough.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

I've managed to stay out of this thread until now, but, Lee..."Hamster lovin'"? Does that mean what I think it means? Because, ew.

And ditto on what Beth said earlier about drawbacks to mature men (sore jaws, oof). That being said, for other, um, activities, there's a lot to be said for the ability to last and last and last...

I can't believe I've written this. Thank God my mom doesn't read on- line journals. You people are a bad, bad influence.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

I have got to agree with Lee on this one. For some reason this forum is full of swallowers, but almost all of my friends irl say they could never do it without gagging. Maybe this is the profile of a Pamie follower? Her target market consist of swallowers that know the technical definition of felching, know all the words to "Blame it on the Rain", and are scared to tears of small plastic dolls.

What a demographic!

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

GYEAGH! The hampster thing is an Urban Legend. Nobody, anywhere, has ever come forth with proof that it's ever happened, ever! There are no x-rays, there are no butt-hampsters in jars, it's NOT TRUE! It wasn't true when the legend had it that it was a gerbil, it's not true now that it's a hampster.

But, if you're actually interested in some of the weird crap people have put in their butts, check out The Rectal Foreign Bodies Page.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

And, you know, now that Lee's mentioned it. . .

How come all the guys who allegedly just looooove cunnilingus exist mainly in written form, on the Internet? I've known a few guys in my time who enjoyed it, but the overwhelming majority didn't like it, considered it a chore, and had no interest in getting better at it. They ran an article in Salon a couple weeks ago with some guy complaining that chicks just won't let him eat at the Y, but I have never met those women in my life.

So enough about blow jobs! Where's the clit love!?

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Saundra:

I promise you, us "clit love" guys really are out here. Sex is just sex, but oral sex (both ways) is a little slice 'o heaven!

And was I the only one that noticed the hit counter on the "buttpage"? Over 30 million hits!

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Um.. regarding spit or swallow. Usually swallow, but if not, uh one can just let it sorta hit the roof of one's mouth/back of one's tongue without going down the throat, and let gravity work in your favour so it flows back out, around his uh bidness. Chances are he won't mind more wetness around him. And the timing is better than waiting for it all to be over and then going ptui.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Saundra, I actually met a woman who once told me she did not enjoy receiving oral sex, no matter how many guys had tried it on her. I was completely amazed and thought she was a very pitiful creature. I tend to suspect she's not had all that many tries at it, because how can anyone say that?? And there are good men out there who like to satisfy a woman. Keep looking til you find one, and then train him to your preferences. We're all different.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Some women don't enjoy oral sex (on the receiving end) because they've been taught that women are "dirty" and "smelly" down there (see all those damn commercials about "freshness"). They can't believe a man would enjoy it and are embarrassed by their own bodies.

In my experience, most men are delighted to give oral sex. I have only once had a man refuse to go down on me, although he wanted me to do him - needless to say, that relationship didn't last.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

One more post..then I have GOT to go to bed. Disturbing content ahead. Parental advisory.
Okay, I will fess up and hope the consequences of my loose tongue here do not catch up with me nor send me straight to hell. I work..at a very strange place. Lots of freaks. One very nice lady in particular is a mega-freak...spelled F.R.E.A.K. Okay? She has pictures. Her hamster. Her ass(with distinguishing marks). A clear plastic tube with said hamster...going towards the night. She knew it was probably a mistake to show even me, with my pretty open mind, when I was unable to hide the horror on my face. Granted, I was not 'there'. Can not prove actual felch status thusly. So..uhmm..there You have it. I can't imagine anyone actually making this up about themselves; especially her. So..judge it as You will. I found out that I do seem to have limits to my open mind after all. That said, I have never seen any proof, other than that tidbit, of this particular kink. Just used as a flippant example of felching. A bad example. Moving right along.
I believe You Saundra (god, I hope I spelled that right..apologies if I didn't) when You say that You have met very few men that like cunnilingus. As I said, it boggles my mind. But I can assure You that some exist. (pardon, while I cringe at my own inability to type this without it sounding like ..pretension) I, for one, have to be told to stop when it just gets to be too much for my wife. And before the wife it was the same. I have to be pulled off. I can think of nothing better in the world than giving a woman however many varied/multiple/g-spot orgasms she would wish to have. Nothing.
I hope beyond hope that this whole post does not sound as bad as I think it does. I am not even going to go back and proof read it or I am sure I will erase it. SO excuse the spelling errors. And please forgive if I have offended anyones sensibilities. Saundra? You ROCK..freak on. 8^D

