I know this is not a VCD question, but as I was looking through actions on Yahoo, I cam across this "100 inch TV" thing. There is more info at: www.100inchtv.com. I was just wondering what this thing is made of, and if it really works. It looks like a scam. Thanks for any answers.

-- Jay (jlink84@yahoo.com), May 10, 2000

Answers

100 " Projection TV Instructions

These plans are very simple! Results may vary by types of materials you use. Works on TVs or monitors.

Materials

These are the things you will need to make your 100" projection TV!

Magnifying glass- Please note if it has a bifocal lens it will not work!!

Sturdy cardboard (or fiberboard).

Duct tape

Black paint or paper

3 pencils

Small mirror (about 3"x3")(optional, you don't really need this).

Four small washers that fit snug around the pencils.

Step1> Measure your screen (vertical and horizontal).

Step2> Cut the side pieces (A and B) for your projector. (Using your measurements from step 1.) Again use 35" for length. This allows the room to adjust the focus. Be sure to cut as straight as possible!

Step 3> Cut the top and bottom pieces (C and D.) (Using your measurements from step 1). Again use 35" for length.

Step 4> Cut out your slider (E). This piece will be the one that slides in and out of your projector! This allows for the focussing. Use your screen measurement from step 2 & 3. Then, find the center, mark it with your pencil!

Step 5> Remove the glass lens form your magnifying glass. Set it exactly on the cent or your slider. Trace around it, and cut our the circle very carefully. Lens must fit snugly in the hole!

Step 6> Now you have all your pieces cut. Now you either paint all pieces black, or cover with black construction paper. If painting, use more than one coat!

Step 7> Now start to assemble your projector. Place pieces A,B,C, & D together and tape them together using your duct tape. Tape both sides so you don't get any light showing through.

Step 8> Now connect the two side together using duct tape. Do this carefully, and now you should have a rectangular box!

Step >9 Insert your glass lens into the hole you cut inb the slider. THIS MUST FIT TIGHTLY. It must be flush with slider. This is a little tricky, but is not impossible!

Step >10 Take to unsharpened pencils and poke them through your slider (E) about one inch from the sides, not the top and bottom. Then put a washer on each end if the pencils. Use some tape if necessary to ensure pencils do not slide in and out! Only push a LITTLE of the pencil through, just enough to secure them. The pencils allow you to push pull the slider in and out to adjust your focus. If pencils interfere with your picture, pull them out after you have focussed your projector and put tape over the holes!

Step 11> Place your slider about halfway in the box. Your slider must fit squarely inside the box!

Step 12> Turn your TV or monitor upside down and carefully attach your projector. Use tape or any other way you desire! Should fit tightly and no light should shine through the box.

Step 13> Turn your TV or monitor on and adjust your slider to focus your picture. This may take a while. The further away from the wall, the larger your picture will be! The darker the room, the clearer your picture will be.

Step 14> If your image is reversed, place a mirror at a 45 degree angle in front of the lens. You may have to turn the screen in its back. Same principle used in school overhead projectors.

Step 15> After the projector is setup and focussed, cut the remaining front pieces away. This allows for better viewing.

Step 16> Have a fun with your new TV or Monitor!!!!

-- Dan (quaalude@home.com), October 23, 2000.

To get excellent results, the key is to get the 8 1/2 x 11 " page size fresnel lens that you can get for $ 7.00 at Office Depot of Staples , whichever is closer to you. DO NOT USE the small 3 or 5 inch magnifying glass! Otherwise, you will get half of the picture blurry! Also, you do need a 8 1/2 x 11 inch mirror so that the print on the screen wont look backwards, for example if you use captions or you are reading titles or text on the screen.

-- bobo the mobo (xtallxy@juno.com), December 03, 2000.

man, i just paid 10 bucks for these plans and you guys are just posting them here?, oh well at least i get diagrams, anyways my picture is okay, it all depends on the box, its got to be tightly fighted so no light gets through and your lens, i bought the lens from the 100inchtv.com web site, its very big and covers the whole of the screen, still though, i dont use it in the day cuz the picture isnt clear enough,and please visit my web site www.celebxxxpics.homestead.com =]

-- um no (pissed@off.com), January 05, 2001.

dude i just made a website and put some pics up of the one i made, its at : http://keep-it-free.tripod.com, it should explain most of da stuff

-- none (webmaster@otaku-elite.com), February 12, 2001.

hello the diagram expains it good. what its telling you is to make a box with four sides the top and bottom part of your box should measure your screen size. the two side pieces should measure the same size as your screen too! it just needs to be 35inches long, for viewing foucos... after you get it focus you could then cut the remaining peice away. the slider is another piece of cardboard, this is just a square it needs to be fit inside the box snug. make a hole in the center of the slider and place your mygnifiy glass in it.needs to be snug. and thats it!

-- louisjimenez (jimenezlouis@webtv.net), April 01, 2001.

Hey everyone, this is not a scam i have the plans and built this 100inch tv and mine works great! anyone have questions email me and ill try to answer them as good as i can , i dont have a computer scanner so sorry cant mail you the diagram , but the instructions on top are pretty good, ive got some pics of my unit i built in a few minutes.... i could mail you for examples. I MAKING THIS WEB-PAGE just for all you IN CONSTRUCTION visit: http://community.webtv.net/JIMENEZLOUIS/Louis100INCHTV

-- LOUIS JIMENEZ (JIMENEZLOUIS@WEBTV.NET), April 09, 2001.

IMPORTANT INFO: here is a web-page i made with instructions and pictures on how to make this 100inch tv.......go to : http://community-1.webtv.net/JIMENEZLOUIS/Louis100INCHTV -----------------------------------------------------once again go to http:// community-1.webtv.net/JIMENEZLOUIS/Louis100INCHTV

-- LOUIS (Louis-100inchTV@webtv.net), April 09, 2001.

When going to my web page make sure you type the address EXACTLY the way it looks or it wont work. 100inch TV projector plans and instructions found here. case sensitive

-- LOUIS (LOUIS-100inchTV@WEBTV.NET), April 10, 2001.

Awesome page louis! I'm gonna build this bad boy today.

-- Jay (spriterite002@yahoo.com), April 20, 2001.

Thanks Louis! Great reading. I hope to dive into the project one day soon. If anyone has thoughts on optics -- would salvaged overhead projector parts be preferrable -- please let me know.

-- Rob (rob@northlab.com), April 25, 2001.

THANK YOU ALL FOR VISITING MY WEBPAGE.... Hope you all enjoyed it as much as building it. and i hope my webpage helped all of you trying to build this device, My web page will be closing soon so stop by and say hi or thanks, before its too late! http://community-1.webtv.net/JIMENEZLOUIS/Louis100INCHTV

-- LOUIS JIMENEZ (louis-100inchtv@webtv.net), May 06, 2001.

Thanks Louis! your site is great. i'm mid way through the building of my projector and your site has helped me alot. Thanks again!

-- sinizuh (sinizuh@sindex.cjb.net), May 06, 2001.

Louis, The web page is great, Don't close it down, if you want i'll keep it up on my server, just email me the files. Thanks man!

-- joel (crunch_103@hotmail.com), May 08, 2001.

Is there any way to make this thing brighter?? I have the brightness set all the way up on my tv(actually it is a monitor that accepts rca inputs)...could this be the problem(that it is a monitor and not a tv)?The image is pretty good it is just not nearly bright enough. I am using a 4 inch fresnel magnifying glass. Would a normal magnifying glass let more light through? I am just kind of stumped on this one because lots of people say this seems to be working great, but i just can't figure out how to get a bright image here.

-- steve (szeidner@hotmail.com), May 14, 2001.

the whole thing is not a scam. The catch is tvs cant output enough brightness to give a good enough quality image for serious use. There isnt anything you can really do to make it brighter except turn the brightness setting all the way up, seal the box good, and have a really dark room.

-- sprite (sprite@hotmail.com), May 17, 2001.

HELLO AGIAN, AS YOU NOTICED MY SITE IS CLOSED... SORRY COULDENT STAY UP LONGER. IF ANY ONE WANTS THEY CAN COPY THE WHOLE WEBSITE ANDUSE IT ON THERES.. . ITS OKAY WITH ME, ANYWAY NONE OF THE E-MAIL ADDRESS are working either, so sorry cant reply, my new email addy is LOUISJIMENEZ@YAHOO.COM feel free to ask questions...

-- LOUISJIMENEZ (louisjimenez@yahoo.com), May 17, 2001.

now that Louis's site is down, has anyone put the information on any other site? Louis, if you are reding this, in case you stil have your website zipped-up somewhere, could you send it over as an email attachment or something?

Thanks... Jocker

-- Jocker (jockium@X-Stream.co.uk), May 23, 2001.

Include sending me a copy of the website if someone has it. I pretty much understood the instructions, but would like to see it while putting it together. One question: is the 'slider/focuser' similar looking to a graduation cap? A large square that fills the opening and has the magnifying lens lodged in the center?.?. Also, if you use the Fresnel lens, do you still use the 'slider' or use it by itself? Thanks!

-- William (ultraviolet_75@hotmail.com), May 25, 2001.

I have free easy to understand diagrams for those interested but you have to pay 50 cents for postage and copies cost.

-- Keitaro Urashima (j-wong1@northwestern.edu), May 26, 2001.

I got it to work with an magnifying glass but where the hell do you get this fresnel lens? I checked online and almost everywhere. It will probably be better than my magnifying glass and cheaper too. HELP!

-- Keitaro Urashima (j-wong1@northwestern.edu), May 27, 2001.

Jay and anybody that wants info....I'm working on this thing...I am taking it a step farther and building a wooden console for my TV. I will have the plans and pictures on my website in the near future. http://gatorzap.com (tattoo website, but will have a link for the TV.) If you need them before I get the plans on my site email me and I'll send you whatever you want. Good luck and Hope to hear from you soon....Gator

-- Gator (gatorzap@nbn.net), May 27, 2001.

WOW! WOW! WOW! you guys would not believe my picture. I can even watch it during the day by simply drawing the curtains on my windows. I can not believe the picture. My unit is only about 8 to 10 feet from the wall I'm watching it on. Perhaps this helps. The only drawback is that the picture is only about 6 feet across instead of 8 ft across. (BUMMER).....not! It's great I cant believe it!! I just saved about 2,000 dollars! P.S. I found the sheet magnifyer, as it is called (also frensel lens) at Staples for $5.50!!!!

-- Gator (gatorzap@nbn.net), May 27, 2001.

Could someone please send me via email the plans for the display? I tried it last year with a regular magnifying lense and it worked! Only problem was that the image were blurred at the sides. This time I'm going to try the frensel lens but I need the plans again for I didn't back them up. :( Any help would be greatly appreciated.

-- Roshan (roshan5@home.com), May 27, 2001.

HELLO EVERYONE, ALOT OF PEOPLE HAVE WRITTEN ME TELLING ME TO SEND THEM MY WEB PAGE, I WOULD REALY LIKE TO BUT MY WEBTV GOT DISCONNECTED AND I HAVE NO OUTHER COPIES. WEBTV IS AN INTERNET ON YOUR TELEVISION AND HAD VERY SIMPLE STEPS TO MAKE YOUR WEBPAGE WITHOUT USING HTML. SO SORRY EVERYONE CANT SEND YOU ANY TYPE OF FILES, AND I DONT HAVE A COMPUTER SCANNER TO SCAN THE PAPER INSTRUCTIONS I GOT. SO SORRY AGAIN.ILL POST A SITE I KNOW THAT HAS INSTRUCTION TOO BUT THAT WILL BE WHEN I HAVE TIME. SO TILL THEN , HANG ON AND BE STRONG.

-- LOUISJIMENZ (louisjimenez@yahoo.com), May 28, 2001.

I just found this site: |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||| || http://broch.subnet.dk/projector/start.htm || ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

-- WwTIPPYwW (not.real@the.net), May 29, 2001.

It occurs to me that if you line the inside of the box sides with the shiny side of tin foil, extremely flat, or white construction paper instead of black, that it might amplify the available light and increase brightness somewhat. Of course, tin foil could also cause picture scattering. If anyone tries this, let me know how (and if) it works. I also thought that if you are using a fresnel lens, using a large mirror instead of a small one and project onto the back of a white sheet stretched over the front of a large lightproof box with black interior surfaces, it would work like a "regular" projection TV

-- Kevin Scullin (k_scullin01@hotmail.com), May 30, 2001.

Hey, I am making a web-site dedicated to the 100 inch projector. I built one and I love it. I am going to put up the directions and pictures of mine. If you have any tips, info, pictures you can contribute to the site please post them or send them to me. When I get the site up i'll post the address here. Thanks alot.

-- Jon (illfuseill2@hotmail.com), May 30, 2001.

I made a crappy website at http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html. I just put it up so people could ask me questions or give me pictures and i can post them there. There is a link to a set of real plans on there too. PLEASE e-mail me stuff to put on the site. Thanx

-- Jon (IllFuSeIll2@aol.com), May 30, 2001.

man i really need 2 know about the magnifiers lens.. so i live in costa rica .. and may be i'll have 2 give the instruccions 2 make the lens

-- wongz (wongz@costarricense.com), May 31, 2001.

A collection of the websites listed so far!!!!

http://www.maxpages.com/bigscreentv ------------ http://broch.subnet.dk/projector/start.htm ------------ http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html ------------ http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=0038A5

-- WwTIPPYwW (wwtippyww@hotmail.com), June 02, 2001.

Here's a thought I'm having:

1) Build the 100" TV box, and use a small "car" TV that runs on 12V DC.

2) Build the Bicycle power generator, and plug the TV into it.

This way, you'd get a 100" projector TV that runs off of a bicycle generator, completely separated from batteries, or the electric company!

Hehe :)

-Ken

-- Ken Udut of NJ (kudut@fpcc.net), June 02, 2001.

I just updated my site http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html. I added a tips section with a couple tips and a news section. Check it out!

-- IllFuSeIll (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), June 03, 2001.

Go to my website for a link to the actual plans. http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html

-- FuSe (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), June 04, 2001.

Every one if making great web pages, but i think we need some photos of the projected pictures so the people who haven't made can see the quality.

-- Joel (crunch_103@hotmail.com), June 05, 2001.

My projector is at my friend's house so i cant take pictures at the moment. As soon as i get them up i'll let you know.

-- Jon (illfuseill2@hotmail.com), June 06, 2001.

Hey people I am not technically challenged or anything, but I got everythig the way it was described, and I get nothing on the wall/ceiling. The only thing that I get is a picture about a foot away from the screen... what kinf of lnes do I need to use anyway? I got the 8 1/2 X 11 sheet lens from Staples... is there mabe a link you can find at office depot or staples web sites, so that I have a better idea... If one of the guys who successfuly complete the project posted your ICQ # - I'd love to talk online.

Thanks

-- Kos (kostik@telus.net), June 06, 2001.

Hey, I don't have icq, but my AOL instant messenger screenname is illfuseill.

-- Jon (illfuseill2@hotmail.com), June 07, 2001.

I bought my instructions from this website. It has 6 digrams and the intructions were very easy to follow. The also sell the lens you need to make the picture on teh wall really clear. Anyway, hope this helps, oh here's the website:

http://www.books4you.addr.com/index.html

I also bought a couple of other things that really work too!!

-- Michael Framedia (michaelframedia@yahoo.com), June 11, 2001.

Okay, i'm trying to build this thing but in the instructions it says to turn the tv upside down so the picture is right side up, right? But when i turn my tv upside down the colors screw up, they go like negative or something. I have a 13" sharp TV. Anybody else have this problem ? and i'm trying to make it using a regular plastic magnifying glas lens. it works but the edges of the pisture are really blurry. I was wondering if i should get this fresnel lens people are talking about. Thanks for your time.

-- Matt (Jeeneeus_911@hotmail.com), June 13, 2001.

Matt - look here: http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html I think what you got is probably the same as fresnel lens. I think you need to make a circle out of paper to cover the edges of the lens. I haven't made a unit yet....still trying to decide. --DOES IT ACTUALLY WORK?

-- WwTIPPYwW (wwtippyww@hotmail.com), June 13, 2001.

I've been working on this project as well. I also have a 13" tv that goes all screwy when turned upside down. Has anyone tried using two lenses to reverse the picture again? I'm using the 8.5" x 11" lens from Office Depot, the picture is pretty good, but it is still upside down. Any ideas?

-- Chris Dumont (dumont_chris@hotmail.com), June 14, 2001.

Once again, go to my website http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html it should explain what to do fairly clearly. Make sure you type it in exactly how it looks, no www. or anything in front. If you still have questions feel free to e-mail me and i should respond to you the same day.

-- _-=FuSe=-_ (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), June 14, 2001.

Here is a link to a website that has information on ordering a Degausser Coil. This will correct the color problems you are getting when you put the tv on its top or back. The discoloration is caused by the magnetic field that the TV set has become accustomed to changing.

-- vanillabox (Notme@nomail.com), June 16, 2001.

http://www.athana.com/ddequip/dc13.html

-- vanillabox (notme@nomail.com), June 16, 2001.

Has anyone in the UK tried this, if so where can I get a lens from, thnx

-- gordeo (gordeo@yahoo.com), June 19, 2001.

Does anyone know if the type of lens matters at all? I mean, the lens I bought was from Office Max, but does anyone know if the lens from Office Depot, Staples, or someother place actually make a difference or not? The lens from Office Max somewhat focuses the picture in the very middle, but everywhere else is blurred.

-- billbo (ihave@nomail.com), June 19, 2001.

I had the same problem. I got a 8 1/2 X 11" lens from Staples (it was called a page magnifier or something). It worked pretty good, but I couldn't get a very sharp image. Does anyone know where I could get a better lens? Should I try a round one?

-- (hankey01@hotmail.com), June 20, 2001.

Please go to my website, it explains most of the questions here. The address is http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html the problem of the image only being sharp in the middle is just that the lens is backwards. You have to put the bumpy part of the lense facing the tv, and the smooth part facing your wall/screen.

-- jon (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), June 20, 2001.

Oh, and also on my website it says how to fix the color problem. All you have to do is: 1. unplug your tv 2.turn it upside down 3.leave it unplugged for 10 minutes 4.plug it back in 5.turn it on.

-- jon (illfuseill2@hotmail.com), June 20, 2001.

i checked out the sites listed on this post....but does anyone know of any better ones?....the one at maxpages is kinda hard to read, and how come the s's, z's, 8's, and 0's are kinda weird?...is your keyboard broken?...i started doing the thing and then i realized that there might have been a typo (0 instead of 8)...good thing i'm kinda tired otherwise i'd be cussing to myself after all that cuttin

-- me (foo@bar.com), June 22, 2001.

So do you use the 8 1/2 x 11 lens instead of the magnif. lens?

-- Cordell (como3240@yahoo.com), June 24, 2001.

Cordell - I have read that the 8 1/2x 11" sheet is better that a round lense.

You might need to cut a circle out of paper to hide the edges of the sheet.

Read the tips from the links above...

WwTIPPYwW

-- WwTIPPYwW (WwTIPPYwW@hotmail.com), June 25, 2001.

Goto this very informative site:

http://broch.subnet.dk/projector/materials.htm

-- Joel (crunch_103@hotmail.com), June 27, 2001.

dear goodgod what a rip off, ive tried it,the smaller the tv the better the image but its still like trying to watch a movie with tinted glasses , murky and crappy, in a theatre, you have to have good light control for a poor quality pic. WOULD SOMEONE OTHER THAN A FRIGGIN SALESPERSON who is selling these things respond in her, illfussel for one, jesus, non of your links work, its worse than "date" classified internet adds sending you to porn links in here, dont send me to the friggin website selling me this crap, or some other website with nothing to do with it. send me to a website with someone actually making this with pics of it. PICs. the instructions are god awfull and a rip off, i had to use good ol' common sense and wing it. ALL A FRESNEL lense is a page magnifyer, salespeople have thier heads up thier behinds, no one knew what a fresnel lense was, im betting thats all thier selling on these "great new lense" scams for 15 bucks, a page magnifyer like everywhere else (20 with tax), save your money go to office depot get it for 6 or 7 bucks and no wait.

-- joes sperm (joesperm@aol.com), June 30, 2001.

i got a mediocre image now, my image is better than before,100 inches is way to big, i went to a sales place for tvs, they had a 64 inch (sit down, they wanted 180 bucks a month for it) , projectors are not for rent, where they are thier 300 dollars a day min, and that would be to big for my room or living room and probably yours too unless you have built a theatre room, its huge.i got the sze down to probably 50 inches and the pics clearer and brighter but its still dim, pretty tantalizing, if it were only a tad bit sharper, some movies ive watched showed up better than others,t2 was really cool, dvd is really clear, for 15 dollars im semi impressed, i got the office depot special. the setup needs to be light - tight, no light whatsoever you should use fiberboard, dont let cracks bleed light out, messes with the pic. good luck finding a magnifying glass without a bifocal lense thats big or at all, also good luck on finding a mirror, after 5 places i found a mirror the right size, most only have car mirrors that are to small, i took it home, tried to take it out of the frame and the mirror broke :(. its like, if it were only 20 % better. well its only 15 bucks out, 15 dollars for a semi crappy pic, and compared to the other tvs i have its no big loss. if your having problems with clarity moove it closer to the wall, the smaller your screen will be too, 100 inches was to big for the wall in my room. DONT EXPECT MUCH AND YOU WONT BE DISSAPOINTED. HDTV ITS NOT. and turning your set upside down and turning it off for 15 does NOT fix the color problem, salespitching bs. i have yet to look for a degausser coil, prolly no one knows what it is, good luck on that, unless you find a internet site, i wouldnt trust anyone sending you to a site on this thing that sells you something unless a legitimate buisness.

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), July 01, 2001.

so what have we learned from this?

1. salespeople are not to be trusted, if it looks to good to be true it usually is, they are usually trying to sell hype not product.

2. still would like to fix the color problem without having to look and ask 100 salespeople what is a degausser coil? i hopethier isnt some non scientific name for it like um, color correction antenna and ill slap myself once i find it, kinda like the time i asked 100 salespeople what a dvd fiber optic out cord was and they all sold me the highest priced reg. audio/vid cable.

3. dont trust salespeople, getting tired of seeing a bunch of salespeople say how great it is and sending me to thier website to buy the plans and lense.

4. one day projectors will be inexpensive as tvs and by then they will have the brand new 3d holographic projectors, crystal clear which will be too much money for you me, and maybe not bill gates.

5. dont trust salespeople. if it looks to good to be true.. repeat after me...

thats all folks, good luck, itll depend on your tv also probably how great a pic you get so dont be suprised if you hear varied results.

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), July 01, 2001.

I have stumbeled accross what I think to be a really good site about this 100 inch tv thing. It has instructions that you can request to have emailed to you, 3 different sets of plans, some FAQ and tips that I have seen posted here. All instructions are free - they sell the frensel lenses too for i think $15AUD so its an australian site. but if your looking for a good clear site about it - (not just a page) go to

http://www.webone.com.au/~caoz/bstv.htm

they have a web board there for postings too but no one has put up anything yet... they said they only launched it in the last few days. So have fun ~rats

-- Sarah (aratsau@yahoo.com.au), July 02, 2001.

Hey, I just made one and it works.

Slightly blurry, but a 13" TV isnt meant to be viewed at 75"!

Dont expect much and you wont be dissapointed. IT IS NOT A SCAM!!! But you can get the lenses at OfficeMax for 7.99

-- DK164 (DK164@DK164.DK164), July 03, 2001.

To Joe, the idea to fix the color problem is not to just turn off the tv for 15 minutes, but to actually unplug itfor 15 minutes. Try it out, I can almost gaurantee it will fix it.

-- Jon (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), July 03, 2001.

thanks jon, ill try it, the question is will it correct the problem entirey (ie. allowing you to watch it on its back or mine screws up if its not facing one side of the room) or just the temp damage that has been done by the color bleed out. looks like someone pasted in yet again another sales link to something other than the projector. i finally made one with my 19 inch tv. its semi dim and blurry some movies worked better than others, if they have a lot of torches (like the mummy) its really murky from light bleed out. tron was pretty cool, animation shows up really well as well as beyond the minds eye, anything with bright colors, computer animation esp. considering that most of us if we bought a 64 inch tv and had the thing blew, wed be screwed out of 4,000. ive seen a sony p200 projector or 600 or 700 for a 60 inch screen. me id rather shell out 20 than 4000 for a murky pic and possible tv blowout. i am totally not impressed with hdtv, big dissapointment and plasma tv is really cool but who can afford it, the tvs they had at rent a center were slighly brighter but still murky as the 20 dollar projetor, plasma tv is much,much better but who can afford 8,000 for a 40 inch? 14 gs for a 50 inch :(. positioning the mirror, keeping it stable and finding one the right size is a pain in the rear. good luck all. dont expect much.

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), July 05, 2001.

that was entirely, never clean your keyboard my keys are sticking. heh. pardon the spellin errors. the projector works but its dim and pretty blurry, depends on what you want to put up with.

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), July 05, 2001.

well whadya know, thanks jon unplugging the tv really works :). that saved me 7 dollars for the coil. weird. utter strangeness. i got a bareable pic. home theatre it aint but it still is ok if your on a tight budget. you may have to fix your own setup, my 19 inch works ok and is only slightly blurry. hey it only cost 13 bucks. and 19 inch tvs arent that big to begin with. later. -joe

-- joes spem (joessperm@aol.com), July 06, 2001.

No problem Joe. Now that you have a working projector try going to my website at http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html I have some tips there. A reason for the color bleed may be the screen you are using. If the screen has fuzz on it (like a sheet) that will soften the image, you want to use as smooth a surface as possible, and you also want it as reflective as possible without having glare.

-- Jon (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), July 06, 2001.

Hey everyone, I was just wondering if anyone has bought any plans off the internet like at 100inchtv.com etc and how different they are to the free plans on the net or if they are any different to the free plans. I just built a prototype budget cardboard projector I can see the principal but it totally sucked. My next step is to build a totally enclosed box out of mdf and make the whole thing into one unit. Also all the free plans use a small circle lens and recomend a fresnel, can anyone explain how to fit a fresnel. One last thing what is a bifocal lens. thanks and goodluck to everyone. oh yea if anyones got any good plans or pics of their projectors working please email them to me. thanks.

-- pete (pete_daly@hotmail.com), July 08, 2001.

You don't want to use a screen that has fuzz on it, like a sheet. It softens the image. I have found a white shower curtain works really well. I was skeptical about using silver too so I tried the high- gloss white. You don't want to use high-gloss white because you get glare. It's really annoying. I haven't tried semi-gloss, but that might work. Maybe the reason for using silver paint is to prevent glare. I don't know. A bi-focal lens is a regular magnifying glass with a smaller, more powerul lens built into the bottom of it. It loks like a little bubble.

-- Jon Spence (IllFuSeIll2@hotmail.com), July 08, 2001.

well i gave up on it, too much of a pain in the ass for bad or semi- mediocre results, i think i am going to buy a cheap ass sony p200 projector for 500-1000 dollars instead, really sucks, no one has any pics. it just isnt worth the time for the crappy quality results, positioning of the mirror, stabilization of the tv, quality control of lights in the room (youll need a light tight room or forget it as well as when you make the box. all this for a dim, crappy pic you have to squint at. with my small room even my 25 inch tv looks nice in comparison, what good is big results if its blurry, regardless on how you position it, you just cant find the non blurry g-spot. i give up on this one guys, esp. no one has any pics on their websites but phoney sales people. if people saw results, they wouldnt build one, theyd laugh their asses off at this. a little like trying to read the drive in tv screen with a magnifying glass with the drive in 3 blocks away, [jicl it, go to the theatre.

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), July 10, 2001.

Has anyone tried this with the homemade screen from the plans? (silver metallic spraypaint on a smooth surface) If so, can you tell any difference? I have found the hardest part about this idea is focusing, has anyone experimented with adding a focusing device? I found an adjustor for an office chair to adjust it up and down, I'm thinking by being able to adjust the lens to a minute setting, I can get good clarity. Has anybody come up with any simple focusing devices?

Also, I got a fresnel lense off of an auction that was made to magnify a 13 inch TV. The lens is curved, though. Has anybody found a lens that works better than others?

One plan that I got through the mail showed a way to open up the TV, and there are four wires going to the tube. If these wires are spliced and switched it says the result is an inverted picture, which solves the 'upside down with mirror' problem. Has anyone tried this?

One final thing: If the box was painted with a reflective surface inside, wouldn't this be a better light solution, or would the reflection mess up the picture?

-- TV DUDE (TVPROJ@YAHOO.COM), July 13, 2001.

I saw on another chat board where they had made a rear-projector screen by stretching a white or grey shower curtain liner over a wood frame. If this works, the picture should come out brighter without needing to darken the room as much. Anybody tried this?

-- TV DUDE (tvproj@yahoo.com), July 13, 2001.

Got to this page for some good info, and there is a www board to post to there. It'd be a good place to get the info flowin. link: http://www.webone.com.au/~caoz/bstv.htm

-- jack (ucmeflyby@email.com), July 16, 2001.

I found a blue camping tarp at the store that was silver on one side. It's big enough to cover the wall, should be very reflective, and the tarp is only about 6 bucks. Stetched tight, it should make a good inexpensive screen.

-- TV DUDE (tvproj@yahoo.com), July 16, 2001.

If you want to see this thing in action, go to http://www.webone.com.au/~caoz/bstv.htm, and check out the BIG WOODY project. Step by step instructions, and a photo of the results, 6 foot (72 inches) across! I wonder how many people are trying to sell the link to this page on eBay?

-- TV DUDE (tvproj@yahoo.com), July 17, 2001.

Not all Fresnels are created equal! The ones at Staples/Office Depot/etc are usually 2x. The ones that are being sold on BSTV and eBay are usually 3x. I had a hard time with the 2x lens.

http://www.3dglasses.com.tw/pagemagnifier.htm has the 3x ones for less than $2.00 each. They also sell polarizing sheets for less than $9.00.

-- tv dude (tvproj@yahoo.com), July 18, 2001.

Joe's sperm is pretty smart for half of a human organism! I'm goin to try this, i'll let you know how it turns out!

-- Michael (LiquidNitro@hotmail.com), July 20, 2001.

i was thinking about making the center board (with the lens in the middle) but instead of making a box, i'd just attach it to some heavy black cloth, that way it'll be flexible and you can adjust it as much as you want.

do you guys think this is feasible?

-- JC (test@aol.com), July 22, 2001.

no!!!!! check out this auction it is the best in town! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=1618947835&r=0&t=0&showTutorial=0&ed=996097903&indexURL= 0&rd=1

-- RAFFI D (raf1208@rocketmail.com), July 22, 2001.

Could someone put up all of the links to the web pages about this on the message board. Also does the silver spray paint work. If so or not, what does?

Just for all of you non-believers out there,

-- Iced Fire (no@way.com), July 23, 2001.

IT WORKS!!!!!

-- iced fire (yeah@right.com), July 23, 2001.

Hey Everyone,

Read up on all this for the last few weeks until I found this board. I just went out and bought a full sheet of black foamboard im making a projector right now btw, im using these plans http://www.webone.com.au/~caoz/bsinstruction3.htm I bought a 3x Mag off ebay for 6 bucks and im ready to go. I will post pics tom after completion.

-Adam

-- Adam Powell (kegger@san.rr.com), July 23, 2001.

I have followed this whole 100 inch TV thing for a while - and actually bought one of the things off ebay from feverish for $10.00 - I knew I would probably only get a set of instructions and a mag lens - and that is what I got, so no loss - and shipping was fast anyhow. I never built one, but I have experimented with a small TV and lens, and you can get an image, no problem - so I don't think it is a scam (and really, true big screens work this way as well - they just use high brightness liquid cooled tubes instead).

I bought a while back a Fujix P401 projector cheap (low res picture, certainly - but still OK for TV viewing). I needed a cheap screen. I am sure others do as well.

Try a white shower curtain - stretch and tack it to a large frame to lessen the wrinkles. Even better is to use a white "blackout" shade - use two shelf brackets to mount the shade to the ceiling by first flattening one end of each shelf bracket, then drill and mount the shade mount to that flat end. Mount one bracket to the ceiling (use stud anchors or something strong), place one end of the shade in the shade mount of that bracket, then manuever the shade up, and place the second bracket where you want it for a tight fit (you may need help - I did it by myself, but it was tough). Remove the shade, mount the second bracket, then replace the shade. Now you have a screen you can roll up and down. It could also be mounted to a wall near the ceiling as well.

There are a few places online that sell actual projection TV lenses - they have a metal or plastic body, and glass or plastic lenses, plus focusing screws - you can usually find them for $15-30. Might be something worth playing with.

Another thing - fresnel lenses are "half" lenses - ie, think of it as a convex lens that has a flat back, cut into rings, then the rings nested inside each other - in effect, you only get half the magnification. Place two of the lenses smooth side to smooth side - align the rings _perfectly_ (hard part), glue them together, and get double the magnification (though with some light loss).

Another thing to try (only have seen plans in one book - Homebrew Virtual Reality by Robin Cook) - use the LCD system from a handheld TV - place in the slide mount area of a slide projector (have to remove the backlight from the TV unit - tough, tedious work), and project the LCD image (same as expensive LCD projectors - only they use higher res LCD displays). One could get a nice high res TFT display handheld TV and try it - should get a real nice picture. You need LOTS of cooling, otherwise the LCD will either shutdown or burn out from the heat of the projection bulb. Can be expensive and difficult to build, but hey - on ebay people sell slide projectors all the time, and also handheld LCD TVs - it would probably only cost around $300 to build this. BTW - my Fujix I mentioned before is basically the same thing, in a smaller package (about the size of a couple of stacked VHS tapes).

I hope this helps someone - if anyone builds any of this, let me know!! Good luck!

-- Andrew L. Ayers (andrewa@indirect.com), July 24, 2001.

I just built this thing last night. I bought the Page Magnifier from Staples (8 1/2 X 11 in.) I am using a 13" TV. When it was finished, i tried it out on a wall. The picture was backwards, so to solve this probelm I had to put a mirror on top at a 45 degree angle and turn the TV on its back. It worked, but the image is still a little blurry. I have the bumpy side of the Lens pointing to the TV. Does any one know how to solve this probelm?

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), July 24, 2001.

You guys have spent WAY too much time on this 100 inch tv thing. Why can't you just be satisfied with your 19 inch tv's? I mean, if you don't want 'em I'll take 'em from ya...I think we can all learn a valuable lesson from this: size DOES matter, and using a fresnel lense to make it look bigger isn't going to impress the women ;o).

-- Wayne (wayneishere@hotmail.com), July 26, 2001.

Ok, well I have to admit that I too was pathetic enough to look into this a little (I might even try it some day...) and the site 100inchtv.com claims to have a way thats crisper, sharper, (and the part that caught my attention) BRIGHTER...so maybe if someone feels like paying the $10 they can post the instruction to us, if it's any different than the free instructions.

-- Wayne (wayneishere@hotmail.com), July 27, 2001.

I got copy of the 100 Inch TV Plans from them, and it is the same plans they are giving away free at BSTV. Here's what they say:

1. Process the light spectrum: Use a fresnel lens

2. Enhance the brightness level: Turn the brightness level all the way up on your TV (works better with old tvs), make the room as dark as possible, make sure the box is completely black and sealed.

3. Focus the image: See 'slider card' in the plans

4. Make it crisper: Turn Sharpness on tv to sharpest setting, use a very dark room, and USE A PROFESSIONAL SCREEN.

5. More colorful: Turn color level up high normal level

6. Make it brighter: Once again, the fresnel lens, black box, dark room.

Bottom line: Save your 10 bucks. Use the plans on the BSTV.COM site.

-- Dave L. (bigscreen@wow.com), July 27, 2001.

has anyone tried to put the fresnel lens as close as possible to the tv screen and then focus the image with another smaler lens. this should reduce the loss of light and make the picture brighter. also it should reverse picture once again so it would be only horizontaly reversed. then by positioning tv normaly and placing mirror by side after second lens picture should be normal. this way you shoud solve the color problem (the thing about degausser coil)

-- (milutinbre@yahoo.com), July 27, 2001.

i got this idea looking at the overhead projector!

-- (milutinbre@yahoo.com), July 27, 2001.

yeah, you right. Why don't we try the LCD panel and put on the back panel a hight watts of light and put on the font a fresnel len full size. I think it will brigth 50 times and don't care about dark room then your way or 100TV. I will post it on here when I done.

-- (luattran25@hotmail.com), July 27, 2001.

If we had an LCD panel, how would we get sound?

-- Moses Lee (speedracer@softhome.net), July 27, 2001.

If you use the LCD you can get sound from a VCR phonos or even headphone socket. What would you be using to generate the image signal for the LCD?? Can you get the sound from there?

Can any one email some images produced, what tv size used and lense??? before I start building. Thanks.

-- Dave Smith (smudger135@hotmail.com), July 28, 2001.

What the heck is an LCD?

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), July 29, 2001.

goto www.jollyland.2000c.net for 10 different types of instructions on how to make a 200 inch TV. ive made one of them, and two of my mates made 2 more, and all have crisp pictures

-- johno ooble (johnooble@mail.com), July 29, 2001.

To get a brighter picture, you have to amplify the light from within the projector. To do so you must line the inside of the projector with a highly reflective material. Also you must line the the area surrounding the fresnel lens or the magnifying lens with highly reflective material.This causes the lightwaves to multiply; a multitude of lightwaves amplified by the fresnel lens will create a brighter picture. The only downside is that there is the risk of distortion. The distortion may just be a picture so bright you wouldn't be able to distinguish anything.

-- DepressionAssasin (depressionassasin@yahoo.com), July 29, 2001.

from your PC if you have TV card

-- (luattran25@hotmail.com), July 29, 2001.

I was thinking about your brightness problem. I think it could be that you are using a box with a circle cut in it, that would mean that not all of the light is exiting through the circle. So i thought that you could use the box to find you focal point measure very very accuratly and make a pyramid shaped projector. Just don't what ever you do line that with a reflective substance paint it flat black. I think this will work but i have yet to try to even make a box so if someone could try my idea and post pictures or other ideas to make my idea better that would be a great help. Thank you. If you have any questions i have a picture of this that i could email to anyone who wants to try it.

-- ih8harrah (ih8harrah@excite.com), July 29, 2001.

What sort of reflective material should i line the inside of the box with and what sort of magnifying glass (2x, 3x, 4x ect ?

-- king (theleetguy@yahoo.com), July 31, 2001.

Why tyhe hell isnt anyone posting pics?

-- pissed ff (sickofthis@100inch.com), July 31, 2001.

I went to www.jollyland.2000c.net, and couldn't find the plans anywhere.

-- Pamela Lee (pamlee@stars.com), July 31, 2001.

mi2

-- YoungSang (redox@lycos.co.kr), August 01, 2001.

what the hell are the polarizing sheets for? and could you please fix that link or your website to actually have those links with plan you talked about.oh, and has anyone thought of using an old trtansparency projector? dissassemble the bottme and use the tv as the light source.

-- bill gates (dalwizard@aol.com), August 02, 2001.

I made this thing yesterday, i have a mirror, fresnel lens(page magnifier) and all the stuff from many different pages. I made the inside of the box black and it is completely sealed. The picture on my roof is bright enough, but it is all blury. Please I need some answers, and what way are the smooth, and the rough sides of the lens meant to be faced.

-- john o' leary (gwok@eircom.net), August 02, 2001.

Considering that there are only two sides to the lense...how hard would it be to figure that out yourself?

-- Wayne (wayneishere@hotmail.com), August 04, 2001.

hehe

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), August 04, 2001.

Have not tried this yet, but do have a real projection screen. Has anyone tried you smaller tv's, but using more than one like the regular 3 gun projections screen tv's? You might get a brighter image. Also a posibility is to use an lcd screen.

-- (clark_pace@hotmail.com), August 08, 2001.

I just built one it's ok the image is a bit blurry but I didn't expect much for $10. I bout the lense at office depot for 7 bucks. I think the people online are just trying to make some money. My 13 tv would screw up colors when you turn it upside down

-- Zazz (Stealthbrowser3@aol.com), August 08, 2001.

I just built one it's ok the image is a bit blurry but I didn't expect much for $10. I bout the lense at office depot for 7 bucks. I think the people online are just trying to make some money. My 13 tv would screw up colors when you turn it upside down. But thanx Jon the thing worked and the color is fine thanx. Well for 10 it's fine. Bit less then I expected.

-- Zazz (Stealthbrowser3@aol.com), August 08, 2001.

Hey I've been messing around with that thing and it's great. If you put a flashlight or a lightbulb iside a corner of the box you can display pictures and objets on walls too. I put a lava lamp behind it and it's cool it looks like I got a 3 feet tall upside down lava lamp on my wall and the cool thing is it uses no extra power. Just a lava lamp infront and you got a huge lavalamp. But the best thing is pictrues you put a light in it and a picture upsidedown back there and theres a light poster on your wall. Great for porn. HUGE PORN POSTER!!!!! The TV is kind of blury and looses some detail, it looks great on cartoons though like the simpsons.

-- Zazz (Stealthbrowser3@aol.com), August 09, 2001.

Hello, just a quick question would the Full Page Magnifier, 8 1/2" x 11" work good? Is this the "Fresnel" lens? Or is it something else? I was just doing a quick search at officedepot.com and only found the full page magnifier...

Any help would be great! Nathan

-- Nathan P (Foo@bar.com), August 09, 2001.

yeah...?

-- Anonymity (none@none.com), August 10, 2001.

i tried this tv, i didnt expect much, but its crap, DO NOT try this, it is the worst thing ever. DO NOT TRY THIS. The quality is crap, its upside down, just watch your 13-14" tv, its better,brighter,costs no extra money or just buy a 28" widescreen tv. DO NOT waste your money on this piece of junk.

-- Mr. Garrison (badfvchghns@eircom.net), August 10, 2001.

Can somebody tell me why it is not possible to build one of these that doesnt have to have the Tv upside or on its back? I am sure if you use mirrors or something you could make it so your TV stand the way it is supposed to.

-- Dee (paypalmail@netzero.net), August 11, 2001.

you can, its just mirrors are harder to get the angle right

-- aa (aa@aa.com), August 11, 2001.

This is bull

-- Eric Cartman (suckmyballs@MrGarrison.com), August 11, 2001.

This 100” screen scam has been around forever. I first heard of it over 10 years ago in college and I’m shocked to find out that people are still getting sucked in too this day. Not being one to say something can’t be done before I see it for myself I built one of these “projection TVs” for myself. You can save a lot of money by going to staples and getting their 8” X 11” magnification sheet for only $5 and just use cardboard boxes for the rest (it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to build one of these). My conclusion is that the 100” big screen television is a simple little project to twiddle a raining Sunday away on but IT IS NOT A REPLACEMENT FOR A STANDARD TELEVISION SET. Animated films are “watch able” at best but a real live action film is unbearable and you can barely tell were the actors are. To get a picture I had to put a black sheet over the window and turn off all the lights and even then the picture was horribly dim. This is probably the reason you haven’t seen a picture posted of an actual screen’s image and the reason you have to totally seal the box, it’s not losing light to the lens it’s letting light out and lighting the room making the picture dimmer. I tried to take a picture of the screen with my digital camera but the image was just too dim the only way I would be able to get a picture would be to use my film camera and set the exposure for 1 minute. If I was a guessing man I would say that the 100” has about 50 to 75 lumens of brightness compared to a floor model 3 panel LCD of over1000 lumens so you might say that their claim of being close to floor models is a little exaggerated. But like I said this is a fun project to waste your time on but if you want to watch big screen films on a daily bases then your better off getting the real deal. I know they cost a lot but after you see the quality of the 100” you’ll see what I mean. I’ve fiddled with home made projection televisions for years and the only thing that came close to the real thing was to buy a plastic replacement lens housing for a rear projector (they’re pretty cheap) and then find a SMALL (we’re talking a few inches) television set and mount it flush to the lens and you’ll get a razor sharp image. The problem with this is that even though the image is sharp it’s still dime (not near the 100”) and the only way to make it brighter is to add more televisions with lenses (that is way the old CRT projectors had three CRTs) but then you get into alignment which is a pain in the ass and there is a slight color washout and after you buy all this crap you would’ve been better off just going out and buying none. Well that’s my two cents.

-- RL (rlayman2000@yahoo.com), August 12, 2001.

has anyone tried this with a computer monitor?, it should do alot better

-- josh (jkinney@cablespeed.com), August 12, 2001.

Wow. This is amazing. I havn't built it yet but I firmly belive it will work very well. I'm sure one of those old 14inch svga monitors would work really good at a res of 1028x786, I also have a tv card in my computer also so I will have excellent picture quality. God bless the man who invented this, I can now buy small tv's cheap and make them as big as I want. I do have some questions. Can you buy glass frenzel lenses? I belive glass would be better than plastic. How practical is this thing?, Is the results good?. I mean when your watching a movie, do you ever forget that your at home and think your accually really in a picture theatre?. Also what I think may help peoples problems with brightness is if they use a vCR as well. Most VCR's have their own brightness controls. So max on the vrc and max on the tv. Could people please come fourth who have built this device come forward and give your opinons on it please. Thankyou. oh and lots of pic's :)

-- James R (jrowland@ihug.com.au), August 13, 2001.

In the uk and at staples,I got the page magnifier,the black cardboard,the ductape,and stanley,all for about £20,and using an old projector screen.I took a couple of hours to put it together(piece of piss).Then in a blacked out room I watched a movie on a 6 foot screen.I was quite excited and did enjoy the experience. Although I would recomend one to try this, I am afraid its not the answer to cheap big screen viewing.The picture is far to dull and dismal.I supose I will have to wait till the new H.D compact projectors come down in price, the cheepest Ive seen so far is £1200(shit)

-- pat mac (patmcn56@hotmail.com), August 13, 2001.

I dont know what everyone is talking about. Mine works great. The picture quality is fair and the brightness is pretty good.

-- Lee Padre (Sharp@amu.edu), August 13, 2001.

What plan gets the best quility?

-- Victor Bashunov (bashunov@online-pro.com), August 13, 2001.