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

I swear to god You people are a bad influence on me. And those people I work with?..BAD..very bad influence. I am innocent..really. *sigh*

Oh..and I should take this opportunity to point out that there seems to be another Lee that posts here, and he is probably pissing down his leg right now. I am sorry man. Hope You aren't getting any fruits or vegetables lobbed in your direction.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

uh, Lee, YOU rock.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Pamie wrote: If this was xeney, i'd do something provocative...

Well, you could always start freaking out about everything I say, that generates a lot of posts. But you've probably got better things to do... that's really doing it the hard way, isn't it?

Okay, just to get back on topic, here's a relevant dirty picture.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Oh, shut up, Dave.

Re: women and cunnilingus -- here is my pet peeve. Whenever a woman just doesn't happen to get off on something, it's because of her puritanical upbringing. I've known men who couldn't stand to have their balls touched because they were super ticklish. I've known men who could only take oral sex performed in very particular ways, because they were really sensitive. I've known men who liked having their nipples sucked, and men who did not.

Not one of them ever blamed their preferences on a puritanical upbringing. And neither did I.

Oral sex is a really good thing. It is not the be all and end all of my life, and in fact, it tends to be too ... how shall I put this ... delicate? I'm kind of ticklish. I am easily sent into sensory overload. Generally speaking, I'd rather skip it and do something else.

And that has fuck-all to do with my puritanical upbringing, because I didn't have one.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Oh, and Pamie -- yes, Sarah Michelle Geller said some stupid thing like that about feminism a while back. She's a moron. But since they don't let her write the scripts, Buffy remains the best girl power show on TV.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Lee -- hey, thanks, you rock too! :) I guess I wouldn't be surprised if someone took off with the urban legend and gave it a whack (so to speak) but I do feel terribly bad for poor Richard Gere. He may be a lot of things, but a gerbiller ain't one of them.

But I did hear that Christina Aguilera had to have a gallon of semen pumped out of her stomach. . .

Disclaimer: That's also an urban legend, I'm just foolin'!

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Hi. I thought of having egg drop soup for dinner but now, ew. I have a few rats (as pets) and really they aren't too different from other rodents. I can't imagine as much as my rats tear me up with their nails and nibble on my hands actually having one in my ass. I'd hate to be bitten in the rectum, thank you.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? I'm split on this one. I honestly thing, simultaneously, that more abortions would be a significant help to this country and that it has a pernicious impact on our national psyche.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? It's time is done. Most of the reciptients of the help are, according to record, middle to upper class _already_. One of the biggest problems with a government that tries to right every wrong that comes along is that it doesn't know when to stop. Even if the cure ends up being worse than the disease. Or is even totally ineffectual.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. A magazine that I probably Shouldn't Have Been Reading. National Lampoon, I believe. =) The guy in the comic seemed to be having fun, so I went home and tried it.

Topic #5: Feminists. I do so wish that the REASONABLE feminists would take back their organization from the wackos. When the inequities that caused NOW, et al, to form were somewhat stamped out, most of the mainstream feminists drifted away, leaving the radical so-and-so's.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. Never given one (though I was asked once), and have received a few, but never from a swallower OR a spitter. It's like "I'll do this for you baby, but I can't handle the stuff in my mouth". Still, I appreciate the effort and don't complain. =)

BTW, you are right on the money about the spermicidal lubricant, Pamie. There's more than a couple of people allergic to it.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

I can't belive Im going to post this but I will..on the topic of blow jobs..my ex b/f who is still my best friend..adn we have casual sex occasionally and lots of blow jobs are given *L* (now how pathetic is that) used to say I gave the best blow jobs ever (god, what a repuatation) he enjoyed telling ppl so much about them that at university I have the rep of being the girl who enjoys giving blow jobs....the guys in teh rez next to me still can't belive that I love to give them, don't mind swallowing (i can't taste it for some reason) and would rather do that than give a hand job (so much easier to get them off..