Well guys, I just brought a frensal lens for $2.75 from the newsagents. I did some messing around and I have to admit that it does work ok, except that I couldn't ever get a clear picture. But still, the thing I made was dodgy and done in less than 1/2 hour. This weekend I'll make it properly. B4 I do, I need some info so I make it the best first time out. with cutting the hole for the lens, is a bigger hole better or a smaller hole. Also how should I line the inside of the box. Some people say it's better with white or something reflective, others say Black. what should I do?

-- James R (jrowland@ihug.com.au), August 14, 2001.

Geee, I just ripped everything off the tv and just put the lens about 1 foot away from the tv and their was a picture on the wall. Thing was it was brighter and looked the same as if it was in the box. I think alot of people could get away with just putting a lens in front of their tv. Anyway, I have not been able to get a clear picture no matter what. I can't read any text that is on the screen. What should I do? could it be the lens? the frensal lens I don't know what x it is. I heard people say you get better quality by using the 3x lens. Well I would have brought one if I could find it. Can any1 here get a clear acceptable image to watch?, I want to start turing my home into a cheap picture threatre, but this problem has set me back. Is their a "turn your tv in a big tv' expert around here?. I really need someone who knows stuff so I can ask them questions.

-- James R (jrowland@ihug.com.au), August 14, 2001.

Hi guy, I have a glass fresnel len 1X(not plasstic). I took it out from LCD panel. it is cool, it is brighter then the plasstic. If any one know where they sale that. Please let me know the address. Thank you

-- skkkd (luattran25@hotmail.com), August 15, 2001.

Has anybody tried to bend the lens and set their tv setup on the dvd player to "16:9" ? Might make a nice anamorphic crap-in-the-box. People, get real.

50" widescren plasma, yeah baby :)

http://www.jvc.com/prof/Attributes/features.jsp?model_id=MDL101274

-- J.D (vertsync@hotmail.com), August 17, 2001.

Hey, to anyone still interested on this super crisp, larger than life, 3000-lumen picture display thing, you do not have to turn your tv upsidedown, tv's are not made to stand upsidedown so it might have mechanical damade after some time because the weight of the circuit board, electronic components and the crt are not supported very well. If you can open your tv, loosen the screw that holds the electromagnet at the end of the crt - the big glass that looks like a funnel, the electromagnet I am talking about is the one with four wires going through it. After unscrewing, turn the electromagnet 180- deg. (Some models have more than one screw.) You may need to disconnect first the four wires from the board. Don't worry, you can not go wrong in re-connecting the wires because it only fits in the correct position. After turning the electromagnet, tigten the screw. Just be careful not to over tighten the screw because the glass may break and implosion can kill you. You may consider wearing safety gogles. Another alternative is to re-wire the four wires and you can solve the backward text problem but this might damage the tv if not done correctly. I built mine with a focus mechanism using small electric motor and with cylindrical slider rather than the box so I can easily make minute adjustment to the focus. Mine works great because I follow all the esentials like the light proof projector and light proof room and I am not expecting much. There is no cheap replacement to the real thing. I only use this when I can not make my hands on the remote control of the family's wide screen tv. It is a good art project especially intended for elementary students so you might as well try it. Thank you very much Sarah of BSTV for the free plans, God bless you. Anyone with a question or violent reaction can e-mail me.

-- Buong Pangalan Ko Ay Philip (philipal@mozcom.com), August 17, 2001.

For a degausing coil try a soldering gun such as that made by weller. With the tv on start the gun several feet away and move it closer to the screen of the tv in a circular motion and then move away from the screen continuing the circular motion before stopping the soldering gun. This will demagnetize the screen quite adequately and most home workshops probably have one of these tools.

-- ron (southrb@post.com), August 17, 2001.

If you are looking to increase the size of a T.V. or a computer monitor without making a projector. Try out this site for frensel lenses http://www.edexen.com/spec.html they cost more cause of the size difference but they enlarge the screen and give a slight 3D effect. It all depends what you are looking for.

-- Thomas (zranktor@hotmail.com), August 19, 2001.

Does anyway have a URL for a website that sells the box?

-- K Moore (nevermoore@yahoo.com), August 24, 2001.

this thing does work,as said dont expect a million bucks.but the real question is...i'am over thrirty years old i remember a big ass old magnifing lense that you set up in front of your tv,anyone else remember?????this was of course before wide screen tv's but the funny,,,,these things worked ya'know why???? try putting a magnifier up to a page in a book,logic all the wide screen companys bought out the huge 6 foot magnifier's and now us white trash have to get jobs to buy are own 60 wide screens cause there too big to ripp off ha like that,but it true huh anyone know where to get the old 6 foot magnifier stand theres the winner this baby works excellent try looking in antiques or someplace cause these thing's are the real deal,no bs e-mail only in regards to the old 6 footer magnifiers,everyone else i think you should be happy with ya'poo-r mans wide screen tv if you arent too dumb to figure out how to make a simple cardboard box stick a (full page magnify lense in it)paint the damn thing and flip yer tv over stick a darn mirror up to the box and walla you have done it duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh seeya good luck boys..

-- wastenotimebuildit (xcia2@yahoo.com), August 25, 2001.

this 100"tv thing is pretty sweet, i tweaked it alot and i think it could be used in place of my normal telvision, you just have to have a pitch dark room (use foil over the windows and you're done)and some time fixing the focus and a good screen and then boom you have a huge tv, every body says don't waste your money but its cool and it's a good project.

-- chris (Xusloohcs@aol.com), August 25, 2001.

If your image is really blurry around the edges, but clear in the middle when using the magnifying glass. Here's how to fix it

get a screen (my screen is made up of 8.5" x 11" xerox printing paper taped together to form a large 6 feet by 4.5 feet screen. It can be made larger if you want).

and then curve the sides of the screen like a parabola effect. This is called a "torex screen". Just like this bracket symbol --> ) but horizontally.

You may want to have some long wire taped to the back to retain the curving. The curve has to be GOOD!! It takes a while, but it will fix the damn annoying "clear middle image and blurry edges" on the magnifying glass lens.

Enjoy

-- Alvin C. (homeworkman@home.com), August 25, 2001.

On second thought the message I stated before (above) Does not work too well. Damn I setup all this shit for nothing!!

You cannot have lens that look like this: ()

It has to look like this: |) flat on one end and curved on the other

-- Alvin C. (homeworkman@home.com), August 26, 2001.

Visit this link, it's just info. Not to help you build a projector!

http://www.howstuffworks.com/movie-screen1.htm

-- Alvin C. (homeworkman@home.com), August 26, 2001.

well if you use a tv that has a flat square tube(not a curved screen tv) you can eliminate the blury edges to your image.Right, now the only problem is how to increase the brightness level, apart from the obvios, any idears

-- patmac (patmcn56@hotmail.com), August 27, 2001.

I think I have a semi-solution for blurry edges. Well for anyone that has built one of these, you know how critical focusing is. You know that an 8th to a quarter of an inch "scoot" of the focusing box dramatically changes the image. Like patmac was just saying, Flat screens are great and less fuzziness around the area. the more of a curve the more fuzziness....and thats because the area near the the screen bulges out (depending on the curve)as much as 3/4 inch closer to the focusing lense. And 9 out of ten of us know that we look at the middle of the image to focus. Maybe, Just maybe if you could bend the fresnel a little to compensate some of that curve, you might get a better picture. I was thinking of using fishing line or something strong to hold the curve in place on the outer edges of the lense where it wont interfere with the picture. The reason I said this is a semi solution is because you can only bend it one was horizontally or vertically. Call me crazy, but this is my theory...I'm going home after work to try it.

-- Da illest Smurf Or Johnny for short (illkraft@yahoo.com), August 27, 2001.

To add to my last message...Maybe if you bend the lense squeezing the sides in making a vertical curve...you can make a torex screen to accomodate the horizontal fuzziness.

-- (Johnny)ill SMurf (illkraft@yahoo.com), August 27, 2001.

Yo, I want one of these but I haven't got much extra time these days.. Can I buy an already built one from someone? Just before I buy, I must see a picture.. I'm willing to put some nice cash down for one that's been built and works nicely.

Nathan

-- Nathan (natetom2001@yahoo.com), August 27, 2001.

well, i did some tweaking with mine, and i actually got it too work and it works good. i had a hell of a time finding a mirror, i finally found one small (i could only find huge ass ones, or car mirrors that were too small or magnifying mirrors that dont work). i got a mirror that size and it was really crappy, i accidently broke the mirror and used one of the pieces and it works great. so i have a passable 100 inch tv projector.

the downsides.

1. it does screw up your tv, you cant turn your tv upside down without screwing up the pic, i havent even bothered finding a degasser coil. turning the tv off (unplugging) only is a temporary salution, it works only well as a ceiling television, its kinda cool i have it at the foot of my bed and i reversed how i lay, a minor sacrafice. its good enough that im thinking about putting my dolby digital speakers on the ceiling and having the sourround on the side, the pic works great.

2. it only works well on the ceiling, ive tried paper,bed sheets, everything else, it actually looks sharper and better on your bare ceiling it may have something to do with the surface of the cieling, i have one of those non smooth painted ceilings, i dont know for certain.

3. you can only use it in the dark, it has to be a pitch black room, answering machine lights, clocks, any ambient light must be put out.y ou have to use it at night or cover your windows with a heavy dark blanket or if your lucky and you can (check with your landlord) paint your window black.

4. THE SECRET IS A PERISCOPE APPENDAGE THAT STOPS LIGHT FROM BLEEDING ALL THROUGH THE ROOM, IT WAS COMPLETLY CRAPPY BEFORE I DID THIS, I HAD ONE LAST SHOT I WAS GOING TO THROW IT AWAY. IT ALSO FOCUSES YOUR LIGHT UPWARDS. just make another box to cover the square hole (the sheet magnifyer part), MAKE IT LIGHT TIGHT, and then cut open the top to set the mirror end IN, that makes all the difference in the world, light is your enemy, ANY MINOR LIGHT MUST BE STOPPED, IT REALLY MAKES A DIFFERENCE, NOT YOUR SCREEN, AMBIANT LIGHT SCREWS UP YOUR PIC. it does work well, i wouldnt watch a comedy or a drama on it but sci fi films, scenery movies are awesome, esp. with dvd, ive probably watched t2 4 times, pitch black is great as well as jurrasic park and star trek II and first contact as well as hollow man, the empire strikes back, aliens and alien ressurection, they all worked fine with good quality pics. some moovies work better than others, sci fi stuff works great, animation works great, dvd (the wider widescreen versions) works really well.

TIPS::

IF YOUR HAVING PROBLEMS WITH A BLURRY PICTURE, TILT YOUR MIRROR 45 DEGREES IN AN ANGLE, look at the mirror surface, if its filmy wash it, the cleaner the mirror is the better the pic, try to get no streaks, im checking out a mirror place and getting my mirrors cut to size, i lucked out with the broken mirror piece. the measurements for the mirror are : 4 by 8 inches 4 inches/wide across 8 inches down, hope im reading this right. the second thing youll want to do is set the mirror in the periscope box long side down, ie. youll want the shortest part across, the longest side down. take the mirror in the periscope box and then moove it to the point towear the pic is less blurry, usually about the center of the fresnel lense or slightly off, youll have to experiment. also make sure your lense is not buldging after you tape it down, that may be all it needs, it needs to be as flat as possible, i gently tapped the center of the lense and fixed the problem. adjust too your own likeing. the mirror length greatly improoved the pic, their was too much light on the pic it made it too blurry before as well as having a clean mirror with no film on it works wonders im checking into a mirror shop for telescopes on any mirror cleaning stuff, windex streakless and other stuff hasnt worked so great as a cleaner, just plain water and a napkin has worked the best.

i have pics as well if you have questions, im getting mirrors professionally done, i use the page magnifyers at rite aid, thier is a difference, i tried a real big heavy one from office depot and it wasnt as good, i havent bot the x3 magnifyer available all over the net, but the x2 from rite aid works fine,

youll have to set the pic on your tv, the brightness has to go all the way up, the contrast i have almost all the way up on mine as well for a bright enough pic, before i couldnt view the mummy, now i can watch the mummy, every little bit helps.

youll want a sturdy box a light tight box, non reflective (the aluminum foil doesnt work, the more you can focus the light on the mirror the better). dont get a magnifying mirror they dont work (another problem i kept running into store mirrors with x3 or x5 magnification).

so its slightly a pain in the ass, but worth the results if you spend some time on it, i havent even spray painted or anything the inside of the box, i made a cardboard box, then backed it up with foamboard, dont use foamboard alone, the light bleeds through the box. enjoy-joe the email is vallid

-- joes sperm (friendlydood71@yahoo.com), August 29, 2001.

Guys. Guys. Guys. Seriously though.

Guys.

-- jim (james@homenet.com), August 31, 2001.

I was working on a homemade LCD projector and getting decent results when I stumbled across this thing. I have built one based on the idea however mine uses the focusing lense from a slide projector (purchased at a thift store) followed by the colimator from the same projector ( a clolimator is a pair of lenses that helps the projector concentrate the beam) It works pretty good, the main benefit I found is that it is not necessary to turn your TV upside down as most of the plans I,ve found suggest. A couple great Ideas I'd like to pursue are; 1. to use a stronger mag lense 3x, 4x, 5x, these would enable me to move the screen closer and set it up as sealed rear projection TV witch should enhance brightness. I have noted that the closer the first lense can be located to the tv the brighter the image and that the closer the screen is to the projecter the brighter and sharper the image, since my image is still "mirrored it is alraedy pefrect fro a rear projection. Have experimented with materials to project on and think I can improve projection by at least 30%.

2. Get 3 matching CRT based TV's (say 5-9 inch) set all up as projectors using matching opticks etc. plan way to mount all three together and project to same spot (overlaying one over another, this will require consistant screen distance) then build a Composite video(RCA) to RGB converter, seperate R, G, & B and use each to feed one projector as though it were a composite signal- NOW you have one thats even closer to the real thing for probably less than $300.00 new or using salvaged parts like i do for everything even cheaper.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), August 31, 2001.

Forgot to mention in my last contribution; That the 3 lense combination whitch "righted" my picture eliminating need for fliping TV allowed me also to build the entire unit as a portable, removable, easily mounted unit, eliminates need for a dedicated TV.

Any one interested in my new project "Rear projection color gameboy" give me a holler, this should work with any game boy, but may also have more serious applications if applied to say a graphing caculator or even a PDA.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), August 31, 2001.

I took a shot gun and blew two shots into my tv. I then inserted a dead moose inside. Email me if you want to meet the taco man. I am a nanny.

-- YO MaMa (shitcake@hotmail.com), September 05, 2001.

confused, would we?????

-- aaaa (aa@aa.com), September 06, 2001.

Does anybody know how to make a good rear projection screen

-- Jeppe Marcussen (no_way@msn.com), September 06, 2001.

I haven't perfected mine, but anyways here is some info on how to invert your screen to keep from having to use a mirror or flip your monitor upside down. http://geocities.com/easton17066/screeninversion.html . Later then - Seth

-- Seth (ste980@hotmail.com), September 07, 2001.

thanx for the inversion photos,but would anybody know if there is a way to make an internal adjustment to your tv, so as to increase the brightness level?

-- pat mac (patmcn56@hotmail.com), September 07, 2001.

WHAT BLUR???? I am working with another version now using the recomended lense. I have made some interesting observations that might help anyone not satisfied with image quality. I have found that a good percentage of the "blur" in the image I had previously was caused by diffused light coming from the TV and thru the lense. I am setup on a 13" color TV getting about a 90" picture very, very clear. I found out almost by accident that the actual image as carried thru the magnifying glass (Fresnal 2X 8.5x11)takes a much smaller area than has been recommended. If you take a piece of cardbord and slide it in front of your aperature slowly while wathcing the projected image you will first notice a slight diming at that edge of the image (put some text on screen ie: VCR menu, cable menu, credits from a movie etc...)this is extremely delecate but watching that edge look what is happening to the text on that edge, the "blur" which is actually better described as a "glow" is dissapearing, do this on all edges and then tape your cardbords in pplace your image will get dimmer if you overdo it but if your patient you'll be surprised how sharp of an image you can get. This also poits out that you do not need a circular mask on your lense but a rectangular one. ON BRIGHTNESS- most of you have probably already discovered this but it took me a little while so I thaught I'd point it out- DON'T assume that maximum brightness on your TV controls will give the best image, I found that with max bright I had a "washed out looking picture" but when I turned DOWN the brightness I was pleasantly surprised to find that the increase in contrast more than made up for the extremely slight loss of light. BEST IMAGE YET- If you want a really sharp projector use Black and White TV so you lose color but its still alot of fun and a much brighter more contrasted more watchable picture great if you like to watch old movies. REMEMBER- 100" TV is a suggestion, you can get a brighter image by having the projector closer to the screen, and as I found in a completey different version of the projector A lense that is able to be placed closer to the screen such as slide projector lenses I spoke of earlyer can give a brighter image (Larger magnification lenses 3x, 4x, 5x, 6x would utilise both of these improvements.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 07, 2001.

Ok kids, this tv projection systems using fresnel does works, BUT they can't beat a LCOS projection sistem, anyways, only those who are really tv addicts would like to spend 1000's on such projectors. Here are some solutions I've found for the systems, 1) Try to build your box using wood or other hard fiber, that will help you to have much more control when focusing (wich is hard, but never impossible).

2) Make your own screen by using a white sheet of fabric and use that "chrome" paint on it, only paint it lightly to make it look a little more "silver" but never try to super-cover the sheet. This trick was used on old projection systems and it helps to reflect much more light than a standard wall, it's still white enough to keep your colors and reflective enough to make it look brighter. 3) Use a dedicated tv for your projector, do not try to use your common used tv for it, cuz you need to tape it, fix it and sometimes tweak it, so , have your special tv ready to use on those SPECIAL events, again, it's not a super-projection system, and if your just obsessed with tv, go and buy a 900,000'inch tv.

4) try mirrors for fixing your upside-down problems, remember that you made your box of wood or mako-cell and you can not fix it firmly on your box, and no problems will occour (mine works with 2 mirrors to fix upside-down and backwards problems)

5) Get your projector where you can have a very very dark place, remember that over-brighness on your screen will make your tv die younger, but it's special for your tv projection system, so it's ok right?.

6) While making your box, be sure that this system will only let you see tv, it's not a computer monitor, you will even have problems playing console games, but for movies, cartoons and tv shows is just enough.

The rest of building is up to you, but for those morons that didnt build it right, they might think it's just pure crap. Do things slowly and straight and this kind of projection systems will work.

btw, I know people wants money for this, and that's why I'm not going to post my plans, but the technology needed for this kind of stuff is not to pay even a cent for it. Go, buy your stuff and start working on it, try other kind of materials till you find the perfect match, that's all.

Remember, have fun.

-- Alfonso B. (flynk@spunkit.com), September 07, 2001.

If you are going to use a round glass lens. The lens have to look

like this: ---> (| - round on one end and flat on the other side.

using this will make sure you will get NO blurry edges of your projected image. And it's brighter and clearer.

I got my lens from the overhead projectors used for presentations from school. They did not need the overhead anymore. Take the part that is used to project the image that will give you ideas.

So make sure you ask your school if they have any old shit like that, they are no longer using. Remember, Do not steal!

-- Alvin C. (homeworkman@home.com), September 07, 2001.

I just heard about this... I've cut out the card board and stuff but I just need the lens... If I get the fresnel lens from staples that's 8 1/2 x 11 inches, do I still make the hole in the center of the unit circular? Or should I shape it to the rectangular lens? Also, does anyone know if they carry a lens like this at Radio Shack? Thanks for your help. Please email me ASAP if you can answer these questions.

-- sean (seanwojo@aol.com), September 08, 2001.

Hi, heres a suggestion, dont use crappy 10" TV's think about it, if you use a 20"-25" the picture is going to be much bigger and more easily focused if you want to make the image a bit smaller. Anyways i want to make a rear projection screen, like make a box, painted black inside, have the projecter TV sitting on the botton of the box facing upwards, have a mirror on an angle above it and have a thin white/silver surface covering an 80" or so large hole on the front so it would be just like a normal rear projection system, it wouldnt cost much more to make than the projector and it would work fine in the day too, im really stabbing in the dark to know what measuremenst/sizes/angles to use if anyone has done the same thing i would appreciate if you could send me the instructions to theleetguy@yahoo.com or if anyone could give me some ideas it would be a help to, __ mirror-> / <-screen / | |___| <-TV

-- k1ng (theleetguy@yahoo.com), September 08, 2001.

Does anybody know where I can buy some good quality materials to build this thing (I just wanna muck around with it for fun) in Australia? Cheers.

-- Jon P (chokolatemousse@hotmail.com), September 09, 2001.

has anyone tried this out for a computer monitor...i'm very interested to see the results...please let me know.

-- Flyerfan (sml160@aol.com), September 09, 2001.

Wow. I built it and it works. I can't believe it. A majority of the building time is just cutting the cardboard and fitting the lens right. I put aluminum foil over the windows and duct taped everything really tight. I taped computer paper onto the wall to give it a white surface. It's blurry and still rather dim even though it's really dark in here, but for 10 bucks? Tihs is the coolest ten bucks I've spent in a long time. This won't replace a big screen, and doesn't have much success on my PC monitor (I think it's waaaaay to blurry for that), but well worth the little amount of time spent on it. It will impress friends and family so go and do it! -Sean PS: I used 18'' in depth for my box, I read 35'' somewhere else, has anyone tried both and know which length is better?

-- sean (seanwojo@aol.com), September 09, 2001.

So its been 5 or so months, people have been fussing, complaining about dimness, selling, laughing, and all because google.com decided to put this page first on their search engine.

Ladies and gentlemen, this is what we need. Someone has to research all that has been done and said and just give us the answer in one big gulp, tell us everything we need to know casue its getting too complicated. Im not going to do it cause im too confused already but please, one of u wiz kids that made it perfectly, TELL US WHAT WE NEED TO KNOW and maybe there will be something good in it for you, like satisfaction of helping mankind. This is what i have to say and im sticking to it.

Later The Fox

-- the fox (justmaking@sugestion.com), September 09, 2001.

WOW!!! I Now Have an effectvely watchable (Light Similar To a Home Movie Projector) 115" screen (78"x54")extremely sharp picture that is even viewable with a dim light on in the room. For anyone getting frustrated it is worth if you stick to it!!!

Here are all the secrets I've picked up and used, thanks to evryone who gave me all the great ideas.

1)PATIENCE IS A VIRTUE, this is my third version of projector, took about 4 weekends.

2)START WITH A GREAT PICURE!!- if you start with a crappy picture you will reap what you sew. Mine is based on a 13" SONY TRINITRON Flat Screen CRT.

3)SEAL EVERTHING LIGHT TIGHT no mater what don't let those little rays escape, becoming ambient light in the room.

4)USE A MATERIAL YOU CAN WORK EASILY WITH. I used black on black 3/8" Sturdy Board. Easy to cut, No Painting needed, Flat black surface. IT IS very important to have a black interior in your projector no matter what!!!

5)DON'T BUILD FROM A DRAWING! Cut ech piece and fit it in place, then measure your next.

6)MAKE FOCUS TIGHTLY ADJUSTABLE! Mine is a tight box that slides in and out.

7)USE THE FRESNEL LENSE!!! this carries the light best althought I think that you could get better result with a round lense about 5 or 6" in diameter.