I can't belive I just said that..ahh well we are all being open :)

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Oh man, Dave..Now I have two pictures of a similar vein in my mind. That I could have done without. I think my ulcer is acting up now. Ah well, the joys of disclosure.

Beth- Yes, I have known a couple ladies who just could not take any direct clitoral contact whatsoever. It didn't matter how light or roundabout I went...it was just too much. Of course they tended to be highly responsive to other kinds of stimulation though...like a full body sensual massage did..amazing things.

Yep. poor Richard Gere has got a bad rap for that one. Never fun to be the punchline of a self-replicating Late-Night joke.

Slightly skewed reality here; I never did make it too bed. So is life. Off to the salt mines I go. G'night Squishites, connoisseurs of the Great Squash...have Squishy dreams.

-- Anonymous, May 25, 2000

Saundra: A GALLON?! Damn, I'm impressed...

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

Totally, Jackie. I heard she took on ALL of the Backstreet Boys, AND all of 'N Sync after the Men Strike Back concert on VH-1! She nearly died!!

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

Squishites! I love it!

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

Hear, hear, Beth. Most women I know who don't like oral sex haven't had good oral sex. It's just that simple. And it's also possible to just not like it at all - without it leading back to some lame-ass idea that it's because she's a prude or repressed or whatever.

Anyway, one of the better books I've read about oral sex is called, "Sex Tips for Straight Women by a Gay Man." I believe Bust magazine printed a portion from it in their fabulous "sex" issue a few years back. Anyway, the whole deal with men seems to be that the more you are (or seem to be) into doing it, the better it is all around. Personally, I dig it. I think it's an art. And I also think I'm good at it - but that's because I've been lucky enough to have had boyfriends who told me what they liked and didn't like, and weren't all hung up about it or scared to tell me if I wasn't doing it well.

Conversely, I've learned to tell my partner where to go and how to get me there as well. It's all about communication and just telling someone what you like. That eliminates the awkward feelings that I know I had, and many women AND men have of, "Am I good at this? Does he like it? I feel stupid. What am I doing down here." A little "To the left," or "Up higher" does wonders.

So yeah, dip into the honey pot, men. It's not so bad.

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

Sometimes I read these things and just feel an _aching_ need to put my 2" in. I hope no one minds.

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? I don't believe in it unless it's a case of rape or incest. But I don't judge people for having abortions - my personal beliefs do not give me the right to tell other people what to do. Or not to do, for that matter.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? May the best man (or woman) win. If you're not what they're looking for, why _should_ they hire you? If you _are_ what they're looking for, then the color of your skin, your heritage, or your sexual orientation shouldn't play any part.

Topic #3: Masturbation. I think I was about 12 but I don't really remember how I discovered it. It used to be a great thing - I used to love it. But since I met my boyfriend and learned that whole mutual masturbation thing, I don't enjoy it much anymore when I'm alone.

Topic #4: Catholics. I was raised Catholic. I never much enjoyed church and I no longer go voluntarily. If my grandmother knew that, she'd beat me with a broom handle.

Topic #5: Feminists. I don't have any opinion about feminists. Do what makes you happy.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. I love giving blowjobs. There are many nights when I would happily give my boyfriend a blowjob and ask for nothing in return. As far as the spit or swallow thing goes, I have a real strong gag reflex. I usually just finish him off by hand. He's never complained.

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

Oooohhh, I love to talk about sex! First, the topics:

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? -- Yea. I agree with Beth on this one, but I certainly wouldn't "force" anyone to have an abortion, no matter how much it might help in some situations.

. Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? -- Yea. Again, I agree with Beth, although this is a topic I don't think about too much, I'll admit.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. - - Found Dad's porn around age 7. Around the same time I noticed that it felt good when I crossed my legs after I peed. I've been crossing them every since . . .

Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics? -- Dunno - not interested, really. Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society? --I can't believe the phrase "Man-hating lesbians" is still around. It makes me want to weep. The latter, obviously.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw? -- Ah, this is what I signed on for. Y'know, I wrote a whole article about this for CleanSheets two years ago. It's called "How to Suck" and it's still in the archives (which I think they're going to open up and make them for-free again soon).