8)EXPERIMENT WITH DIFFERENT MIRRORS! Mine is a bevel edged 6" diameter mirror from Michaels Art Store. A Cheap mirror will cause a slight image doubling effect that will drive you nuts.

9)USE A SEMI-GLOSS PURE WHITE SCREEN! Mine is made of 4 peices of 30"x40" foam-core.

10)USE MY INOVATION OF AN ADJUSTABLE APERATURE! After the mirror I have a sandwitch of cardbord with for "Shutters" that slide in and lock down with small screws. This allows me to individually close each one until the glow comes of of a text screens letters. This is the key to GRAT FOCUS!!!

11)After my final aperature I have built a Trapezoidal Sleave that extends about 12 inches growing in size as it aproaches the screen. this is to block even more ambient light and works great.

12)BUILD YOUR INNER SLEAVE TIGHT TO EDGES OF THE TV! This helps cut down on unfocused abient light before the magnifier.

13)YOUR LENSE MASK SHOULD BE A RECTANGLE NOT A CIRCLE! Mine is a one inch boarder all the way around the Staples Lense.

14)VIEWING! When viewing esp4ecially with a crowd turn of all the lights in the room with TV off. Talk and wait afew minutes until every ones eyes have adjusted, then turn on your TV as TV gets Brighter Image gets brighter, this is better than having the image already up and having everyone get a DIM first impression.

15) THANKYOU WHOEVER YOU ARE! Thanks for the tip about unplugging the TV 15 minutes. I don't understand why but I had color problems with the TV on its Back I unplugged the TV for 15 Minutes, then plugged in and powered up for perfect color, THE TV IS STILL ON ITS BACK!!!!

16)LAST BUT NOT LEAST! Fine tune your image for exactly what you are watching BRIGHTNESS AT MAX IS NOT ALWAYS BEST! With bright all the way up my image becomes "milky" on most stations, but at normal the gain in contrast is awsome.

I have a SHARP IMAGE WITH RICH COLOR AND LIGHT QUALITY CLOSE TO A HOME MOVIE PROJECTOR!!!

If you can't afford a Great TV to Start With Build it Black and WHITE this gives better contrast, brighter image, and when people watch old movies they expect less.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 10, 2001.

TURN MY TV UPSIDE DOWN ARE YOU NUTS!

My current and best projector is admitadly on its back, however there are 2 ways around this.

1)Use asystem of 3 mirrors to effectively "flip the image", if you start out w/ uside "mirrored image" you must use an ODD NUMBER of mirrors to corect it 1st mirr on 45 to TV 3rd mirror on 45 to screen middle mirror on 45 to both 1st and 2nd mirror (2 axises) now your image is upright and no longer "mirrored", it shoots out toward the bak of your tv though.

2)Buy an old slide projector and use a 3 THREE lense setup, the initial focusing lense and the colimator tube (contains two lenses). Do not use the "Green" lense this only serves to filter out the heat of the incandescent bulb that is the light source of the slide projector.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 10, 2001.

i am new at this and maybe this is really stupid but if you build this thing completely tight and not let any light out then is it possible to hook up some sort of flourescent light inside the box (low wattage) to increse the brightness of the screen? it would have to be done at the right angle as to not screw up the reflections you'll be getting but it would seem to me if you want a brighter screen then you have to manufacture that light from somewhere? i could be wrong, and it is just a thought...someone let me know...i am going to start construction real soon. I am going to use it on my computer monitor to play video games...has anyone done this? do they think it can/will work...please reply!

-- flyerfan (sml160@aol.com), September 10, 2001.

Hey Flyer fan, you've touched on a good thought there. I think a flaurescent light would wash out all the colors but let me know if you try it. I have been toying with the Idea of putting a "blacklight" inside the box and or an Infra Red Light source to increase the available light spectrum without visually interfering with the image, but have not and will not try this for a while.

I'm possative this will work with a CRT based Computer monitor and plan to build one as soon as possable. I plan on my next one to try building the whole thing around a TFT LCD Screen I have getting the absolute best possable image, and then taking the back off the screen and replacing the backlight with a 500 watt light source from a projector, using heat filters and a fan.

Before I heard of this I was experimenting with it and had a successfull very small projector that could gett to about 60" image however I used a regular LCD and the low res was awful!!

Here is a tidbit for all you industrious folks; ANY LCD SCREEN THAT IS BACKLIT WILL BE TRANSPARENT/semi-transparent IF YOU REMOVE THE BACKLIGHT ASSEMBLY. This means you essentially have a virtual piece of glass "film" that will image from a video source.

Oh Yeah the other problem with using a regular LCD even if you can get really high res is the redraw rate causes a "trail" effect.

Also there is a company out there coming up with High Res LCD Type Displays at the size of a postage stamp, I'd love to get my hands on one of these.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 10, 2001.

Just beginning to look into building on of these fun things. Found the UK site below for lenses. Hope it helps. Laterz.

http://www.magnifyingglasses.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Page___Sh eet_Magnifiers_8.html

-- Dave (dpp@www.com), September 10, 2001.

Yo- If someone can buy these instructions for 30 bucks at this site- http://www.earthprofit.com/ and post them on here, I think the problem will get solved about this tv thing.

-- James (no1stunna94@yahoo.com), September 10, 2001.

mine works great, i have the window in my room tacked with thumbtacks (couple of heavy tablecloths), build a periscope aparture for your mirror to keep out of light, i can tell who the actors are, etc. i wouldnt watch a comedy in it, works best with sci fi flicks or something with a lot of visuals, old film works great as does black and white and animation. it does work, but if your only spending 15 min on it expecting a result of perfection, dont bother. dvd is also great, only a few movies were unwatchable (titanic, to much blurr). i have the blurr removed from my letters, try using different sizes of mirrors, make sure your mirror is clean (not filmy with fingerprints, look at it in the sunlight, that may account for blurr problems). its not perfect but it is remarkably close to low end big screen tvs, im unimpressed with big screen tv quality quite frankly, and your not going to find a 100 inch one most likely. (someone always likes contradicting, they do make 100 inch projectors but who can afford 3,000 or 2,500 dollars min for a projector. keep with it patientce is a virtue. (mine is a cieling one, cant get the tv from colorizing, unplugging it doesnt work for me and ive tried 2 tvs, it works only temporarily).

-- joes sperm (friendlydood71@yahoo.com), September 10, 2001.

has anyone used the x3 "fresnel" lense you can buy off the internet and is it any better than one from say rite aid or home depot at x2? dont bother with people who heckle, im sure they heckled car makers when they were just hobbiests too. if you guys who heckle dont have the patience dont read on this webpage, go back to chatting and cussing people out. i wonder just how good you can get the pic, every little minor trick you add ads like 10% to pic quality. someone with a digital camera might want to make some real pics of the picture they have.-joe

-- joes sperm (friendlydood71@yahoo.com), September 10, 2001.

Hey Joes Sperm, If yours is a ceiling projector, you can build the mirror system & keep your tv right side up, if image is in wrong position for veiwing turn the box around, not upside down. This should solve color problem at least if you can illiminate damage already done, with the uplugging thing, and then turn the tv on in upright position.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 11, 2001.

Why would you pay $30 for the plans??? They're posted in the first message on this page! THey work perfectly. I have it in my room, it's 104 inches, very very clear now and still bright. I can read text on the preview channel. It takes an hour to make. You don't have to waste your money on plans with diagrams. Just do what the plans here say! The one tip I have is to cut out a piece of cardboard so that only a circle in the middle of your lens shines through. |_O_| This is so simple, those of you who say you can't get it to work or you don't believe it, you are idiots. It's a long box with a magnifying lens in the middle in a dark room. Tada.

-- sean (seanwojo@aol.com), September 11, 2001.

How clear are these things. Like as clear as the normal tv or what.

-- James (no1stunna94@yahoo.com), September 12, 2001.

FOR FREE STUFF, GO TO THIS SITE!!!!!----> http://m79blowup.Madhive.com/signup/ and SIGN UP!!!

-- FREE STUFF (mastap@hotmail.com), September 12, 2001.

OK I'VE TRIED TO MAKE THIS THING MANY DIFFERENT TIMES USING ALL KINDS OF DIFFERENT TECHNIQUES. WHAT I HAVE DERIVED FROM THE PRACTICE IS THIS........ DON'T BOTHER MAKING THIS PROJECT IF YOU DON'T HAVE A FLAT SCREEN TELEVISION, UNLESS YOU ARE PATIENT, NOT EXPECTING MUCH, NOT ON A LIMMITED BUDGET, OR IF YOU ARE JUST DOING THIS PROJECT FOR FUN OR EXPERIMENTATION. I HAVE TRIED DIFFERENT TELEVISION SIZES AND THE ONE I PREFER IS MY 24". IT PRODUCES A LARGER PICTURE THAN THE 13" AND THAT IS MORE OF WHAT I LIKE. LET ME NOW SAY THIS LOUD AND CLEAR FOR ALL OF YOU......IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A FLAT SCREEN TELEVISION, YOU ABSOLUTELY CANNOT GET A PERFECTLY FOCUSED PICTURE UNLESS YOUR MAGNIFYING LENS IS SHAPED EXACTLY THE SAME AS YOUR PICTURE TUBE. THINK ABOUT IT...... IMAGINE A SMALL PYRAMID, SMALL ENOUGH TO FIT IN YOUR HAND(PALM FACING UPWARD), WITH THE POINT AT THE TOP OF THE PYRAMID POINTING TOWARD THE SKY. NOW IMAGINE TAKING YOUR FIRST FINGER FROM YOUR OTHER HAND AND PUSHING THE POINT OF THE PYRAMID TOWARD THE BASE UNTIL IT IS JUST SLIGHTLY ABOVE THE BASE. THE RESULT IS SIMILAR TO HOW YOUR TELEVISION SCREEN IS SHAPED. THERE IS NO WAY YOU COULD MAKE A FLAT OR EVEN A SLIGHTLY ROUNDED LENS MATCH THE SHAPE OF YOUR TELEVISION SCREEN. THEREFORE YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO FOCUS EVERY GIVEN PART OF YOUR PROJECTED IMAGE. NOW ON THE OTHER HAND IF YOU HAVE A FLAT SCREEN TELEVISION AND YOU HAVE A FLAT LENS, THEN YOU HAVE A BETTER CHANCE OF GETTING A QUALITY PROJECTED IMAGE. ONCE YOU HAVE AQUIRED THE FLAT SCREEN TELEVISION,(LARGER SCREEN SIZES PRODUCE A LARGER PROJECTED IMAGE...A SMALLER SCREEN SIZE PRODUCES A BETTER PICTURE, BUT A SMALLER PROJECTED IMAGE)FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS FOR BIG WOODY......http://www.webone.com.au/~caoz/bstv.htm LOOK CLOSELY AT THE PICTURES. MAKE SURE THE BOX FITS TIGHT TO YOUR TELEVISION. USE THE THINNEST MAGNIFYING LENS YOU CAN FIND (FLAT FULL PAGE READER, I LIKE THE ONE FROM RITE AID THEY ARE $2.99 AND ARE THIN)BECAUSE IT ALLOWS MORE LIGHT THROUGH. MAKE SURE YOU HAVE A VERY DARK ROOM WHERE THE IMAGE WILL BE PROJECTED. COVER ALL YOUR WINDOWS, TURN OFF ALL YOUR LIGHTS AND ANY LIGHT YOU CAN SEE NEEDS TO BE BLACKED OUT IF YOU WANT A GOOD PICTURE. YOU CAN PROJECT THE IMAGE ON TO A WHITE WALL. IF YOU CAN, PUT BLACK SHEETS OR FABRIC EVERYWHERE EXCEPT THE SPOT YOU HAVE DESIGNATED FOR YOUR PROJECTED IMAGE. MAKE SURE YOU HAVE BLACKENED OUT THE INSIDES AND OUTSIDES OF YOUR PROJECTOR BOX "COMPLETELY" WITH FLAT BLACK SPRAY PAINT(NOT GLOSS BLACK)EVERY PART OF YOUR BOX MUST BE BLACK EXCEPT THE LENS. WHEN YOU MAKE YOUR BOX, DO NOT "PERMANANTLY ATTACH" THE FRONT PIECE HOLDING THE LENS UNTIL YOU HAVE TESTED YOUR PROJECTED IMAGE. MAKE TWO DIFFERENT FRONT PIECES....ONE WITH A ROUND HOLE AND ONE WITH A RECTANGULAR HOLE. YOU SHOULD FOLLOW THE DIRECTIONS ON THE BIG WOODY WEB SIGHT TO FIND THE CENTER OF YOUR HOLE. THE ROUND HOLE SIZE SHOULD BE THE LARGEST SIZE YOU CAN GET ON THE MAGNIFYING LENS. THE WAY I DID MINE WAS TO TAKE A PIECE OF PRINTER PAPER AND AN INK PEN, LAY THE PAPER ON TOP OF THE LENS AND (STARTING AT THE OUTER MOST RING ON THE LENS)TRACE INSIDE THE GROOVE. CUT OUT THE CIRCLE AND TRACE IT ON THE PIECE TO BE MOUNTED ON THE FRONT OF YOUR PROJECTOR. TO MAKE THE RECTANGULAR HOLE SIMPLY TRACE AROUND THE LENS AND MEASURE IN ABOUT A QUARTER INCH ALL THE WAY AROUND. USE TAPE TO TEMPORARILY MOUNT THE LENS TO EACH PIECE AND PROJECT AN IMAGE THROUGH THEM TO FIND OUT WHICH HOLE MAKES THE BEST PICTURE FOR YOUR SETUP. I PREFER THE RECTANGULAR HOLE MYSELF. HERE'S THE IMPORTANT THINGS TO REMEMBER....DARK ROOM- LIMIT REFLECTED LIGHT; FLAT SCREEN TV; FLAT, THIN, PLASTIC, FRESNEL(OR GROOVED) FULL PAGE MAGNIFYING LENS 2X OR 3X MAGNIFICATION; FOCUSING BOX OUTSIDE DIMENSIONS NEED TO BE JUST SMALLER THAN THE INSIDE DIMENSIONS OF THE LARGER BOX, THEY MUST FIT TIGHTLY TOGETHER TO PREVENT THEM FROM SLIPPING OUT OF FOCUS; BLACK PAINTED BOX, EVERYTHING EXCEPT THE LENS MUST BE BLACK; PROJECT ON TO WHITE WALL, OR SMOOTHE PAINTABLE SURFACE PAINTED WITH KRYLON #1401 BRIGHT SILVER; IF YOU WANT TO AVOID USING MIRRORS OR TURNING YOUR TELEVISION UPSIDE DOWN YOU CAN FOLLOW INSTRUCTIONS ON THIS SIGHT, IT WILL MAKE YOUR TELEVISIONS IMAGE BACKWARDS AND UPSIDE DOWN JUST BY SWITCHING TWO WIRES ........http://geocities.com/easton17066/screeninversion.html IT WORKS, I DID IT ON BOTH TELEVISION SETS JUST BE VERY CAREFUL. WHEN YOU ARE FINISHED MAKING ALL THE ADJUSTMENTS AND YOU HAVE A PRETTY GOOD PROJECTED IMAGE, TAKE A PIECE OF CARDBOARD (LARGE ENOUGH TO COVER THE LENS)AND PUT IT IN FRONT OF THE LENS. THIS WILL BLOCK OUT THE IMAGE BEING PROJECTED AND THE ROOM SHOULD GET REAL DARK. YOU WILL BE ABLE TO SEE WHERE LIGHT IS ESCAPING FROM THE PROJECTOR,OR BLEEDING INTO THE ROOM. GOOD LUCK, OH AND I SPENT $19.95 ON THE INSTRUCTIONS BEFORE THIS MESSAGE BOARD WAS ESTABLISHED. IF THIS HELPS YOU OUT....HELP ME OUT. ONE LAST WORD... MAKE YOUR BRIGHTNESS ADJUSTMENT THE VERY LAST THING YOU DO. BRIGHTER IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER, YOU WILL GET A CLEARER PROJECTED IMAGE IF YOU TAKE CARE OF THE REFLECTED LIGHT AND TURN THE BRIGHTNESS DOWN A BIT.

-- Chance Knight (letsneck@aol.com), September 15, 2001.

Here are some helpful websights.....http://www.webone.com.au/~caoz/bstv.htm................. ..............http://www.competitionsound.com/24af41.html............. ..............http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html................. ..............http://www.admiralmetals.com/metric_conv.htm............ ..............http://www.3dglasses.com.tw/............................ ..also I forgot to tell you that the grooved sides of the lens goes toward the television, sorry for typos and punctuation, I posted without checking for typing errors....oops

-- CHANCE KNIGHT (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), September 15, 2001.

I've gotten rid of the box and just stood the lens about a foot and a half in front of my tv and... it works almost as well. The duct tape wasn't holding any more, so this works much better. Just make sure the room is dark. For those of you that made the 'big woody' project, how do you change the channel? Doesn't all that wood block the remote control? Also, how should I set up the mirror to fix the backwardsness? Should the mirror be about the size of the TV, or what? How close to the lens should it be? Thanks. -Sean

-- sean (seanwojo@aol.com), September 16, 2001.

Sean to change channels hook up your vcr and change the channels with that. The mirror has to be set at a 45 degree angleto your magnifying lens. Size is relative to how close the mirror is to your magnifying lens. So first you must decide how you are going to mount the mirror. Next, point your projected image toward the ceiling and take a good size piece of cardboard and hold it near the lens so the image is projected onto it. Now move the cardboard up toward the ceiling and down toward the lens. You will notice that the image gets larger on the cardboard as you move it farther away from the lens. You determine the size of the mirror by the size of the projected image on the cardboard, after deciding how close the mirror will be mounted to the lens. Remember, the mirror has to be placed at a 45 degree angle to the lens. Go tho staples and look at one of their overhead projectors for mirror mounting ideas. Good luck.

-- CHANCE KNIGHT (letsneck@aol.com), September 17, 2001.

i found it out no more blur for me ma ha ha ha hathe trick is to pul out and old sci book for high school look at the light section find the part about the lens and read .... : tv / light _ box ] magnifer whit out lens ___________ / ] :/ ] :- ] :\ ] _\________] the light wil bounce around befor getting to first lens the the new lens added _____________ :]-----------]/ :]-----------]/ :]-----------]\ :]-----------]\ the light goes strage to the 2nd lens whit out bounceing blur is gone wow i shoud have got paid for this

-- richard s and....... (funfink@hotmail.com), September 17, 2001.

could someone translate that to english

-- tom (tomtom@hotmail.com), September 17, 2001.

Hey, use a real projection screen if you can get one it makes an incredible difference. I had to put one together kind of patchwork and even reduced my size for the amount of material available but it was worth it. I want to make a bigger one and smoother surface but haven't been able to find one big enough. While I was working with the material though I noticed that it seems almost reflective. I plan to make a screen of white foam core and spray paint it with white reflector paint I think this will do the trick. Also I had a new idea to place a blacklight over the screen, the idea being that when white is under a blacklight it has a flaurescing affect that makes it "Brighter", now I'm not sure if this will make all other colors funky or what but I plan to try this one.

What is up with this guy sending the "morse code" above, sounds like he made an interesting discovery if we could get him to speak english?

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 17, 2001.

I was looking at a projector today and noticed that it has this fancy shmancy lens everyone talks about..and then another round glass lens..and i thought to myself..that makes a good, clear image. with 2 lenses..and the only reason the light needs to be so bright is because it just shoots up into the open air..SO! why does the projector box go straight out from the tv instead of placing the big square lens (the name of it escapes me now) right up against the screen and then having the box start out the size of the screen and then, as it makes its way out, put the round magnifying glass at the end..come to think about it..why doesn't somebody try a road cone! yeah! paint it flat black on the inside (real thick coat) secure a magnifying glass at the end and the larger square glass up against the tv screen..hmmm...this could be a ridiculous suggestion..maybe if the 2 magnifying glasses won't work..then just the one glass at the end of the cone..anyone with a good success story on the tv please e- mail me and if anyone wants to try my cone theory or tell me whats wrong with it feel free to send me a note as well. the only problem i see right now is focusing the tv..i believe it would help with the problem of the picture being too dim since less light would be wasted in the dead space up front..alright..perhaps thats idiotic..lemme know :) Thank You.

-- dlv (muskgrave@hotmail.com), September 17, 2001.

For those of you have trouble with the blurred edges. It is best to use only the inside 70% of most lenses. Anything farther out on the edge is subject to being less accurately focused since the light is bent more sharply. And the larger the lens, the more light that is captured, resulting in a brighter picture.

-- Cougar (cougar@go-concepts.com), September 17, 2001.

No, black lights don't help. I have a black light on right now. It makes the white screen glow almost blue, throwing off the rest of the colors, and it has the same effect as a dim light. Then again, my screen is just 75 sheets of computer paper taped to the wall, so I guess on a real screen it could be different, but I doubt it.

-- n/a (not@available.com), September 17, 2001.

Hey,I really enjoyed all the great answers and discussion on this topic and had a few laughs along the way. Now I have a different idea that someone might want to try. How about getting a couple of small fresnel lenses( like the page reader type )and make up a pair of cardboard glasses, like the 3D type, with these lenses in them. Maybe if you cut a 16:9 rectangular hole you can watch all your favorite movies in the widescreen mode. Be sure to get an office chair with wheels on it so you can move back and forth to focus properly. GOOD LUCK !!! MIKE

-- Michael De Chellis (mdc444@hotmail.com), September 18, 2001.

The two lense idea should work ok, but the reason for not "putting the fresnel lense right up against the screen" is the focal point of the lense and with two lenses you have to consider the interaction of two focal points, your lenses and the distance of your projection target will decide the distances for you. Also I have buit one with three lenses based on an old slide projector (The image uprights itself but remains mirrorred)the problem was the first lense wasn't big enough the image was brighter but it only picked up a portion of the image.

I just got handed and old TFT LCD Monitor for overhead projectors for freeeeee, so I'll be working on using this with a spotlight or somthing under it and the projector box we've all been working on on top. I think this holds more promise but have not yet begun to test.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 19, 2001.

HERE IS MY BEST TRY AT DECODING THE MESSAGE FROM-- richard s and....... (funfink@hotmail.com), September 17, 2001 HERE GOES.................................................................. ENGLISH TRANSLATION: I FOUND OUT HOW TO STOP THE BLUR ON MY PROJECTOR HA HA HA HA, THE TRICK IS TO PULL OUT AN OLD SCIENCE BOOK FROM HIGH SCHOOL. LOOK AT THE LIGHT SECTION, AND FIND THE PART ABOUT THE LENS. READ THE SECTION PERTAINING TO TELEVISION LIGHT BOX MAGNIFIER WHITE OUT LENS. THE LIGHT WILL BOUNCE AROUND BEFORE GETTING TO THE FIRST LENS. NOW ADD THE WHITE OUT LENS, THE LIGHT GOES STRAIGHT TO THE 2ND LENS WITH OUT BOUNCING. THE BLUR IS GONE.......................SOUNDS LIKE HE MAY HAVE STUMBLED ON TO A LIGHT FOCUSING LENS OR DEVICE. SO GRAB YOUR HIGH SCHOOL SCIENCE BOOK AND SEE IF YOU CAN FIND THE SECTION HE IS TALKING ABOUT. IF YOU FIND OUT, PLEASE POST THE NAME OF THE BOOK, PAGE NUMBER, AND DETAILS ABOUT LENS FOR THOSE WHO AREN'T ABLE TO GET THEIR HANDS ON THE BOOK. WE'LL FIGURE THIS DAMN THING OUT WON'T WE!!!!!!!!!!!