I know what you mean, Beth, about the older guys lasting longer. It used to be my favorite way of "getting out of" going all the way when I was younger - I'd suck a guy off and open my throat so he'd come down my throat. No mess, no taste, no more erection knocking at my virgin door. Now I like to date guys in the early to mid 30's, and they certainly do last a lot longer. I have too many teeth-grinding, jaw- related problems, so I don't bother trying to wait them out anymore - if they can't come before I start hurting, they aren't coming in my mouth, period. Of course, I've got a lot more confidence in myself and I don't take a lot of shit in bed anymore. There are other fun things to do with a raging erection, and I hate to waste them down my throat. I'm also a lot more aware of diseases and germs and all that, so I hesitate to swallow unless he's a long-term boyfriend. I hate giving oral sex over a condom - even the "flavored" ones made for that purpose don't work all that well (the sucking motion pulls it off and lodges it in the back of my throat) - but I won't have intercourse without one, so it almost seems safer to go that route if I'm willing to. However, during oral sex I never spit. I either swallow or pull back and catch it in my hand. Spitting would be the worst of all worlds - you've got his spunk in your mouth, you're tasting it more than you would had you swallowed, and he doesn't get the erotic thought of you swallowing his seed.

I think it's much more difficult to give head to a woman than a man, and yes, I've done both. I can never quite get comfortable giving head to a woman - my neck crunches up and I have to stop. There's also a lot more, um, variety of things to do down there - which can be fun, but it doesn't seem as instinctual as "suck it down" is for a man. Women can also be hard to get talking - I always try to find out what my partner likes and where the "hot spots" are. Some women just can't talk about sex, even though they have it all the time. Most men are allowed societally to have a potty mouth, so they have the vocabulary and practice in using those words, describing those areas and sensations. Women aren't as encouraged, culturally, to know/use those words, so it's harder for them to get chatty about what feels good. You have to ask a lot more questions with a woman than a man. They (usually) don't volunteer information.

I try to be good about it, myself, and it unnerves some partners at first. "oooh, that's good - will you nibble on my clit a bit, and while you do that, move your finger up and down my slit, surprising me by pushing it inside me when I least expect it? Thanks." But, really, it's so much better for everyone involved. You get exactly what you want and they get to know they're doing you *exactly* right. It's not like I dictate - I just want them to know what works before they start trying variations on the theme.

I'm sure I'm forgetting lots of stuff I wanted to talk about here, but this will do for now. Thanks for bringing up some of my favorite topics!!

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

I've been reading all the posts and giggling like a madwoman (my poor boyfriend is trying to sleep.) if nobody minds, I'm stepping up to the mike and putting in my $.02 worth... which may end up being more like $2.00 worth.

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? this ties in with feminism. Gloria once said if men could get pregnant abortion would be a sacrament. as a pre-med major, I've read reports about e's and f's being able to "feel" pain but it's probably impossible... I think in some cases it's right and some it is wrong but ultimately it is the woman's choice. I'm fluffy -- I believe babies are up in heaven and they're given to a mommy and that mommy should love them to pieces... so if a woman is not ready to do that for whatever reason she should just discard the cells and leave the baby up on their marshmallow cloud until another womb comes along.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? yay... I suppose.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. When Harry Met Sally. I just had to try it. I rationalized it as masturbation is sex with someone I love.

Topic #5: Feminists. I admire their grit and they do have a great message... but sometimes they get way out of line.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. love them. when I first got my tongue pierced I was overwhelmed with guys asking me to go down on them (and a couple of girls too... eeeeeeeee.) my current beau always thanks me profusely and he told his friends one night I could suck the chrome off of a bumper. :)

I really don't like a man going down on me. I'd rather cut my toenails. unless that man was Gene Simmons. it isn't because of my upbringing or because I think I am smelly... I like penetration. give me fingers or a um... hoo hoo.

as for the anal action... um... I thought it was ferrets? yikes. and I thought the hotdog - as - a - vibrator urban legend was bad. at least hot dogs don't have teeth.

-- Anonymous, May 26, 2000

". I have to be pulled off. I can think of nothing better in the world than giving a woman however many varied/multiple/g-spot orgasms she would wish to have. Nothing."

I have to kick my husband off sometimes, because it becomes too intense. Scarily intense. Any man that can do that, is an incredible man. Of course my first orgasm, with a partner, was with my husband. Not that I was a virgin before that, my partners just didn't do it for me.

-- Anonymous, May 27, 2000

Man you gals make it sound so good (giving blowjobs)I am ready to give it a try myself. That and My GF always makes it look like so much fun.

A friend of mine saw a photo of a guy doing himself, he said to me "if I could do that I would never get to work and I would be on longterm disability till they gave me a retirment package."

I also can't get enough of my GF's honey, I have gotten a tired and sore jaw too.

-- Anonymous, May 28, 2000

If you do start handing out hummers, Daniel, can I watch?

Oh, I'm sorry, did I just cross a line there?

-- Anonymous, May 29, 2000

Uh oh. Here comes trouble: Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? After due consideration and much soul searching, I have concluded that abortion is murder, but it's murder in self-defense. People who are already here get the control over zygotes and semi-reptilian fetuses, and not the other way around. However, I also feel that as a man I don't really deserve a vote on the subject. Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? I dunno. I've heard compelling arguments from both sides. I would tend to favor merit over quotas, though. But everything is still WAY too white. Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. Let's see, I was in the bathtub playing with my rubber duckie. It started to feel better and better, and then I got a big surprise! I was 13? 14? Topic #4: Catholics. What the hell is up with Catholics? Catholicism is amazing. I've been to St. Peters in Rome twice and that place is better than Chuck E. Cheese's. So much cool stuff! On my second trip I was on a tour group led by a novice Irish priest who took a perverse delight in regaling us with stories of church scandals. Popes with kids! Popes with anger control issues! Sly sexual in-jokes at every turn! It's a 2000-year-old institution and therefore it MUST be totally corrupt, which is very cool. Unfortunately in order to be a Catholic you have to believe a boatload of ridiculous garbage, so no thanks. Sorry. By the way, did you know that "Aqua Pia" is Latin for "Holy Water?" I thought it was a drinking fountain! Oops! Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society? Wow, I'm simply offended by the phrasing of this one. I'm going to sound like an ancient old geek for saying this, but without the feminists of the 1960s and 1970s a lot of you young ladies today would be scrubbin' floors and learning to love it. Important fact: before 1970 it was almost impossible for a woman to get a credit card. Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw? Blowjobs make me uncomfortable, because I don't like sitting still and have someone else do all the work. I like to give better than receive, but then again I've never met anyone with the apparently awesome technique reported here. I bet that would change my mind in a hurry!

By the way, in the spit/swallow controversy, there is a third option that a female friend of mine mentioned to me some time ago: spit, swallow, or blow bubbles!

-- Anonymous, May 29, 2000

Saundra; I don' think there are any lines here..hehehe.

I have lots to say about all things sexual and the topic list in general, but my god; don't you think that I have said enough? Yes, me too.

Oh, and yes, for inquiring minds, that IS my real e-mail addy. The joys of having Your wussy i.s.p. cave in and sell-out to COX internet. Why didn't they just finish me off and make it Lee@cox.com ? How's that for a hummer?..Heh, I crack myself up.

-- Anonymous, May 29, 2000

Arrrgh! God punished me for my comments about Catholicism by making my post look like crap! Ok, maybe I WILL convert.

-- Anonymous, May 29, 2000

oh, daniel?

you know why dogs lick their penises? because they can.

-- Anonymous, May 31, 2000

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? I think its murder but its justified. Im with Beth, Im pro abortion and I think there should be more of them.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? I dunno. I dont think weve come so far that its time to throw it out.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. I read about it in a dirty book and wanted to be the first in my crowd so I tried it. It took a long time to get the hang of it.

Topic #4: Catholics. No opinion.

Topic #5: Feminists. Im all for them, I am one. I remember when the classified ads were listed by mens & womens jobs and women couldnt get credit without her father or husband co-signing. And so on. So what if a few are man hating lesbians. There are a few extremists in every movement.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. Fun to give, though they can be a big pain in the jaw. I dont get how you can do them and not expect to swallow, unless you literally throw up from jism. Youre gonna go down there, you know whats going to happen. Id feel pretty insulted if I were a guy and some girl wouldnt swallow. Oh and Im one of those mythical women who dont really like guys to go down on me. The pressure isnt hard enough and I like him to be holding me in his arms and kissing me and I guess my puritanical background probably has something to do with it. Naturally Im always getting involved with men whose favorite thing to do is eat at the Y.