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), September 19, 2001.

first, pardon my english. now, look at the overhead projector. glass plate on it (where you put transparent foil) is not actually glas, but reducing fresnel lens. it consentrate light on top lens, which is magnifying picture. if anyone has overhead projector try to put bottom lens from it on the tv screen. it should pick up much more light from screen than standard 100inchtv projector, making much more brighter picture on the wall. also, i think it should reverse picture once again and make it ok. try this on yahoo and you will find lot of interesting stuff http://google.yahoo.com/bin/query?p=overhead+projector+fresnel+lens&hc =0&hs=0

for example this:

http://www.unitedvisual.com/2tips/2tovrp103.asp http://www.rickleephoto.com/rlcoll.htm http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/John_Reder/fresnel.htm http://www.stewartfilm.com/business_professional_screens/business_prof essional_4.html

-- milutin (milutinbre@yahoo.com), September 22, 2001.

I just bought a fresnel lens(page magnigying sheet) at OfficeMax for 7 bucks. Gonna go home and try it out. If anybody has any pictures of the projector assembled(with mirror) please post them. I'm kinda like the guinea pig for this because all my co-workers wanna try it but think it is a scam. Wish me luck and if it works I'll post pics and tweaks(if any). By the way, does anyone know how well it works with 27" tvs?

-- tekkie (phoreverphantom@msn.com), September 22, 2001.

Hey. I would post pictures, but it's so damn dark in here that my [digital] camera just shows darkness. I think there are three things that are important to making a successful projector: 1. A dark room. I have aluminum foil and a black shower curtain over the only window in the room (yes, the neighbors may get worried, but it's fun to think up crazy excuses for aluminum foil over the windows [to block the gamma rays from space ships, etc]). 2. If you get the page magnifier, make sure only a circular-shaped window goes through it, in other words, block out the corners so only a circle is not blocked. This really cuts down on fuzziness, because I think the corners throw off the whole picture. 3. Make sure the lens is facing the right way! People that say this looks like a joke probably put the lens in backwards and never thought to turn it around. One way looks like a very small part is focused and the rest is just lines, the other way looks like TV! Of all of these though, it's most important to have a dark room, and don't expect this to replace a big screen, unless you always like sitting in darkness and don't mine a backwards picture.

Just my tips, good luck building.

-- sean (seanwojo@aol.com), September 22, 2001.

I bought the plans and fresnel lens, put it together and the image is OK, but the text on CNN is backwards! Will using a mirror correct this? I have seen sellers at eBay claim that you can use this with a computer monitor, but how could you read the text if it is backwards? PLEASE HELP. The picture is right side up...not backwards.

Thanks..Jeff

-- Jeff (jlr14941@aol.com), September 22, 2001.

alright I'm no genius, infact my knowledge of all of this is about as large as the period at the end of this sentence. However, I was surfing around after I found this (being that work is boring me) and came up with an idea. This of course may not even work but here goes. Now in Science class we used microscopes, fairly much the same principle that we ar etalking about here. If you didn't remember to turn that darn little light on the bottom on then you saw almost nothing. Now that light was not the brightest thing in the world yet if you opened the optic all the way the image was FAR too bright. So how did this little light produce such a large light was my question. Well it turns out that there is a lens in the microscope called a condenser lens, I believe. This is what condenses the light so you get a clear picture of the amoeba. Now for all you people out there that are trying to get a $2,000 TV for $20. Is it possible to use a large condenser lens (try this page I think http://www.goldmine- elec.com/images/Pages069-072.pdf) to condense the light just like a micrscope? Once again, I know I'll probably get flamed for this cause I have absolutely no idea of the concept behind all of this, just trying to help all of you out. I will go back to my corner now :)

-- BiG SpArM (smstewar@bw.edu), September 23, 2001.

Hey I have built this and it is nice and bright with the dvd DRIVEN w/ Stallone. My problem (and maybe someone can help me out) is the picture has a ghost effect, where it appears as if the light is reflecting back onto the tv screen from the fresnel lens and being projected along with the primary picture. It appears as an out of focus ghost of the primary picture and the two don't line up. I'd bet if someone can help me think of a way to keep the fresnel lens from reflecting back onto the tv screen I would have a great picture. I have tried the grey colored polarizing film, but it makes the colors very blah and not vibrant at all. Is there maybe a clear polarizer film that won't grey out the color? Or a way to block the reflection of the fresnel lens. Please post your thoughts. Don't email me because the address is not correct. Thank you

-- helpa brotherout (don'thave1@aol.com), September 26, 2001.

Hey, Helpabrotherout, I had the same problem with the image, but mine was caused by the Mirror I used, If you are using a mirror, and I don,t know how anyone can stand not to for more than an hour or so, (it drives me crazy seeing backward text)than experiment with different ones, by the way your mirror doesn't have to be nearly as big as your lense. I have found the best luck with a bevel edged mirror, I don't think the bevel has anything to do with it, other than indicating a higher quality glass.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 27, 2001.

Hey Sean, If you have a "white point" adjustment on your digital camera try adjusting it way down before taking your picture. Also you may have captured the image but can't see it well enough. Try taking one of your "dark shots" into photoshop or paint or some other image processing program, and pump up the contrast, the image, if anything was captured should appear before your eyes. I don't have a digital camera and have been to lazy to use my 35mm and then scan. If anybody wants just some good pictures of the project----- Go To Bigwoody.com----, well documented, FREE plans, lots of pictures. The only thing is it's as if they didn't take the project far enough, it's a single lense assemby, TV upside down, no mirrors but it is the beginning portion and nicely done.

-- mayberry (m_langway@bigfoot.com), September 28, 2001.

Thanks for your input Mike Langway. I do not have my projector set up with mirrors. I have gone inside the tv, which is a flat screen 20" Samsung (beautiful picture on tv), and rewired the tube so I didn't have to turn it upside down or use mirrors. I read a previous message of yours and you use some type of shutters, I need to see what your shutters look like. Any web sights you can post with something similar so I can visualize the shutters and triangle aperature? Thanks.

-- helpa brotherout (don'thave1@aol.com), September 28, 2001.

put a peace of glass over your tv screen(make sure it is biger by a bout 1inch aournd then your tv screen).. how it works light hits the glass wow but thats not all the magnifing lens will projectthe light on the glass not on your courved tv screen and cut down on glare help full hint number 2 the full page lens suxs ass it will be brighter the smaller lenses because of its size but it is so blury.... help full hint number 3 full page lens bulry the top of and over head projeter clear but dim i have found no way to get the best of bolt worlds but im trying i need to reely big lens so more light can go through them and on a final note dont but a full page len aka flensel lens

-- richard (richard@kinkylogic.net), September 30, 2001.

http://www.geocities.com/geopunk2000/classic_blue.html for plans

-- richard (richard@kinkylogic.net), September 30, 2001.

use glass lenses why you ask because crapy plasic lensens wont cut it the glass lens you suod use are the concave lenses fip it around and it is convects plasic ones try to do bloth steps in one but if get un focesd in the proces. this is what the two lenses do theconvects and concave lens are like pimple and dimpels concave is a dipel its curved par faces in concave is like a pimpel its faces out when light travels trough a convects lens it is pushed to geter to a tiny point that wher the con cave lens goses in it spreeds the light out but if to much ligh come from many drections it will blur so if you put the concave lens right wher the point of light from the othe lens is the smallest you will get a crisp clean image and if you have big lenses to work with it will be vary bright and one more hint if youhave a high magnifaction of lenses like insed of 2x for each lens lets say you had 10x for each the smaller you would have to make you box that hold you lenses the works no matter what you usesing no matter if it is a crappy full page magnifer or a ceap glass or plasic maginfing lens and the realy good concave/convects lensplz for give any spelling errors note thes are the lenses the other richard was tlaking about

-- richard (richard@kinkylogic.net), September 30, 2001.

I've just hooked up my mirror at a 45 degree angle... only problem is now I can't get the remote to work! The TV is facing sideways, so is there a solution besides using a VCR/cable box to change the channel? Using the remote now is pretty much useless. Does anyone know any ways to fix this so I can still use my remote effectively??? Thanks. -Sean

-- sean (seanwojo@aol.com), September 30, 2001.

hey that richard guy was right the two glass lenses and the glass in front of the tv wher better the one lens and no glass in front of the tv my pic is so much better now (it got a littel more dim cuss i got small lenses but it is F***ING CLEAR)

-- dark night (noemail@noemail.com), September 30, 2001.

FOR THE GUY WITH REMOTE PROBLEM, IR remote signals can be bounced, reflected, and or magnified. Try aiming your remote at the opposing wall (opposed to the receiver), if this doesn't work, try placing a mirror or somne reflective material in a location where it can act as a ricochet, last but not least if you put a magnifying lense over the IR receiver area it might help to draw in the signal. Another alternative is RadioShack's 7 in 1 universal room to room remote, I have this set-up. The remote uses RF to signal its accompanying receiver which then sends out IR to your equiptment. I think it's well worth the investment (around $80 bucks)it also comes with an IR extender for equiptment out of line of sight to repeater. This has enabled me to put most of my entertainment center in a closet out of sight, and the second benefit was that I have a pair of 900mhz wireless headphones and since my RF remote works all over the house I can now walk around house or yard listening to and controling the CD's in my CD changer.

FOR THE PERSON ASKING ABOUT THE SHUTTER AND Trapazoid, I don't have a web sight, or any sketches or pictures yet, but; The Trapezoidal Sleeve is easy, have you ever seen a theatrical spot light, same thing. I put 4 peices of foam core about 16 inches long hinged with tape extending from the last aperature toward the screen and closed them up to the point where they begin to affect the picture. all it really does is cut down on ambient light in the room making your image "seem" brighter. For the shutters, they are just peices of artboard that slide in place on tracks of of art board in several layers so as to make the size of your aperature both horizontally and vertically flexible. If you adjust these inward slowly and carefully while looking at text on screen you will see it begin to "lift" the glow from your letters.

DANGER, DANGER, DANGER-------------------------------------- I know you guys are pretty smart so don't take this as an insult, but I'm hearing a lot about people messing with the wires inside their TVs. It probably does work but be CAREFUL, CAREFUL, CAREFUL, THE CAPACITER INSIDE A CATHODE RAY TUBE BASED TELEVISION CAN DISCHARGE THOUSANDS OF VOLTS (all be it at low amperage) EVEN WHEN THE TV IS DISCONECTED. Nobody wants to wind up in the hospital or dead over this thing.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 03, 2001.

HEY MIKE, COOL IDEA. I WILL TRY YOUR THEATRICAL SPOT LIGHT IDEA. FOUR PIECES OF 16" OF FOAM CORE HINGED FROM LAST APERTURE AND EXTENDING TOWARD THE SCREEN. FIRST OFF THE LAST APERTURE IS WHAT? IS IT THE FRONT OF THE SMALLER OF THE TWO BOXES? IF I AM STANDING IN FRONT OF THE PROJECTOR, (LOOKING AT THE FRONT) ARE THE 16 " PIECES VERTICALLY PLACED LIKE THIS---> [IIII]. WHAT ARE THE OTHER TWO MEASUREMENTS OF THE 16" PIECES? DO THE PIECES STICK OUT IN FRONT OF THE BOX, OR ARE THEY FLUSH.

-- ENTERPRISE ON TONIGHT (DESPERATE 4 CLARITY@ATT.COM), October 03, 2001.

I am also confused about the trapezoid and shutters. Thank you, by the way, for emailing me back. Your description of your setup is missing a few details. I think I understand your sleve. It is 4 evenly spaced pieces- placed vertically in front of your projector box. They will be cut to the length of the top to bottom measurement of your inner box. I dont understand where you placed the tape to hinge these to the front of the box though. Your shutters seem to be the same thing only horizontal. Cut them the length of your side to side measurement of your inner box of your projector. Now hold the first horizontal piece up against the front of your inner box, and draw a line for each location of your vertical pieces. Do the same for your other horizontal pieces. Now cut a slit where your marks are. This will allow your horizontal pieces to slide over your vertical ones. I don't understand the layer thing, or exactly how many horizontal pieces you need. If this is correct, how do you adjust the vertical pieces with the horizontal ones in place. All this sounds like it really works for you, but I think we are all pretty confused. If you have a paint program on your computer, see if you can draw some diagrams and save them on your harddrive. That way you can email the diagrams to those who can't picture your setup. You will have many people thanking you.

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), October 03, 2001.

Well after a year or so of woudering if this was a scam i read this page and went and got the stuff i needed yesterday and im pleased (if a bit amazed) it works. Although my picture is still blurry and lacks a great deal of brightness, Im still working on it (since i onlt whipped up the box in 1 hour last night). I have read all the posts on how to get better focus but dont really understand it or this stuff about shutters etc. If anyone could help me more i would aprcial an email. Thanks

-- Matthew Johnson (LevLion@hotmail.com), October 04, 2001.

Sorry for confusing everyone, these are really simple additions, I just don't seem to be able to articulate them well. 1st an aperature is a hole, the last aperature is the last opening that light passes through on your projector. 2nd the trapezoidal sleave simply forms a 16" tube for light to exit thru, two peices mount verticaly two mount horizontally. The width of your screen is the other dimension for 2 of them, the hieght of your screen is the other dimension for the other 2. Note: the sleeve when finished and adjusted is basically a box with no bottom or top, the open end closest to the projector is smaller and the open end closest to the screen is bigger, and light continues to escape thru the corner edges which do not necessarily touch each other. So the shape is that of a trapezoid which is why I have been calling it a trapezoidal sleeve. All it does is cut down on ambient light escaping from the projector, making room dimmer, making pupils bigger, making image seem brighter.

OK, now the shutter thing, just put it together like a big old Dagwood sandwich. All it is is two sets of tracks one vertical one horizontal and a peice of cardboard that slides in from each direction allowing you to make the hole any dimension by closing the "window shutters" this is for lifting the glow effect sometimes looks like blur. I have a diagram of each piece of the sandwich but can't post it here, can someone let me e-ail it to them and maybe post on a web sight or something for everybody???

Hey just had a thought, has anybody tried watching there projector while wearing a pair of "blue blocker" sunglasses. Sounds weird but they seem to make things brighter when worn at night and they help to look into water when fishing. Just an idea but if anyones got a pair let me know if it helps.

Not to brag or anything but I have given the projector in question away to my son, because somebody gave me a free LCD data projection panel with a streight video input. I have this set up on a 3000 lumen overhead projector, watching 100" picture as bright as a rear projection TV. I plan to build a miniature version of this same thing from a playstation portable LCD monitor I have and a couple fans for heat control, and same Lamp my overhead projector currently uses. I'll try to document well and if anyone's interested I expect it to be able to produce at least a 75" image as bright as or comparable to rear projection and cost under $250 in parts.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 04, 2001.

em and my dad are going to make one for quality time, iam using it for my room,(i need to re-arrange it a bit) but it will be a sucsess we printed instructions from http://broch.subnet.dk/projector/start.htm we havent started on it yet, but we will this sunday, please if you have any tips fro a computer programmer and his 14yr old son (like how to make it brighter, reduce fuzzyness etc.) then feel free! - 100inch_projectiles

-- 100inch_Projectiles (corvetteZo6@juno.com), October 05, 2001.

OK I BUILT THIS THING AND IT IS COOL, BUT I HAVE A MILKY/ WASHED OUT PICTURE. THE BEIGHTNESS IS GREAT, AND IF IT WASN'T FOR THE WASHED OUT PICTURE, IT WOULD BE NEAR PERFECT. I TRIED ALL THE SUGGESTIONS, EVEN THE TRAPEZOID SLEVE THAT ALL OF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT, AND NONE OF THE SUGGESTIONS HELPED FOR MY PROBLEM. IT'S A SHAME TOO, BECAUSE IT IS ALMOST WATCHABLE. I TRIED TURNING DOWN THE BRIGHTNESS, AND FOUND THAT THE PICTURE WAS WAY TO DARK ON SCENES THAT ARE NOT WELL LIT. I WATCHED THE MUMMY RETURNS ON DVD AND THE BRIGHT SCENES ARE WASHED OUT. I TURNED DOWN THE BRIGHTNESS TO GET RID OF THE WASHED OUT LOOK, AND THEN THE NIGHT SCENES WERE WAY TOO DARK. IS THERE NO ONE OUT THERE WITH THE INTELLIGENCE TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO SOLVE THIS PROBLEM? WE ARE ALL SO CLOSE. IT SEEMS SO BASIC, YOU HAVE A TELEVISION SCREEN WITH A MAGNIFYING LENS IN FRONT OF IT, SURROUNDED BY A BLACKED OUT PAIR OF BOXES. WHERE IN THE HELL IS THE GLARE COMING FROM? AND WHY DOES A LCD PROJECTION PANEL NOT HAVE THE WASHED OUT IMAGE? THEY ARE BOTH BASED ON THE SAME PRINCIPAL. I AM VERY CLOSE TO GIVING UP ON THIS THING, SO IF ANYONE CAN GIVE ME CLEAR CUT IDEAS, I WILL BE EVER SO GREATFUL. I AM THINKING MAYBE THE PROBLEM LIES BETWEEN THE TELEVISION SCREEN AND THE LENS, RATHER THAN BETWEEN THE LENS AND THE WALL/SCREEN.

-- KAISER I SENDYA (HELL YEAH@ATT.NET), October 05, 2001.

Here's an intelligent answer for you.......get a life. This is a bunch of crap. Go buy a big screen tv and shut up. There is no way you idiots are going to get the results you want. Oh and to the guy with the trapezoid and shutters, if they work so well why did you give your projector to your son? Obviously they don't work as well as you would like us to believe. If someone can prove that this thing can work with a picture as clear and bright as a store bought, big screen tv, I will eat my words and appologize. Til then I will believe this is a complete waste of time and money.

-- LITTLEBIGMAN (LITTLEBIGMAN@YAHOO.COM), October 05, 2001.

This guy might be right. I don't think anyone with a post here has projected a perfect picture.

-- Chance (letsneck@aol.com), October 05, 2001.

Why doesnt someone just take an overhead projector, remove the base and put a TV in its place. viola

-- Andrew Bird (y2kisded@hotmail.com), October 05, 2001.

Hmmmn, I don't remember anyone claiming this could work as well as rear projection. Why did I give it to my son, was pretty well explained but let me put it this way; if I was building a 286mhz PC and someone gave me a MAC G4, my motivation to build the PC would be gone now wouldn't it. And for the clown trying to insult all of our intellegence, it seems to me that we are all involved in a constructive project that promotes the sharing of knowledge, while you on the other hand have nothing better to do than waste your time reading about the things others are doing and then have the balls to insult us and our use of time.

PLEASE BE VERY CLEAR THIS PROJECT WILL NOT GIVE YOU A 100" TV THAT COMPARES TO A REAR PROJECTION TV. BUT IT"S ONE OF THE COOLEST SCIENCE FAIR TYPE PROJECTS I'VE WORKED ON. AND AS MY SON SAYS "IT'S THE COOLEST MOVING POSTER I'VE EVER SEEN".

Don't even start this project thinking it's going to be perfect or solve world hunger or something. It's a great way to stimmulate an interest in science for your kids and a great way to teach yourself about optics. Also those great minds that are still here will receive the plans for my "LCD projector hack" as they develope. This will give the results everyone has been looking for.

This project is not exactly the same principle as an LCD projector panel; 1. we are using only the light provided by the CRT to project ( a feat many think is not even possible). 2. An LCD panel, is used on a overhead projector w/ a projector lamp (mine is 350W 3000 Lumens). 3. Light passes thru the LCD and image. 4. Light is so bright that image brightness can be turned down and contrast up. I have been told that mine is better than the rear projection TV at a local club.

So my suggestion to those of you who wish to disrupt this discussion is that you go back to spending all your time chatting and flame somebody else.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 05, 2001.

dude, calm down its a fucking tv with cardboard around it, what the hell do you expect, mike is right. you shouldnt go into this project thinking it will be like AMC mercado or something, look at it from a point of learning or spending time with your dad (like me) in my opinion mike went going along with this project looking to enhance it that may not be the case, but he seems to be one of the smartest people in here, by the way, i need a magnafying glass, they say the bigger the glass, the brighter/clearer your picture will be, any other magnafying glasses bigger than 10inches in diameter? my dad is a smart guy too, like on those school microscopes, ya know the little light? if you dont have it on, you cant see shit. so if you had something like that would it help with brightness issues? and/or the condenser lens or whatever? oh, the school projecter thing wouldnt work, you would need a way to fasten it to your Tv, and the mirror part is WAY to tiny for the (mines 20") tv me or you will be using.

i wanna know who is the dumbass who thought this up so i can shoot him, and end this 100inch tv crap, thats makming scepticts say shit like "ITS A CRAPPY PICTURES DONT MAKE IT" its gonna be for my room, 6-8feet from the wall. is it widescreen or is it, square? if there is a way to make it widescreen help me out! cuss that would be fucking awsome, watching tv in the dark on widescreen! also i hear people have been using shite shower curtains for a screen, does that shit actually work? or does it not help THAT much to spend 6.00 on a shower curtain.? thanks all you "tv in a cardboard box with duct tape and a lens on it" guys - 100inch_projectiles >:)

-- 100inch_projectiles (corvetteZo6@juno.com), October 05, 2001.

Yeah, really. If you're not building this thing, and you're not even going to try, why do you waste your time here? We don't care what you write to us, so don't. We have nothing to prove to you, you stupid dumbass, my tv is HUGE and amazingly clear, and if you don't believe me why should I give a shit? I didn't build it for the purpose of showing off to strangers on the Internet. The burden of proof isn't on those of us who have already built these, we're not selling anything to you. If you don't want to try then don't, but don't expect that we've come here to prove anything to you. I come here for new ideas on tweaking this to make it better or easier, not to prove worthless shit to people I'll never meet.

-- Sean (not@available.com), October 05, 2001.

oh yeah, and will making the inside of the box whitye instead of black, will that help the brightness issue? thanks - 100inch_projectiles

-- 100inch_projectiles (corvetteZo6@juno.com), October 05, 2001.

HEY MIKE I HAVE A BETTER UNDERSTANDING NOW OF YOUR SHUTTER IDEA. THANK YOU SO MUCH. I AM GOING TO TRY IT OUT TONIGHT. IF IT WORKS I WILL BE A HAPPY MAN. HAS ANYONE TRIED PUTTING A PIECE FROM A FLOURESCENT LIGHT FLAT AGAINST THE FRONT OF THE BOX. YOU KNOW THE ONES I'M TALKING ABOUT......THEY ARE LIKE A WHOLE LOT OF SQUARES. THEY LOOK SOMETHING LIKE THIS........................................> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- THEY REPLACE THE OLD TYPE OF DIFFUSED, WHITE, ANTI GLARE, COVERS THAT YOU PROBABLY HAVE ON YOUR KITCHEN FLOURESCENT LIGHTS. PAINT THEM BLACK AND MAYBE THAT WILL CUT DOWN THE GLARE. HARDWARE STORES PROBABLY SELL THEM IN THE LIGHTING SECTION. I AM GOING TO TRY SOME RABBIT CAGE 1/4 INCH MESH CAGING TO SEE HOW THAT WORKS. KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK GUYS. I CAN'T WAIT TIL I GET MINE JUST A LITTLE BIT CLEARER. I HOPE MY DIAGRAM ABOVE TURNS OUT. THEY POST MESSAGES DIFFERENT THAN THEY LOOK HERE. I KEEP REMINDING MYSELF THAT THIS IS THE WAY PROGRESS IS MADE. TRIAL AND ERROR. THAT'S HOW ALL INVENTIONS ARE PERFECTED.

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), October 05, 2001.

OH WELL THE DIAGRAM DIDN'T TURN OUT RIGHT, HOPEFULLY I DESCRIBED IT CORRECTLY. HEY GUYS DON'T BE TOO PROUD TO GET A WOMANS POINT OF VIEW ON THIS THING. THEY THINK DIFFERENT THAN WE DO. OK SO THEY WILL SAY IT'S STUPID IF I KNOW THEM. BUT TELL THEM NOT TO JUDGE IT, JUST GIVE INPUT ON HOW TO MAKE IT BETTER. I'LL CHECK IN TOMORROW

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK @AOL.COM), October 05, 2001.

ok i have some tests for you guys out there: 1) use white paper instead of black for the inside (brightness)

2) use a more expensive magnafying glass, bigger too (blurryness)

3) use an extra light (if possible) to make picture brighter

4) use differant materials ex: cardboard, wood, fiberboard

5) use a screen, not a wall

6) putting it at differant angles

7) Turning Brightness ALL the way up

8) use 3x instead of 2x (or glass 1x works well ive heard)

9) dont use crappy magnafying glass

and 10) distance from projector to wall

some are sugestions and others are tests, someone post feedback, i havent gotten one :( i feel left out cuse iam a REAL smart 15 yr old doing this project w/ my dad (and the differance between a fresnal lense on the internet, or page magnafyer at Office Max)

-- 100inch_Projectiles (corvetteZo6@juno.com), October 05, 2001.

The only thing that works for me to reduce some of the glare is to place a piece of glass as big as the TV screen that you are using over the TV screen. After you do that, just put you're projector over it. The magnifying glass will magnify the flat picture on the glass, not the curved TV screen. Hope this helps!

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), October 06, 2001.

Question, has anyone tried using a rear projection screen,(expensive though). And putting their " 100in TV" behind it??

-- T (tlk09@yahoo.com), October 07, 2001.

I HAVE USED A WHITE SHEER (SEE THROUGH) CURTAIN FROM KMART AS A REAR PROJECTION IT PROJECTED NICELY. PERHAPS IF YOU HAVE AN IDEA ON HOW TO HOLD THE CURTAIN TIGHT IN THE RIGHT POSITION IT WOULD SUFFICE AS A REAR PROJECTION SCREEN AT A SMALL COST. LET US ALL KNOW IF YOU HAVE AN IDEA FOR A STURDY FRAME FOR THIS APPLICATION. I HOPE THIS HELPS. OH AND I AM SURE THAT A SCREEN FROM A REAR PROJECTION TELEVISION WOULD PROBABLY WORK. ON ANOTHER NOTE, I TRIED USING THE RABBIT CAGING MATERIAL AND IT DIDN'T WORK FOR ME. IT HAS COME TO MY ATTENTION THAT THE REASON THE GLARE IS THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE, IS THAT THE PIXELS OF YOUR TELEVISION SCREEN ARE ALSO MAGNIFIED. IF THERE WAS A WAY TO CALCULATE THE PIXEL QUANTITY AND/OR SIZE, ALONG WITH THE DISTANCE OF YOUR SCREEN TO LENS MEASUREMENT, PERHAPS THERE IS A WAY TO FIGURE OUT PLACEMENT OF A WIRE GRID TO BLOCK THE OUTSIDE (GLOWING) REGION OF THE PIXELS. ALSO THIS IS PROBABLY THE REASON WHY SMALLER/HIGHER PIXEL COUNT TELEVISIONS, THAT HAVE HIGHER RESOLUTION, PROVIDE A MORE FOCUSED PICTURE. I NOTICED THAT DVD PROVIDES A FAR BETTER PROJECTED IMAGE THAN DOES A VCR'S

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), October 07, 2001.

I just thought of something, I have a telescope that's pretty small, but wide. I don't really use it much, maybe I'll try taking the magnifying lens out of that... But it might not have a magnifying lens, I think maybe it's just the mirror in the back of the scope that does the magnification. If that's the case it wouldn't work, but I'll take a look and see.

-- sean (not@achance.com), October 07, 2001.

Are there any other message boards like this? If so, please post the address here. For a screen you might try a white black out blind. They are spring loaded like a real screen. You might want to paint it with krylon silver paint. Let me know how you do.

-- shamoo (doitmmm@pacbel.com), October 07, 2001.

The reason I keep saying to use a real screen is that the material is empregnated with small glass beads, that increase it's reflective qualities (It increased brightness by about 5%). White reflector paint should work as it uses the same glass bead system, but I haven't been able to find any. There are companies on the web that sell front/rear projection ,material, I've seen it as low as $5.00 per sqr. foot for front projection. Flee, markets and thrift stores often have home movie screens ( patch them together it's worth it).

Wow just got my first DVD and it looks awsome on the LCD projector, I don,t see any reason why the LCD hack I'm working on won't be equal in quality. My first step is going to be to remove the LCD panel and driver boards from thier casing. Then I will remove the backlight from the LCD display. And at this point, it will be able to be tested on my overhead projector. Then I will begin to test building a miniature overhead projector. I have the magnifying lense and mirror but need to find a glass 2x or 3x fresnel about 6"x6" and get a pice of clear glass cut to match. If this works as well as I expect in Overhead testing it would probably be well worth just buying an overhead projector to run it on and vua-la.

I am also searching for a 8-10" LCD panel with HDTV resolution to eventually build my own upgrade for the projector I currently use.

Anybody want to start on this project and do beta testing with me, requires an investment of about $80-$100 and a familiarity with basic electronics and optics? I'll tell you what parts to get if interested.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 08, 2001.

Look what I found!

REAL SCREEN SHOTS!!

100inchBIGscreentv.com

-- Mr. Interested (wowww2s@aol.com), October 08, 2001.

WEll... i don't know how many of you remember this movie, coz i don't even remember then name but its with meg ryan and this other dude, that spy on their ex's in an abandoned building opposite the ex girlfriend's apartment and the guy is an astronomer so he builds this contraption that captures the image of the building and the apartment and what's going on in the apartment and projects it onto their wall - well they had some kind of working model - see if you can figure something out from the specs they show in the movie or contact the people that made the movie and see if you can figure that out - if not, email an astronomer that has a good idea on how to capture more light and make a good enough image - and please don't go about bashing on me, just trying to help !

Haha :oÞ

-- Haha (haha@haha.com), October 08, 2001.

HEY MIKE, I HAVE AN OLD 486 LAPTOP. I WAS WONDERING IF THAT COULD BE MADE INTO AN LCD PROJECTOR. I ALSO MAY HAVE ACCESS TO AN OVERHEAD PROJECTOR. I USE THE LAPTOP TO GET ONLINE WHEN I GO OUT OF TOWN, SO I AM NOT WILLING TO SACRAFICE IT UNLESS IT WILL WORK. HOW WELL DOES YOUR FLAT LCD PROJECTOR WORK? LET ME KNOW HOW YOUR NEW PROJECT TURNS OUT.

-- CHANCE (letsneck@aol.com), October 08, 2001.

Hey Chance, I am extremely happy with my LCD Panel Projector. If your laptop had a backlit monitor, it can be made into a transparent LCD Panel, however you will need a way to input video. This may mean that you keep the laptop functioning and get a good graphics card or I don't know what your situation is. If you have a way to input video to the laptop and are willing to take it apart it is just a matter of removing the backlight assembly, blocking light that would escape from around the panel on the stage of overhead projector, and you will want to elevate it an 1" or so and possably get a fan to blow air through the cavity to keep the LCD cool. Overall I'm sure you've got the brains to do it but it may require a lot of patience & an aptitude for electronics. Also do some testing first; look at your monitor under a magnifying glass, will you be happy with resolution? (I am going to use an active matrix TFT LCD) How is redraw for video? Do you have good control over contrast, color, brightness etc...

If you do not have a composite RCA video input, do you have XGA, VGA, analog, MAC Monitor input. If so I can help you find schematics on the web for converters to make input RCA vid.

I will be using, the Playstation One portable monitor from Toys R Us, I paid I paid about $80 for it. It should be great on resolution and redraw as it is designed for video games. I t is 5" diagonal measurement, My Commercial LCD Panel is 8 3/4". The lense I will be using seems more powerful than the one from my commercial overhead projector & I intend to use the same lamp. To tell you the truth I expect to get a better picture. But we shall see, I think it will be about a week or so before I begin testing it on the overhead. I am trying to get pictures along the way this time and I will probably draw up the project with good diagrams.

Hey how did the shutter system work for you Chance and did anybody else want the diagram?

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 09, 2001.

I forgot to mention if your monitor was not backlit it may still be possible. If the reflective material is able to be removed from the back (this is sometimes painted on).

I have built one of these before I got into this project. But it was based on a portable TV from radio shack it was not TFT. The resolution was poor, the redraw too slow, and my lense configuration was much different then the new plan (got circular image about 240x240ppi). Also I had used a light source removed from an old laser light show and when the bulb blew I had no way to get replacement.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 09, 2001.

MIKE, I DON'T THINK THE RESOLUTION IS HIGH ENOUGH ON MY LAPTOP TO GIVE ME THE IMAGE THAT I WANT. IF YOU GET YOUR PROJECT TO WORK WITH THE 5" SCREEN, I WILL PERSUE THAT AVENUE. RIGHT NOW I HAVE PUT A LOT OF CASH INTO MY PRESENT PROJECT, WHICH WAS WELL WORTH IT FOR THE EXPERIMENTATION THRILL I GOT OUT OF IT. I WANT TO PUT MY EFFORTS INTO LEARNING MORE ABOUT THE LCD PANEL AND YOUR NEW PROJECT. I HAVE BEEN CHECKING AROUND FOR A USED LCD PANEL THAT SUPPORTS VIDEO. HOPEFULLY I WILL BE ABLE TO FIND ONE AT A GOOD PRICE. I HAVEN'T HAD ANYONE ASK ME FOR THE SHUTTER SCHEMATIC, BUT I WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO EMAIL THE DIAGRAM TO ANYONE ASKING FOR A COPY.

-- CHANCE (letsneck@aol.com), October 09, 2001.

Hey, I'd like to see the diagram for the shutter system... if you wouldn't mind e-mailing them to me I'd appreciate that a lot. Thanks.

-- Sean (seanwojo@aol.com), October 09, 2001.

please goto http://www.angelfire.com/tv2/angelfire/100.htm for a survey i am conducting to get a page up with all the neat tips and tricks everyone has found. Results will be avaliable soon!

-- Joel (goryboy15@hotmail.com), October 10, 2001.

I found this thing on ebay called a "Remote Control Extender", has anyone ever used one of these? What it is is two units, one that receives IR remote signals and then it sends them to the second unit, placed near the TV, which emits the signals. It's less than 20 bucks, so I'm thinking of trying it out so I don't have to use this intricate system of mirrors to use the remote in my current set up. Has anyone ever tried this type of thing, does it work well, worth buying, etc? Thanks.

-- Sean (seanwojo@aol.com), October 10, 2001.

TRY THIS WEB SEARCH FOR INFORMATION ON THE REMOTE CONTROL EXTENDER.

-- CHANCE (letsneck@aol.com), October 11, 2001.

1 the white paper makes it to blurry because the light bounces off of it and in to the lens note the black paper ....that ws ther befor 2 yes more expensive is usaly better i would sugest to go to a store whit money back granty so you can test it out 3 extra light iv tryed it i think it worked but not that well because the light was geting to the magnfing glass at a differnt angel then the light from the tv makeing to pics on the wall just a littel bit off from each other so it looks burry i wousegest to buy at tv card for you computer and an old screen ( note old vga scree go up to 128 bit) because old screens brighrness can go to a white screen wow basicly brighter pic 4 i found usesing crad bard to start just to get every thing right is much better cuss you fidel around whit it and it cheep/or free (finding it..) 5screen wall who care i have a screen and a white wall i cant see it worth 200$ for a screen 6hmm puting it on differnt angels would gust change wher the pic was on the wall 7 turning the brightness all the way up is a good thing although if you have a full page magnifer you dont have to care becuse they sux ass go whit a doubbel gall magnifer system like in and over head progetor one convexs lens one concave lens and a mirror in the mddel. 8use a glass lens get on big convex lens it look like this ( and put the pimpel side faceing the tv screen put a mirroe above it and a con cave lens look like this ) pimel side faceing the wall (note the con vex and cave lens are the same just filp them around...) 9 i couldnt of said it better my self dont use a crappy magnfying dlass 10 dosent mater but it will change the fcesing point of the lens put you may have to move you bix up and down could be hard if ya made it out of wood

-- richard (funfink@hotmail.com), October 12, 2001.

Plan to have LCD panel assembled with light mask and cooling fan for overhead testing this weekend. Keepin fingers crossed. Hope to be back with good news on Monday. If picture is worth it I may purchase a dedicated overhead projector for this and call it done, if not I will probably try to build cheap miniature overhead projector and match pair. We have at least two interested parties that sound ready to begin as soon as the main preliminary testing is done. This is gonna be great if it works as well as I expect, but different LCD's have different levels of transparency and so there is a chance this won't work well at all. Also watching LCD's with magnifying glass I have noted that The 5" PS1 LCD produces color in a different fasion than the Panel I'm now using. My concern is that when I optically magnify the new panel (PS1) the "side by side" RGB patterning will be unacceptable. However my target size for this projector is smaller by about 25% (60" width, to match a portable screen I have). We shall see.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 12, 2001.

Here are plans for REMOTE CONTROL EXTENDER you can build yourself if anyboby wants them.

http://www.electronic-projects.net/projects/remote_extender1/index.sht ml

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 12, 2001.

Hey Mike, wouldn't a projection lcd panel on an overhead projector do the same trick?

-- thwart (thwart@hotmail.com), October 12, 2001.

Exactly the same trick and if you look back you'll see that I have one running. I am building the new one for the fun and experimentation. Also all my freinds who have seen my set-up want one, unfortunatly I have not found even a used one for less than $250, and the overhead projector costs at least $150 thats $400 total. My goal is to make a more affordable one so that I can build them for freinds and share the plans with all you good folks. I believe that if this all works out the way I hope I'll be able to produce them for around $200 with projector apperatus included. And hey, I'm a hardware hacker I love making stuff do other stuff, sometimes I'll even take the hard way just to prove I can do it. There is so much technology out there becoming outdated so quickly, and I like to think of ways to put it to other uses.

You should see how people freak out when you hook up to a live camera and project their image in real time in front of them. Also I think there are a lot of artistic applications to the projection of video. I'd like to project a live feed from a camera onto a waterfall type fountain for instance.

I have to tell you about the coolest thing I saw in NY a couple years ago at a rave. These guys had set up a hidden camera on the dance floor and hung a small projector (I've never seen one like it) over the top of a fish tank, they were projecting the live feed from the dance floor onto the bottom of the fish tank, wild.

One Idea Leads to Another, stimulate your mind!!!

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 12, 2001.

I built one out of wood, the TV faces the celing and a mirror mounted at a 45 deg angle projects the image to the screen (wall). the picture is app. 6'x 4' and is pretty darn good for what I have in to the thing. I used a plastic frensel lense. The only upgrade I am going to do for picture quality is replace the plastic lense with a glass one (if I can find one). matt

-- matt humes (mattlongarm@cs.com), October 13, 2001.

for you guys that dont beleive this thing works: sony is making new series of large tv's using cathode-ray tube (crt) rear projection. it is the same thing as 100inchtv! next, if someone has overhead projector try to take whole top part of it and put it on tv screen (both lenses and arm - you can focus picture with that arm). and if you're making LCD projector - that is not what this board is about

-- . (bckwed@yahoo.com), October 13, 2001.

does anyone have anypictures of the setup?

-- blah blah (zlaxman22@hotmail.com), October 14, 2001.

Hey Mike, how about one of those artistic projectors, the type artists use for projecting small pictures onto a wall. Would they be any good to use with a handheldlcd tv?

And speaking of handhelds, I read somewhere (Hacker's Guide I thimk) that you can take the lcd out of the unit an it will fit into a slide projector.... Food for thought, maybe...?

-- thwart (thwart@hotmail.com), October 14, 2001.

Well, my ex-wife put the kaibash on the whole weekend, got nothing done. Will try again next weekend.

Actually my first thought for the LCD project was to use an "artistic projector" or Opaque projector. But testing showed that the projector light simply overpowered the back light of the LCD unit, it projected but the image was that of a blank LCD screen once it hit the wall. I may use the opaque projector w/out it's light source and put a strong backlight on LCD. By the way with the projector light off and the LCD on it did project the image, but very dimly.

Well it seems somebody would like me to leave so that this sight can stagnate on one Idea. My goal was to bring this project to the next level, however the gentleman is correct this is not what this sight was about. I will be happy to leave. If any of you who are interested in evolving an idea, would like to set up a sight for this, e-mail me and I will be happy to join you there.

It's been a lot of fun, C-ya.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 15, 2001.

Oh, one more thing, if Sony is making a series of CRT based rear projectin TV's they are either using One or Three (Red, Green , Blue) high intensity CRT's that put out more light than the usual and so it is not at all the same thing.

Any of you who have really worked on this project can easily realise that it's only marketability is as a science project.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 15, 2001.

Yeah, if anyone makes a separate web forum for this post the link... I feel bad continuing this neverending thread.

-- Sean (Seanwojo@aol.com), October 15, 2001.

Hi, theres only one website that caters for non-US customers, its in New Zealand but they send anywhere, they are the cheapest too (remebre there are 2.4$NZ in 1$US) its www.100inch.orcon.net.nz they have lenses and plans.

-- John (warezman@home.com), October 15, 2001.

Well, I am just getting into this and am very excited. I love to play with electronics and can't wait to join the revolution. So far I have been just compiling information on the topic and finding a lot of answers. I am mainly interested in rear projection so that I can enjoy this shite during the day. However I still have many questions? Lets say I have a 5 inch screen, can I project it with a larger lens, and if so does the box have to be a pyramid shape. Alsois it better to use a frensel lens made of glass or plastic? Or should it be two concave lens like a overhead. I am planning to use a 13" Wega flatscreen so to optomize picture and brightness. It is worth the $250 investment. Hey has anyone seen this thing? http://www.stewartfilm.com/product_information/optalt.pdf. It looks to me like I could just stick my TV in front of it anmd put the whole thing in a box and Tada. This thing is perfect to adjust and play around with and it also comes with a perfect rear projector screen. Hey think about it you can just stick the center channel behind the screen and now you have true voice matching. I am an electronics nut and can't get enough of this stuff. I am working on putting together a THX surround system and can't afourd an matching TV to make it worth while, so I plan on making this rear projection work. Hey BTW I don't quite understand the idea of taking apart the LCD and putting in a backlight and sticking it in an overhead projector. If someone could send me a diagram that would be great. I hope the site helps and let me know what you find out. Good luck

-- Adam (akramer@usc.edu), October 15, 2001.

Guys guys, you gotta try this instead, i stuck my thingee in my gf and something spurted out and it felt great :). wow, this sure the heck do beat a 100 inch projector :), i dont know about you guys but i know what imma doin instead of messing with the tv :) woooeeeeee :)

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), October 16, 2001.

just kidding, guys, guys, sigh. alas. dude, my parents just bought a 32 inch tv it is affordable, i suggest not using a projector unless you have a big room, a big house with lotsa space. for me its better to have a great sound system with a semi decent pic, my parents have a 32 inch tv with a digital comb filter, its sweet, first time i looked at a tv and was impressed, most look like crap even the 60 inch murkey displays, i havent been to impressed with the hdtv, maybe its just like dolby digital and the salespeople being idiots dont know how to set up thier tvs, but im not impressed rather annoyed that with most you have to sit in the G spot. just get a 32 inch tv, for most of you gents you can afford it after 4 or 6 paycheck savings around (300-600 dollars), 60 inch displays are going to be to big, youll notice the pixels in a small room like your bedroom. trust me guys, unless your a complete nerd, dont waste your time with this. trust me. and pussy feels great (my cat named pussy heh, ehem). :) ;)

-- joes sperm (joessperm@aol.com), October 16, 2001.

does anybody have aol or icq or msn messenger that has built one of these or is building one? if you do please post your sn! thanks

-- connor (connor014@hotmail.com), October 16, 2001.

Mike,

If a site is needed for your ideas and others like these, just say the word.

You just need a forum to post messages and what not?

Could have it up and going tomorrow...

My Web Site

-- Chris Campbell (webmaster@mybowlingstats.com), October 16, 2001.

Thank's for the offer Chris but something has been set up and Chance will be announcing it shortly, I hope that many of you will join us there.

I really feel stupid I've been using the internet for 9 years now and computers longer than that but, I have no idea what I'm doing when it comes to BBS or chat or posting, I'm a graphic artist and this is probably the first BBS I have participated in.

See you guys over there... :-)

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 17, 2001.

Well somebody, just handed me a free non-functioning overhead projector, which is to bulky for my LCD (oops),, other project. So I thought I would try another Idea somebody on this forum had been pushing (sorry to lazy to look back through and find your name) I am going to attemp to remove the upper portion (stage arm and lenses) and use this directly on the TV monitor, this idea has had me curious since it was first brought up. I am just doing it for the fun of it, but I will be happy to share my results with you guys, before dissasembling entire overhead projector for parts for a different project.

Anybody interested in another project closley related to this one, in fact it is simply a different configuraton of this same idea, I am trying to draw up some plans for it. But concept works in miniature testing. This projector will use a regular TV, and only projects the same size as original, (ha, ha, ha this guys really lost it whats the purpose of projecting the same size) the main difference is that although light quality will be the same story, this unit will project its image into THIN AIR!!!! (yes very similar to the way R2D2 did in Star Wars. Could be a lot of fun, NO LENSES REQUIRED (there he goes again, what the heck is he talking about). Well all ya have to do is ...................................................................... ...................................................................... ...................................................................... Tune in next week same bat time same bat channel!

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 17, 2001.

Wow. That would be cool to watch TV in thin air, although I don't believe that it's not some how exaggerated. If you don't want the upper arm of the overhead projector I'd be happy to take it off your hands for you....

-- Sean (seanwojo@aol.com), October 17, 2001.