-- Anonymous, June 01, 2000

Okay... increment the posting counter by one more post...

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? Best if it never had to happen but we should never return to the oppression of the days before Roe vs. Wade.

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? Although I was discriminated against at least three times in the 1970's (because of being a white male) I think something drastic had to be done to assist the victims of the legalized repression of the past and affirmative action was an emergency attempt to level the playing field. Today? College students today weren't even born then. Affirmative action discriminates against everyone who does not fall into one of those magic protected categories and should be eliminated.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing... Just want to pass on a quote I remember from my freshman year of college (back in neolithic times)... during a dorm discussion of masturbation, one of the more prudish students was rebuking one of the more ribald students over his enthusiastic comments, telling him that he was just "too horny" whereupon the ribald student replied "Too horny? Hell, I get horny between strokes!"

Topic #4: Catholics. Once upon a time I could have gotten all worked up about this, but these days I figure live and let live... besides which, although they may deny it, the Catholic church in the U.S. has changed drastically in the past half century.

Topic #5: Feminists. Although there are ideologues and hypocrits in any group (such as those who attempted to excuse Clinton for political reasons) I think the feminist movement was (and still is) very important.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. (Ha! And I just mentioned Clinton?) Spit or swallow? I don't care... just as long as I can relax and enjoy receiving this delightful gift without having to constantly monitor the proceedings so as to provide warning notice of impending ejaculation. I also enjoy providing oral gratification... it really can be more blessed to give than to receive. Reciprocity is pleasant, but not simutaneously, that makes it too difficult to concentrate on the task at hand... er, at tongue. Delightful, tasty, and enjoyable as the main course or merely as an appetizer leading to the main course. And, just to mix metaphors, remember that when dealing with sex, don't worry so much about the destination that you forget to enjoy the journey.

Jim

p.s. I realize that there are additional concerns today that weren't around back in my younger days -- I get reminded by the ever- lengthening list of questions asked everytime I donate bood at a Red Cross blood drive -- but mutual oral sex can be a very effective means of birth control -- and much more fun than some of the other methods!

-- Anonymous, June 02, 2000

I'm a few days late on this one, but having finished my exams I can now join in with great gusto.

Topic #1: Abortion: yea or nay? Bollocks to that. It's quite obviously murder. If I had a baby and decided after a couple of weeks that I didn't really feel I could cope with it, would I be able to get away with doing away with it? NO. It's a person, and it's being killed, and that equals murder. However, while it's legal people are entitled to get them. It's a tricky issue for me - I would never condemn anybody for having one (and have supported several friends through the ordeal) but I wish people would try actually taking a little responsibility for their own actions. Have you ever seen the statistics on repeat abortions? A LOT of women will have three or four, and there's no fucking excuse for that - if they can't control their own fertility get their fucking tubes tied next time they're in there. (and don't anybody bother getting into a big old argument with me on this one, because I'll respect your opinion but you'll never change my mind, so save your breath).

Topic #2: Affirmative action: yea or nay? I agree with whoever said it would be insulting to be helped in this way, but I can understand why it's in place. In NZ they have Maori quotas into university courses (law, medicine, etc), because the the Maori people make up less than 25% of the total NZ population, but 70% of the prison population (and they're probably not the exact figures, but I'm sure you get the gist). However, I think the idea of getting them all into university easily and thus making them achieve is a tad simplistic.

Topic #3: That masturbation thing that they already mentioned. Never really had, I'm afraid.

Topic #4: Catholics. Beth said "What the hell is up with Catholics? -- I probably can't answer this question without indulging in hate speech, so I'll refrain." ... and that's probably a very good idea, as anybody who does that kind of thing is every bit as bad as the group of people they're speaking about. I'm a Catholic, the church does a lot more good than harm, no one religion is at fault for the evils on the world, and the fundamental belief of the Catholic church is that life is sacred, which seems to me an impossible thing to argue against ... but then again, I think abortion is murder, so I would say that. No, seriously - try the Catholic bashing at your peril, because I bet there's some pretty shitty things about whatever group you're aligned with that I could also dig up and parade. My religion is private to me, and I'll never preach to you and shove it down your throat (we Catholics are far too cool for that evangelical stuff), so keep your tired prejudice and ill-informed comments to yourself.