AS YOU ALL KNOW ADVANCEMENT IN TECHNOLOGY AND SCIENCE IS BASED ON BORROWING ONE IDEA AND BUILDING ON IT. WE IMPROVE IT AND MODIFY IT. WE LOOK AT IT FROM DIFFERENT ANGLES AND MIX IT WITH OTHER IDEAS TO FORM NEW ONES. THAT IS WHAT IS HAPPENING ON THIS MESSAGE BOARD. ALOT OF US ARE INTERESTED IN TAKING A SLIGHT DETOUR. WE WANT TO TAKE A LOOK AT THIS HOME MADE LCD PROJECTOR IDEA. THE OUTCOME WILL BE SIMILAR TO THE 100" TV PROJECT, BUT THE PROJECTED IMAGE WILL BE MUCH BRIGHTER AND HIGHER QUALITY. I HAVE OPENED A NEW MESSAGE BOARD AND NAMED IT LCD PROJECTOR (HOMEMADE). PLEASE POST YOUR IDEAS AND QUESTIONS ON THE LCD PROJECTOR PROJECT TO THE NEW SIGHT. THE ADDRESS IS..............http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl? msg_id=006hui

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), October 17, 2001.

Well, Overhead top half experiment works, I put together a temorary set-up using the entire upper stage, arm, and upper lenses, (removed light box. My observation is that the immediate results were as good as my other "box projector". This is actually pretty encouraging because with this set-up a LOT of ambient light is escaping into the room. If one took this a step farther and made a cone of sorts to sheild in the light between the stage and the upper lense assembly I beleive the results would be superior to those I was able to acheive with the "box projector". I don't plan to procede further with this experiment, but I would say if you have an old overhead this is a great way to go.

I will be rebuilding the light source for this unit and making it a bit lighter to possably become the base for that other project, hopefully my little neice will be able to watch scoobie-doo cartoons on her very own big screen in time for her birthday.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 18, 2001.

I've been seeing somthing here that is really bugging me... Someone complaining about keeping the idea focused on the box projector and not talking about the LCD projector. Some of you whiners need to wake up.

First off, if you will look at the main topic, this board is actually for VIDEO CD! Someone used this board to ask a non-related question about 100 inch TV, and boom, the topic took off.

If you really want to get technical, none of you should be discussing the '100-inch tv' idea, you should all be sticking to VCD. So get off of it.

I for one would like to see the idea grow in different directions, because, let's face it, we've pretty much gone as far as we can with the 100 inch tv box idea.

I'll be joining the other topic from now on.

By the way, eBay has tons of old projectors for sale, and their optics far exceed what is being talked about here.

As far as the cone idea, just make a box that is open at one end, the same size as the screen, and cut a square that will let the top lens broadcast towards the wall. You could make a spacer like the one holding the fresnel, and attach it to the verticle lense, therefore keeping any light from escaping. Results will be better than the box.

See all of you true experimenters on the other site,

-- Mitch (mk@freeideas.org), October 18, 2001.

Hey Mitch, Funny thing is I can't find any other postings by the complainer, seems too have entered the room with some kind of control disorder.

Another funny thing, he is the one who requested the Overhead experiment I posted this morning.

Have not tried cone idea, with the overhead experiment above. Have tried adding light within the box of box projector, with poor results. I don't think we can add light within the box to strenghthen brightness of projector, because we want to strengthen image brightness not just make the room bright. The Cathode Ray tube uses a small electron gun scanning vertically and horizontally on phosphors inside the vacumm tube, so when we look at the screen we are looking at light, if we try to bounce light off the screen it will be reflected by the glass of the screen but can't be reflected by the image because light doesn't reflect light. All right here is a good idea try building 2 identical "box projectors" Placed side by side, same distance from screen, fed with identical video signal. Then line them up on your target screen by projecting a grid or something. This would effectively double your light.

I don't intend to continue with the CRT based stuff cause there is no way I can come up with better results than my current projector & I guess I have gotten spoiled.

I'm gonna try not to post here much anymore cause I don't want to confuse everyone with cross-conversations. And I have deffinatley gone as far as I can go w/ box projector. But if anyone needs me to answer questions about prior posts or just wants an opinion e-mail me or come to new board.

I think it will be easier to disseminate info with new page anyway.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 18, 2001.

Just had a thought: I am planning on doing this "one of these days".... I think the ideal screen for us ultra-ghetto "don't-want-to-spend-a-dime-more-than-I-have-to" types.... use a thin piece of white fabric (maybe a little thicker than sheer window hangings), and put a sheet of mylar or tin foil BEHIND it. This will add a subtle reflective quality on any light that would have passed through the material, and it will be diffused as it comes back through towards you. It might make the image slightly less sharp, but I think it would likely improve definition overall because of the extra contrast it would give.

-- Steve (sadhussein@hotmail.com), October 18, 2001.

Setting up a new 100" TV build site, but not dedicated to that, if Mike or others would like to post ideas there, that would be great.

I'm in the process of setting up user polls (what works / what doesn't), installation photos, maybe a diary of a documented install, and a full message board, and what ever we can come up with.

Check out what I have so far, no links work yet, just a site design. Will have the site done this weekend, I'm hopeing.

http://www.mybowlingstats.com/100inch/index.cfm My New 100" Site

Thanks.

-- Chris Campbell (webmaster@mybowlingstats.com), October 18, 2001.

hey chris, when you get your site up i would love to add a link from my site, i just dont have the time to build a new site. let me know if this is ok. oh and i did build the box for about $8 and it works fairly well, i am just fine tuning the backward text with a small mirror.

-- mike (springs77@yahoo.com), October 18, 2001.

After messing with this for a few days, I've come up with a GREAT way to clear up the picture. I was using the box within a box method, where the lens is in a box that slides into the larger box for focusing. All instructions suggest that the lens is on the outside/front of the projector, which is where I ran into trouble... this made the outer egdes, and well basically anything but the middle, VERY blurry from all the extra light escaping. My "modification" is to take the inner box out, and simply flip it over so that the lens is in the back instead. If you're using a fresnel lens, keep the ridged side towards the screen.

This DRASTICALLY improved my picture. The walls of the box keep the light from spreading out right away and the picture is very sharp because of it. As always it takes a lot of focusing by moving the box in and out, but it's easy to come up with a good picture this way. It's worth a shot if you're having problems, and it's about as easy as you get to try out. I think all I need to do is get a mirror on this thing to correct the image, and I need to seal off the light better, and probably do something so that the inner box slides better, and I think I'll have a very useable projector. My picture is a little dim, which is to be expected, but my main problem with clarity is that I don't have a good surface to project onto, besides the rough ceiling. So if I can get the projector fixed up a little bit, I'll work on some type of screen, and then I'll enjoy this new contraption :)

-- REX (rexbannr@hotmail.com), October 19, 2001.

Hey, Steve where do you get aluminized mylar sheet?

I am interested for a totally different reason, but your idea has a lot of merrit it could work, well. One material I had pretty good results with, was a "white board" type dry erase surface that was actually on flexible poster board size sheets at Michaels Art Supply. Clean, Bright, White smooth, surface w/ a semi-gloss finish.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 19, 2001.

OK Bat fans its that Bat Time; The projector that projects same size in thin air is not a hoax, It does not use lenses. It uses a parabolic mirror, similar to floating pig/coin trick you've seen, it looks like the object floats in thin air. Well the set up is actually quite different from the comercially popular trick, and you must start with an extremely small monitor for economic reasons a 5" monitor will require about a 12" concave paraobolic mirror probably very expensive. I plan to build mine using Black and White CRT based viewfinder from old video camera, that I've rigged to accept a composite video signal. My monitor is round 1" and my mirror is salvaged from an overhead projector, it's about 2 1/2" across. I have tested it with a light bulb rather than video signal, and I expect my image will float about 5" out in front of mirror. This obviously has to be viewed just right, but its a neat effect and a fun project.

I can't take credit for this thing though, the tricks been around for years and I read about a company having done this and began to investigate how. I'll try to locate the URL for the museum sight I found that shows diagrams and instructions we are simply substituting TV for Light bulb in trick.

I'll try to get that URL to you guys, I won't be ready to beta test for a while. Too many projects, still fiddling with home built; "head Mounted Display", "Box Projector", "LCD Projector", Learning to program "WAO G" robot, messing with new DVD, designing robot for robot wars with 5 friends, modifying hovercraft plans for craft my son and I will be building next summer.

Jeese if it wasn't for work I'd never get any rest, just kidding but the nature of my job, does have a lot of paid down time.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 19, 2001.

IF YOU GUYS ARE HAVING PROBLEMS GETTING TO THE HOMEMADE LCD PROJECTOR MESSAGE BOARD, CUT THIS ADDRESS AND PASTE IT WHERE YOU PUT THE ADDRESS ON YOUR BROWSER................http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/........SCROLL DOWN TO TO WHERE IT SAYS LCD PROJECTOR (HOMEMADE). DOUBLE CLICK IT. WHEN THE PAGE COMES UP, CLICK ON WHERE IT SAYS IN UNDERLINED BLUE TEXT......... LCD PROJECTOR (HOMEMADE) NEAR THE TOP OF THE PAGE. THAT WILL TAKE YOU TO THE NEW MESSAGE BOARD. HOPE THIS HELPS.

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), October 21, 2001.

Hey chance, the address you typed for the LCD projector works, but you put a space in between the ? and msg. So the address is really http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui , this is the address that works!

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), October 21, 2001.

THANKS RICHARD. I GUESS WHEN I CUT AND PASTED THE ADDRESS THE SPACE WAS ADDED WHEN I SUBMITTED THE POST. I'M GLAD YOU CAUGHT THE ERROR.

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), October 21, 2001.

I made one with the fresnel lens and foamboard. I found an old projection screen that seems to work well and i flipped the picture in my tv so there arent any mirrors. When i get the picture clear i will post some pictures.

-- aol sn- connor014 (connor014@hotmail.com), October 21, 2001.

I recently came across the info on 100" tv seemed interesting, still playing with it. Found this board and read almost every message. Thanks mike for all your info and the new direction your taking this thing with the lcd. Please email me when you change sites with address please. Anyone still lookin for fresnel lenses for the projector, can find a wide variey at edmund scientific (industrial optics division) perhaps you can find some useful lenses in there mike and chance. prices are fare

-- bryan bordelon (bjbordelon@netzero.com), October 22, 2001.

i was pretty happy with the results...i have a pic of it being projected but the quality isnt so good because there is no light

-- (connor014@hotmail.com), October 22, 2001.

You can view a new site dedicated to the 100 inch TV. We sell the plans for under $10.00 and provide you with step by step instructions on how to put the damn thing together. At least check out the site.

-- Riley (info@build100inchtv.com), October 23, 2001.

Hey Riley, We don't sell anything here, we share knowledge. Also there is a sight that gives diagrams and plans for free, already available at www.bigwoody.com and we surpassed their plans a while ago. EVERYTHING YOU NEED TO KNOW IS ON THIS BOARD!!! Several people earlier on baught plans from all kinds of companies who claimed they had the key to it, ALL recieved the same plans and designs, some recieved an overpriced page lense.

KEEP IT FREE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 23, 2001.

HELLO MIKE I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW HOW YOU GOT ON WITH PROJECTING THAT 5" PLAYSTATION TFT,I'VE BEEN THINKING OF DOING IT MYSELF FOR SOME TIME DO YOU HAVE CLEAR ACCESS TO THE TFT WITHOUT HAVING TO DISMANTLE TO MUCH I HAVE SOME DESIGN IDEAS IN THE PIPELINE FOR LIGHT LENSES ETC LET US KNOW HOW YOU GET ON TRY DIYAUDIO.COM AND LOOK FOR LINK TO DIY VIDEO PROJECTOR IT MAY INTEREST YOU

-- s.charteris (charto@aol.com), October 26, 2001.

Hey, How come none of the links on this page work!

Also, turning a monitor/TV upside-down is a BAD idea. Monitors and TVs are built to dissipate heat through the vents in the top of the unit. By turning the device upside-down, there is no place for the heat to go. (This may explain color issues.)

-- Andy Rondeau (andy_r@wpi.edu), October 27, 2001.

yo someone better show apic of their picture quality now or i will open a can of wupass! at least email pics.

-- adsf (ah49@drexel.edu), October 28, 2001.

i went to bigwoody.com...alls i got were pictures of gay dudes popping up all over my computer...word to the wise ...DONT GO THERE!

-- j.j (jasd@asd.com), October 28, 2001.

Hey I am working on putting up pictures, I have added a mirror to my box and project the screen straight onto my ceiling, and I can even read the words on the preview channel!!! I have also added two flaps on each side of the mirrors to block wasted light from escaping. Look at my page in a few days, some old ones are up now. --- http://php.indiana.edu/~mkiss/tv.htm ------ There are two blurred pictures, this is because I have not found a good way to take a picture of the projection with a flash on my camera. It seems that without a flash I just get black and with a falsh I just get white. Any ideas?

-- mike (springs77@yahoo.com), October 29, 2001.

hey one more thing, the pictures were taken BEFORE i added the mirror and flipped the text so that it is normal.

-- mike (springs77@yahoo.com), October 29, 2001.

wow. tried in with crappy cardboard and a shitty magnifying glass. and still got good results (60 inch projection where i could actually make out sean connery from a 14 inch old monitor). so me and my friend are gonna make some. he found 14 alright monitors in garbage (people waste so much good stuff)...when we projected it... i noticed the sides were a little blurry and... was just wondering what is best way to approach it... where the best lenses are... what material box should be... wood or something that reflects inside light well? also any tips. some guy recomended placing 2 lenses smooth end to smooth end the the pic is doubled true? thanx all. love this board.

-- ah49 (ah49@drexel.edu), October 29, 2001.

I was wondering if anyone had plans with diagrams, if they could e- mail me copies, I would appreciate it, i would like to build one of these, thanks

-- Dave Libby (User260084@aol.com), October 30, 2001.

If anybody wants to buy a lens email me, I bought it on the internet and no longer need it because it involes a lot of work to creat a TV

-- Nick P (nickz06@yahoo.com), October 30, 2001.

I just think it's great what a little imagination and time on your hands can do. This home made projector box setup has been around for a LONG time. I played around with it as a kid after reading about it in a Poular Science, and that mag was 20 years old then!! It's all just a variation on the even older "camera obscura" or pin-hole camera. You can even use the same principles to view solar eclipses and flares without burning out your retinas. I came by this forum searching for advice on the best paint to use on my living room wall for use with the guts of an old projection TV...Keep up the good work and have fun.

-- Benjamin Grant (bengrant18@hotmail.com), October 30, 2001.

Hey everybody, Sorry about posting that bigwoody sight without checking it first, apparently its been baught or pirated or something, I'm told it's a gay porn sight, so don't go there, unless thats what your looking for.

Anybody who's interested in the progress of the LCD project, join us at the LCD Homemade page, here http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), October 31, 2001.

Stumbled accross this site by accident and have really enjoyed the discussion. I doubt that anyone will discover a high quality projection tv, using such inexpensive parts, but who knows. It sounds like some of you have already come up with ideas that are comparable to some of the crap units sold during the 70's! I think the fresnal area is only going take us so far, in terms of picture quality, because I think the best minds in tv production would have figured it out; But.. sometimes older technology can be combined with new with amazing results. so don't give up. Plus, your having so much fun and it's a great way to learn. I like how one idea leads to another so here's another that might interest you. A fresnel lens is a glorified magnifying glass. If you turn it around, instead of expanding light, it will focus light. When I was young, I made a solar furnace capable of melting copper {1,981.4deg F.}. It can be used for such things as temporing metal, light brazing, firing enamel, or just experimenting and having fun. To make: just frame your frensel lens and mount it on some type of swivel {so you can adjust it towards the sun}. Off the frame, build some form of U shaped bracket out of light weight steel. Make the bracket so it can slide closer or farther away from the lens to concentrate the suns energy at it's focal point. Attach a fire brick to the center of this bracket then wrapped it with some form of heat proof material. So it looks like a can. This use to be asbestos, but I would not recomend this. -ASBESTOS BAD-VERY BAD-.The focal point, as I recall, Should be somewhere between 18-24 inches from the lens. You have to adjust the furnace towards the sun and slide the u bracket in or out to get the sharpest and hottest focal point. It might take about five minutes to get the crucible {the fire brick}up to extreme temps. so you have to move the unit slightly in that time periode to keep the white hot spot within the crucible ie..track the sun. A few words of CAUTION. Be careful when handling the lens outside. you can easily blind or burn yourself, or someone near you if the focus point comes within thier range. Wear dark UV protected glasses when staring into the crucible because of Hi UV concentrations. A good set of glove is not a bad idea either, as a piece of wood will burst into flames in seconds, and you hand even faster. Have fun! If anyones interested I can fax them some plans. When I buy a scanner. Which should be soon.Like the LCD ideas too. Keep em coming.

-- Tubalots (RichardHelmes@home.com), October 31, 2001.

I just found the plans at http://bstvcentral.b0x.com/index.html

Includes 3 plan variations plus one set called "Big Woody". Download in .PDF form complete diagrams and pictures. If you have looked around to find more information as I have you will notice that many sites display the same movie shot of the guy jumping off a wall with fire in the background, however most of them want $20 for the plans. Interesting....

--dr

-- dr (ricksdt@juno.com), November 01, 2001.

Hey everyone- I've found fresnel lenses online at staples.com and officedepot.com. Just do a search for full page magnifier at both sites to find them. Both offer the lens less than $10. They are only the 2x ones though :( I got interested in all this just yesterday when I searched E-bay for a video projector. I'm thinking of putting together a unit that could be a floor unit and use mirrors to be able to keep the TV/monitor sitting at the bottom (right side up- no need to turn it upside down) and a space for a VCR. This is all in the planning stages right now, I'll post a link to my website when I get it put up. This might be a "next generation" setup that will give a better picture without damaging the TV.

I also want to caution everyone about TV's- I've seen some posts on here about reversing the polarity in their TV. While in some cases this may work, I haven't seen anyone post that this is very dangerous! Most of you trying this know what you're doing, but there are some out there who may not. There are dangerous voltages inside a TV/monitor, and unless you're sure of what you're doing, you probably shouldn't try messing around with your TV's insides! Even unplugged, a TV holds high voltages for some time. So be careful guys! Also, turning a TV upside down isn't really the best thing you could do for it, so make sure you're using a TV you won't be too upset if you lose it. Well that's it for now, I'll be back later with a link to my site for my idea.

-- Blinky (support@blinkytech.f2s.com), November 01, 2001.

this is probably stupid bit could be very not stupid indeed. I am a mountain biker and an engineer.One of the big problems in this seems to be accurately positioning the lense. whenever I want to get accurate positioning I use a screw thread which is also how it is done on my bike. a half turn on the thread can move the lense 0.5 mm or less hows that for accurate ? It's cheap quite easy and I'm supprised I haven't seen it anywhere else. The thread could go thriugh the lens where the lense is blacked out. I am just about to start building one of these on a very limited budget so wish me luck !!!

-- Mark Linnard (Stoned_elf@yahoo.com), November 01, 2001.

Hi, this is the ”whiner who need to wake up” and “the complainer”! Mike, i would lie if i could say i’m sorry for the control disorder i coused. The funny thing is that it took months for you to try my sugestion about overhead projector, and then you say that the immediate results were as good as your other "box projector". It would be better that you try others sugestions, instead of playing smart father to us. About Sony. Yes, they are using 3 CRT’s in their tv, but that tv is ment to work on daylight too, which is not imperative to us. Point is that it is using similar principle, and that it WORKS! I recently saw focusing device from an big theatre movie projector, and it has 3 lenses: two convex and one biconcave. It flips picture, so it means you need to put biconcave lens between two lenses in overhead to reverse picture. But i think the best thing woud be, considering that you’re so smarter than us, that you first read some books about lenses and optics! Now about LCD projector. Find “photo projector” (thing that looks like small xerox with focusing lens on back of its body, in which you put photography on glass plate and it projects it on the wall), put LCD on it, and that’s IT! Oh, and i cried reading your hartbreaking postings here!

-- This is my real e-mail (milutinbre@yahoo.com), November 02, 2001.

Whiner, (Sorry,only name I have for you since you did not supply one with your post), Yes your right CRT projectors do work, funny thing is most of us realised, that before we started here. In fact the first front & rear projection televisions ever built were CRT based and use 3 CRTs. All of this is common knowledge and has been explained several times in previous posts. My objection was that you were confusing the issues by claiming that this was some new product Sony was coming out with, also we don't want to miss lead anyone into thinking that they are going to be able to acheive anything even remotely similar to a proffessional project here.

It took me months to try your suggestion about the overhead because I didn't have an overhead projector to dissassemble until two days before the experiment (which was not performed for my benefit, but yours)Hmmmn, wonder why you never got around to doing your experiment yourself (some folks are doers some are whiners I guess).

If you would take the time to read the posts that were here before you decided to enter our room with your little attitude, or at least have your translator give it a shot, (he couldn't do much worse than he did with your last post) you would realize that your brilliant idea about the LCD project has been posted, tested, and failed. If you would like to know why it failed you will have to read the existing board and find it.

I can't do anything more with this experiment, I have reached its pinnacle and my more recent posts have been aggrivated responses to ignorant people, so I will be happy to answer any questions directed to me if I see them, or you can e-mail me if you like.

By the way, I'm 33 yrs old and a certified genius I didn't think I was coming off as anybody's father, but I can certainly understand that from your intelectual perspective it might appear that way. You must call a lotta folks DADDY.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), November 02, 2001.

HELLO YOU ALL. IM BACK! JUST TO LET ALL YOU KNOW THAT IM SORRY I NO LONGER HAVE ANY INFO ON THIS PROJECT. SO IF YOU EMAIL ME ABOUT IT I WILL NOT RESPOND, I DONT HAVE ANY FILES OR SAVED INFO ON THIS, SORRY AGAIN AND HAPPY SEARCHING...

-- LOUIS JIMENEZ (LOUISJIMENEZ@YAHOO.COM), November 03, 2001.

Ok, my last post was October 21, but I felt obligated by the last few posts to contribute. Look, we are mostly adults here. Lets not take steps backward. To the fellow known here as the whiner..........you were right in saying we may have good results in using the overhead projector arm idea. Mike has earned respect here at this message board for his efforts and contributions. When you disrespect him, you disrespect the majority of the people following the posts that are presented here. Your comments are not welcome if you cannot handle yourself in an adult manner. No person has ever said here that we were required to try a suggestion. Mike did find time to perform tests using your idea. He did it to try to help others get better results. He also told everyone that he believed that this project could not be taken much further, due to limitations in using crt based projection boxes. So if you have any other ideas, please post here. Please also remember that if you do contribute, you may want to try out your suggestions before you post them here.Then let us know what results you obtain.

-- Chance (Letsneck@aol.com), November 03, 2001.

Hey, does neone know how mirrors can be used to invert the output image? i don't wanna have to turn my tv upside down and i don't want to install an inverter switch. is there ne other way to invert the image by NOT turning the tv upsidedown? thnx

-- Brent (thegame017@hotmail.com), November 03, 2001.

If anybody needs a mirror for their projector you can pick up a 12" by 12" mirror at home depot for about $1.25 each. I've built this projector and I'm satisfied with the results. I mean for around $10 you cant argue that you didnt get your moneys worth. You cant even get a video projector for under at least $500(and that's the cheap used ones). I find that if you curve the lens just a little it helps with the edge of the picture not being so blurry. At first I had my prjector prject an image 130" but the picture was blurry, so I downsized it to 60" and I get a much brighter and sharper image. Well thats about all I have to say about this topic, so if any of you have questions feel free to e-mail me.