Topic #5: Feminists. Man-hating lesbians or women trying to change the power structure inherent in Western society? The latter, obviously.

Topic #6: Blowjobs. This one's for the ladies: fun to give, gross, or just a big pain in the jaw? I'm with Beth here - I feel like my jaw should be reconstructed afterwards. But as for that spit or swallow debate ... fuck off if you think that stuff's getting in my mouth. I've done it several times, and it tastes disgusting. So it's a last minute pull away of the head and a sticky stomach for the man. But I've had no complaints, so obviously my superior technique means it's not an issue by this late stage.

-- Anonymous, June 05, 2000

Jackie: You mentioned 2 things that I thought were of merit (that sounded bad, I don't mean you only said two things of merit, I meant you said 2 things I want to respond to!) Partially because I agree, but also because there is a bit of a conflict in your answers.

1) RE: Catholics... As a good Catholic, I like your comment about how you don't push your opinions on others. That seems to be a dominant theme with many Catholics I know. I have seldom been judged or condemned to an eternity in hell by a Catholic. However, "keep your tired prejudice and ill-informed comments to yourself." is one I have to disagree with. The prejudice within the Catholic faith is EXACTLY what I am tired of. This conflicts heavily with your pro-feminist argument. The forbiddance of women priest makes me want to vomit. There seems to be no apparent reasoning behind this, except for the "men=good, women=bad" argument. I'm a man, but I was raised by an incredible Mother that could do the job as well as any other priest could. If there is a legitimate logic behind this, I would love someone to explain it to me.

-- Anonymous, June 05, 2000

Jackie: I respectfully disagree with your suggestion that any criticisms I have about the Catholic church are necessarily unfair, uninformed, or based on prejudice. In my opinion (and it's an opinion shared by many people, so it's not like I'm some wacko), organized religion is an inherently bad thing. The Catholic church is the most organized and most powerful example of organized religion, and it is responsible for the purveying of a lot of hateful, repressive ideas. You are entitled to practice your religion in peace, and I wish you the best. I'm entitled to think your church is a pretty hateful institution. And I do.

-- Anonymous, June 05, 2000

WeepBoy, I completely agree that being a Catholic is at times contradictory ... for example (without giving you all the complete rundown on The Church ... My Way) I don't like abortion (as the more observant of you may have guessed), but I do like the idea that everybody is entitled to form any kind of loving relationships they choose, so you'll never see me trying to prevent schools from mentioning homosexuality when doing sex education in schools (big debate in Scotland at the moment). And I think the idea of being anti-contraception is crazy. The way I see it, nobody believes entirely in one faith unless there is brainwashing involved. I feel that the fundamental ideas of the church (such as the life is sacred thing) outweigh the bad things.

And I promise you there will be female priests within the next ten years. When I was a kid it was unheard of to have altar-girls, but now they're everywhere. The Catholic church is a very old organisation and as such takes a long time to change. But gradually the changes happend regardless.

Beth - I am sure (as in the past) we can agree to disagree! However, what would the average reaction be if I posted similar comments with 'Jews' in place of 'Catholics'? Not good, I'd wager. I've read a lot of history, and I know the rotten things the Catholic church has been responsible for. However, I also know a lot of good things. And I'm just bloody thankful I'll never be responsible for defending my entire religion, because I'm not nearly articulate enough for the job. I am happy with my beliefs and as such do not try and ram them down anybody's throat, but my hackles go up when I am, by extension of my beliefs, condemned as being part of an evil regime.

And that was (I'd like to think) an uncharacteristicly fervent response I posted last time, so apologies to our more sensitive readers for the profanity. Ten Hail Maries.

-- Anonymous, June 05, 2000

Fair enough, Jackie. I would point out that while the question specified "Catholics," I was careful to direct my comments at the Catholic church. I don't think it's a subtle difference. As I said, my problem is with organized religion, not with the spiritual beliefs of individual people (unless those spiritual beliefs cause said people to act like assholes, which incidentally is not my experience when it comes to Catholicism ... most of the Catholics I know are very nice people).

-- Anonymous, June 05, 2000