-- Eric (lilmexican1985@hotmail.com), November 04, 2001.

hey, for all the people who are just guessing and testing (thats every here) get the the facts about lens how far away the foces point is,how to make it brighter and a whole lot more here http://www.edmundoptics.com/TechSupport/DisplayArticle.cfm?articleid=2 67

-- Richard (funfink@hotmail.com), November 05, 2001.

http://www.edmundoptics.com/TechSupport/DisplayArticle.cfm? articleid=267 their is no spaces

-- richard (funfink@hotmail.com), November 06, 2001.

Hey Brent, Do a search on this page for "TURN MY TV UPSIDE DOWN ARE YOU NUTS"- This should help with non-invasive image inversion.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), November 07, 2001.

I tried this out. I wasn't happy. I borrowed an lcd projector from work ($5000) and there is no comparison *whatsoever*. I had a very bright 12 foot image on my wall, very clear, very sharp!!

This 100 inch tv was dim, and very blurred wherever there was white/bright area. I had to make the image smaller to see it better. If I covered more of the lens, it did reduce this blurring, but it also dimmed the image. I did everything. It is a good science project, but it just isn't a good tv to watch. I mean you can watch it, but I didn't make it though a single movie -- I always got fustrated and just popped the box off and watched the tube. (Ahhh, Wega flatscreens are killer!!)

I have a 20inch Sony Wega flatscreen, so it isn't the tv that is the problem. I suspect the lens is part of the problem ($5 staples fresnel) I suggest using a glass lens.

I learned a few things about optics through amature astronomy: Apeture and light amplification is the name of the game, and with lenses and mirrors, you get what you pay for. (Also, remember to use SURFACE reflecting lenses which reflect 93% - 95% of light rather than the cheap mirrors. Mirros suck up your light)

My guess is that it doesn't work well for the following reasons: 1. Due to the small apeture of the lens compared to the size of the tube, only a fraction of light is coming out. (Full lens made image blurry, I had to cover up parts of the lens and have a small opening). While the tv looks bright (Wegas are very bright) since you aren't capturing 100% of the light, it goes dim on the wall. The bigger you try to make the image, the worse it gets.

2. I suggest using glass lenses. Fist one compresses light, then second one magnifies. The first lens needs to be practically on the screen, not away from it. Problem is the lens needs to be as large or larger than the screen to capture all (or as much as possible) of the light coming from the tube. Where do you find 20 inch lenses for cheap????

3. A smaller picture tube would be better. This would allow you to use reasonably priced lenses. A 5 inch high res tube would be nice. This way you could just about capture and compress ALL the light with the lens, then refocus it all on the wall. However, remember, the light that is sufficient for a 5 inch tv IS NOT SUFFICIENT for a 60 inch image projected on the wall.

I've seen that projection tv's use a fresnel/diffusion screen (the plastic screen on the front). It seems that this application of the fresnel lens distributes the projected image evenly to the diffusion layer, providing bright and even light.

I think, IMO, this is a waste of time unless it is for a science project. DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME OR MONEY. Trust me, it doesn't come anywhere close to a lcd projection system (unless it is a 10 year old piece of crap projector)

There is much more potential in the LCD projection project, but even then, it is gonna be hard to beat the real deal (lcd tft projectors).

You can find the lcd projector project at: http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui

Me

-- Me (junkmail666@lycos.com), November 07, 2001.

Thnx Mike. i bought 3 12" X 12" mirrors cheap. i managed to invert the image on my wall. took a while though! lots of trial and error. tz hard to position the mirrors and keep them there. thnx for ur advice.

-- Brent (thegame017@hotmail.com), November 07, 2001.

does anybody know how to turn picture upside down on computer monitor by the software, not reversing the wires on CRT?

-- (dfd@vjh.com), November 11, 2001.

Just found this board today, and was reading through the posts. A lot of you are complaining about blurry pictures and image doublin.I'm not an expert, but some, if not all of the problems could be because you are using regular bathroom type mirrors. In most optical applications they just don't cut it. commercial projection systems us optically flat mirrors. These are mirrors that have no protective covering over the silvering. the silvered side is used as the reflecting surface, thus you don't get any refraction from glass between the reflecting surface and light source. If you can find a sample somewhere, look at the reflection from both sides. one side is like an ordinary mirror, but the other is much sharper with absolutely no distortion. I am lucky enough to live close to a great surplus store (American Science and Surplus) and have been able to find some good deals on these mirrors. I hope this may be useful to some of you.

-- Don (logandon_us@yahoo.com), November 16, 2001.

I am going to give this a shot. I am going to buy a lens and some black paint tomorow.as soon as I complete it I will post my results.

-- Michael Davidson (michaelmdavidson@home.com), November 17, 2001.

Hello, I just came aware of these this morning and I am anxious to try one. I however have no desire to make a poor one. I believe the fresnel lens is the way to go. I am going to try this project using a smaller flatscreen computer monitor and higher quality fresnel lens build for the near blind. Hopefully I'll have something to talk about. Robert

-- Robert (Robert@nsa.gov), November 20, 2001.

I didn't fully believe it untill I tried it for myself. I made a half ass job out of cardboard and it was presentable for movies or sporting events. With some time and trial and error you can get incredible results. Look for info on the big woody project and follow there instructions and it will be the best hour you spent. Cheers,

-- Jeff (park23@hotmail.com), November 20, 2001.

This is the Fresnell I am going with...http://www.edmundoptics.com/IOD/DisplayProduct.cfm? Productid=2040 I have also ordered a 17inch flatscreen monitor from pricewatch for $100. Hopefully this will turn out alright. Robert

-- Robert (Robert@nsa.gov), November 21, 2001.

GUYS, FORGET THE FRESNEL LENS!!!

After six months I finaly have an old overhead projector, and I know what is wrong with this project.

THE LENS YOU ARE USING IS WRONG!!!

All this time I couldn’t get fresnel you were experimenting with, and I was using 5 inch magnifying glass lenses. I obtained 6 feet picture on my wall, which was perfect in the midle, but edges were deformed. I finaly get acrilyc fresnel lens from overhead, and results were terrible compering to smaller glass lenses. After that disapointment, i placed focusing device from top of overhead in front of the hole on my black box, and there it was: picture on my celing was 6 feet wide, and there was no geometrical deformations. Whole image, including edges and text, is as sharp as on the tv screen. The only problem is picture being much darker than with glass mangnifying lenses i mentioned on begining of this message. After I dismantled focusing device of overhead i figured out what was wrong with all this idea. In focusing device of my overhead projector, which is about 100 years old, there are two lenses (usualy there is one) and mirror betwen them at 45 degree angle. LENSES ARE NOT THE SAME TYPE AS FRESNEL YOU ARE USING, BUT CONVEX\CONCAVE TYPE, ALSO KNOWN AS “MENISCUS” LENS!!! The sign on them says “4\350”, which means that their focal depth is 350 mm (14 inch), and diameter 87.5 mm (3.5 inch). That means that you have to put them 14 inch from tv screen to focus and get clear image, and that picture is dark becose surface of lens is small and not enough light is passing through them. Also, the mirror is special, like those used in photographic cameras, with reflecting material on front side of glass, and it doesn’t create ghost image like regular ones. To make tv projector that really works, you need to find apropriate meniscus lenses. Let somebody check out overhead projectors and the way they work - there is lot of stuff about them, lenses and optics on the web, but i just don’t have enough time to search. They should be as large as possible and with smallest focal lenth, so we could put them very, very close to tv screen. This way much more light would be passing through the lens and picture would be much, much brighter. Also, the only way to reverse image is using 3 mirrors I mentioned above at apropriate angle. I tried it and they reversed picture right way up. Using 2 of them won’t help, the picture will still be upside down.

That’s all from me for now. Pardon my english, I tried to write this as best I know, without using translator. And I wonder how “certified genius” couldn’t come up with this so far!

-- Whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), November 25, 2001.

Hey Whinner, If you bothered to read any of the ancient posts on the board or even one of my last posts referring to it. The "certified genius" did come up with this. If you read my posts beginning to end you will find references to "large Glass magnifying lenses" as well as a 3 mirrored system to reverse image and a 3 lense system to revearse image. There are also descriptions of colimator systems and a WARNING to all about the dangers of rewiring TVs.

C-Ya, DADDY

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), November 26, 2001.

hey, I am new to this board, and it seems everyone is having trouble wih using the 6 dollar magnifying sheet( i went blank of the name) Can any really smart person answer a question of mine and posibly help me make a setup to magnify my 19 inch sony television. I have an old 9mm slide projector thing, it has a great magnifying glass called a bell and howell. How can I take this projector, with all of its controls and connect it tomy televsion to make a monster display... Pretty much, how is it possible to take a 19 inch televsion screen and turn it into a half inch picture to put in this slide projector... is it possible, will the television tube have enough lumens to pass through this thick magnifying glass? thanks Jordan........ any smarties respond asap

-- j-dawg (nygraffito@aol.com), November 26, 2001.

Hello to all you officianados of the science of spectral wizardry and optic hocus pocus! I have worked for the past 7 years as the production manager of a fiber optic lighting firm. I just found this site and have read it through. Interesting ideas (some) and some not. I do have one basic question of all posters and postees. Where is there a viable link so that I can actually look at plans or a picture of an assembled/functioning model?!?!?! none of the links posted are good i.e. jollyland,broch.subnet,weboneBSTV ETC ETC ETC. Please anyone with plans or pictures send them to my e-mail address - wmthmagnus@yahoo.com. after review I will submit my professional recommendations as to both feasability and lumen/lux increase for the acheivement of the sharpest crispest clearest picture. If I can't answer the question maybe my five certified optical engineers can take a go at the problem. Thank you and good luck one and all.

-- William C. Buirge (wmthmagnus@yahoo.com), November 26, 2001.

Hey Hugh, Come on over to our board, http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui. But please read existing posts before posting. Seems like a lot of folks are just skimming the last three posts and then proceeding to re-invent the wheel. I haven't seen a new idea on this board for a month or two.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), November 27, 2001.

I just happened across this site and it reminded me that I made a projection TV over 30 years ago when I was a kid and I it worked ok, the lens I used was from one of those black plastic projectors that we used to put on top of comic books to project on the wall, the projector was just a black plastic case with a regular lightbulb inside, a mirror that reflected what you set the projector on top of thru the lens and onto the wall - well, the lens was mounted in a black plastic tube that you could slide to focus and it also could slide all the way out - so I got the idea way back then to cut a hole in a cardboard box that would fit over the upside down TV and I put the lens in the hole in the cardboard and shined it on a white sheet in a dark room (the club basement, it was easy to make dark) and it worked fairly well from what I remember. ......and I think they still make those projectors today and I don't think they are that expensive, and you just borrow the lens when you want to project TV and at other times it can still be used in the original projector !

-- Junior Scientist (noreply@needed.com), November 27, 2001.

William C. Buirge, The instructions for this project are at the top of this page. The only variations are also on this page. The problems with the project, so that you don't have to go back and re-read all the previous posts, are as follows......1-the suggested lens for the project is a fresnel lens. This lens is nothing more that a full page magnifier. It is not producing the desired effect. Most people are getting a blurry ghostin to the projected image. 2- you cannot get the full page reader close enough to the screen to produce the desired projected image. The lens has to be at a certain distance from the screen to be in focus. By moving it away from the screen you lose brightness. 3- by using the fresnel lens, which is flat, on a screen that is not, you get blurry edges. 4-The mirrors that some are using are not correct, they need to have the reflective material on the front of the glass, not behind the glass. The mirrors that need to be used are like the ones in the overhead projectors used in classrooms. 6- all light needs to be blocked from entering into the box from outside sources. And that is just a few of the problems. I don't expect to read another post from you on this message board, but should you choose to do so, I would appreciate it if you would do some research and let us know what you come up with. Additionally, there are no web sights showing the instructions along with pictures that I am aware of. I believe this is due to so many people wanting you to give them money for the instructions. I also think those selling the plans have complained and the web sights have been pulled. I await your response

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), November 27, 2001.

Dear Mr. Chance and all those past and yet to come. How are you doing today? I have a few things here of major relavence to the common quandry. Firstly, please donate to the generous benefactors of the extremely illusive 'plans with pictures' web site. Get your pencils out! http://bstvcentral.b0x.com Yes, this place does exist, thank you. Now for those of you who are serious... http://www.fresneltech.com I have just given all concerned the rosetta stone of televison magnification on the most meaningful level that can be attained. Go the the site and click on fresnel lens it is a pdf file. I know that it may be dry for some but it does spell out all the answers, i.e. light is actually a wave form of energy. Think of your t.v. as a garden hose with a spray attachment. Light is spraying out (not in a perfect/collumnated manner) but none the less it is 'spraying' for lack of a better term 'spraying out'. Now the problem is: put this 'hose', your t.v. in a box and put a little 'cheap' cheaply made I mean, piece of plastic in front of the apature, advanced as it is, infront of the screen/hose and what do you get? I'll tell you, a mess! An unfocused mess. How do we fix this mess is the question at hand. First things first, the "box". Light being a wave form ... The box is sealed tightly, spray painted flat black. Please. The object is not to make an intagrating sphere, the object is to get as much light out/in one direction/ hopefully the apature, as possible. What really happens in that box is that the light for the most part bounces around defracting upon its' self. Any and I mean ANY defraction of the wave/light will result in catastrophic diminishment in output/brightness of picture. So, it would behoove any one entering into this endevor to find a fresnel lens equal to the screen size and no smaller. A high quality lens would be the best way to go about this. Acrylic of an incresed standard for light transmittance would be preferred as it can be greatly more conductive than comparable glass at any quality. The thinner the better. As to unfocused/fuzzy pictures. A little bit goes a long way in the lighting biz. Any deformation from absolute zero in regard to a fresnal in respect to its' origination/focus plane will amplify the focal deformations exponentially. Yo, its gotta be perfectly flat. The idea of (if you don't use a Sony WEGA) screen is to place a piece of glass the size of the t.v. screen as it has been suggested. I would recommend that idea, with the substitution of a slim acrylic piece wich can be found at the hardware store, realizing of course that there will be a refraction index associated with that screen inplace, an appropriate polorized coating would be suggested here to optimize light transmittance through to the fresnel; remember the thinner the better, just so long is it is thick enough to retain its' flatness. Remember you want all these items to line up perfectly or you will experience distortion and even a little bit is really bad for clarity's sake. The whole idea that has been missed is that you want your lense to capture ALL available light ergo to get the brightest picture. Yes, naturally you will have to 'black out' the erroneous outer rings of the fresnel so as to focus/sharpen the picture. So, my recommedation is to tough it out and read through the www.fresneltech.com website and be thinking of the box all the while I'm sure that it will open your eyes now and when you're done with the article and your projectors. For now, signing off. Say, one last thing ... has anyone tried this with a larger t.v./emitter? say 27 or 32? now there you'ld have something. Thank you one and all. Regards, William C. Buirge

-- William C. Buirge (wmthmagnus@yahoo.com), November 28, 2001.

Hey guys that fresneltech sight is extremely informative, I downloaded the PDF and have only begun to read it but have already recognised some spots for substancial improvement to the box projector stuff. I am reading it with the LCD projector in mind, but also the box. Thankyou William (sorry, informal but forgot how to spell your last name when I got here to post). I am incouraged to consider re-opening this project myself, but we'll see. I beleive that with the info in the PDF and purchasing the correct lens (short focal length, same size or bigger than TV) and using an acrylic flat w/ polarising sheet, one might acheive much better results than previous posters.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), November 28, 2001.

Hello to one and all. I will try to be brief in this... Has anyone thought of first concentrating the beam via a fresnel removed from an overhead projector,i.e. a reducing fresnel, placed right up against the screen (edged painted black to prevent any lux loss/bleed-out) this would concentrate the wave form and thence to project it onto another fresnel of appropriate magnification, say 5 or 6x to compensate for the initial compression of the image? This would I believe solve the problem of upside down image. I am writing these short essays obviously in hopes of refining the design before launching into the actual construction. Therefore I would be most interested in hearing from anyone who may have already tried this and then abandoned the result; as I have not read of any such accomplishment heretofore. However I do believe that this is a solid premis from which to launch. To Mr. Chance and Mr. Langway: have you built a box of any credible worth, that is to say have you a decent projector up and running that you use for your daily viewing? If so please respond before I get any further into this venture. I thank you in advance for your responses. Also, gentlemen, I have been to the bboard site for the consideration of the lcd panel, interesting ideas there, very interesting... I'm sure that you black out the unused space around the lcd panel on the table of the projector. I'm wondering if you get enough light passing through the panel or if you employ some sort of a small fresnel to concentrate the light through the lcd panel. Also, have you realized another form of cooling other than fans? Oh, say for instance an aluminum heat sink? Do you have an operable model of this gizmo which has been left running for any length of time? If so where can I get a look see? Again thank you for your time, consideration and patients. Respectfully, William C. Buirge

-- William C. Buirge (wmthmagnus@yahoo.com), November 29, 2001.

Mr. Buirge, I had my best one up and watched it exclusively for two weeks. One must sit in the dark, I had a screen patchworked together from several home movie screens that were glass bead impregnated (this increased the brightness, but I'm sure you know that). Even in total darkness some darker style movies were unwatchable. Overal I think one would risk becoming very depressed if they used one of these for to long, its just sort of dismal. The LCD Panels yeild much better results.

On your idea about the concentrating fresnel, we came close to an experiment like it. I took the fresnel, stage, and lenses and arm of an OHP and placed it directly on the television set, at the suggestion of the one known here as the whinner (credit where credit is due). The immidiate results were as good as my best projector but not nearly as large. I beleive "the whinner" (if your out there, please give us something better to call you and lets call a truce on all the bickering) has a working unit now based on this theory and may have some credible input for you.

Also, Mr. Chance & Mr. Graham have been my greatest allies in this intelectual pursuit and have a lot of great knowledge to be tapped.

Thanks for bringing this board back to life Mr. Buirge.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), November 30, 2001.

Bravo, William. I had hoped that my response to your first post would put forth a sort of challenge in your immediate direction. I am glad to see you have become interested in this project. Yes, in answer to your question, in part I did try your suggestion of using the fresnel lens combination. I removed the inner fresnel two piece lens from the interior of my OHP unit. I found that the fresnel combination was somehow glued on the outside perimeter of the two lenses. The two were stuck together. I first tried to use the lens as a whole unit. I substituted the standard full page reader, suggested many times on previous posts, for the OHP's two piece fresnel combination. I found that the combination lens was too thick to get enough light through it to project a watchable projected image. Also I found that I had to put the projector box closer to the wall because the high magnification of the two lenses together made the image quite a bit larger. We all want the projected image to fit on our walls, don't we? Thus the box was too close to the wall/screen and obstructed the view. Remember, out of sight- out of mind. I did not, however, try putting space between the two lenses because 1.when I tried to remove one lens from the other, I broke one lens 2. I gave up on the idea because of the light loss. I hope this helps

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), November 30, 2001.

truce acepted, and i like the name "whinner".

i just can't understand why are we, as you said, re-inventing the wheel. Since SONY and other manufacturers solved this problem long time ago it would be best that someone goes to service and talk about this thing with some of the guys that are reparing projection tv's (rear or front). I guess they would have to know which lenses are used for stuff like this one.

Second thing. As i said by hundred times before: look at the overhead projector and the way it works. you can see it at:

http://www.physics.umd.edu/deptinfo/facilities/lecdem/l7-33.htm.

fresnel on it is used only to disperse equaly light over the foil, and nothing more than that. If you remove the fresnel, you'll get only the shining spot on your wall, becose image like that is falling on upper lens. that upper lens, which is doing all the job, is not the same type as fresnel you use for this, but concave\convex or meniscus lens, as i already said in my last posting.

That lens on overhead is of small diameter, becose light bulb gives very much light, so even that litle amount of light that falls on meniscus is quite enough for big, bright picture on the wall. so what you need is a big meniscus lens with short focal lenght which will be very close to the screen.

But, short focal lenght means large magnification, so picture would spread too much after passing through this lens. That means that we would need another lens, or combination of lenses, to narrow such picture.

Look at this projector as reversed photo camera. Photo camera is making small picture on film from a big image in field, and this projector is doing opposite thing. All photo cameras have combination of few lenses, so this projector would probably, besides of main lens, need some more lenses. maybe we could use focusing aperature from slide projector for that. also, like in photo camera, we would probably need one or more iris between lenses to prevent defracted light falling on next lens.

About reversed picture. when you use only one lens, image is upside down, but text on the screen is normal (from left to right. if you use two lenses, image will not be upside down, but text will be from right to left. one axis of image will always be turned wrong. For verticaly reversed picture you can use three mirrors to corect that, and for horizontaly reversed picture only one mirror, placed sideways, which will diverge image from front wall to side wall and reverse it. stil, the best thing would be if someone could figure out way to reverse picture on the computer screen by sofware, in order to avoid mirrors. By the way, twice reversed picture i managed to get from my 20 inch tv (little rounded screen) by the fresnel and another glass lens was even more rounded.

YOU NEED A DIFERENT LENS - LIKE THE ONE AT THE TOP OF THE OVERHEAD PROJECTOR, BUT MUCH LARGER.

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), December 01, 2001.

considering my last post: search the web for service manual/circuit diagrams for front/rear projection tv's!!!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), December 01, 2001.

Quite the thread. Can someone post some info on where (other than the internet) to find one of these 8.5x11 fresnel lenses? Hardware store? wal-mart? what department?

-- Test Ing (junkmail666@lycos.com), December 02, 2001.

Hey all you guys!

I'm going to build one of theese, but with a slight change. I will put my tv with the glass facing the ceiling. Then put a big fresnel straight on the screen. Then use the overhead type system with a lens about 30 centimeters above the screen, and a mirror 45 degrees right above the lens. This will then work just as a regular overhead projector and in a dark room the light should be enough.

The fresnel on the tv-screen will point all of the light towards the lens wich enlarges the image reversed when passing the mirror and projected onto the wall. Of course I will use a black box around it all to keep tha light inside.

Hope all works well, wish me luck. I'll post my results.

-- Nioreh (nioreh@www.com), December 03, 2001.

I built one jwith a ten inch video monitor, the color doesnt mess up when its up side down, the picture it project is crisp yet too dim for day tim use, but I do most of my tv watching at night, and with a ten incher that was collecting dust I made a cool toy and had a fufilling time building one without plans just the idea. bought the sheet magnafier at staples for $5.15, and everything else i had laying around the house, all in all i was impressed.

-- travis j wilson (theburnward@home.com), December 04, 2001.

Hello everyone, I've been wondering about this project for a long time. Does anyone know where I can get these plans, WITH DIAGRAMS on the internet?...

-- Chris (Turismo1@aol.com), December 04, 2001.

I have tried to read most of the posts here and I hope im not just repeating an idea that everyone has discussed but.

What if you were to stack two projectors(made with 10" tvs - so the whole thing would by small, and hook the same sygnal up to both of them. You could overlap the images, thus making the picture twice as bright. the more projectors you have the brighter you can make the picture.

Having two seperate picture controls could improve your tuning abillity also.

-- TJWilson (theburnward@home.com), December 04, 2001.

If everyone here wants an affordable, but really good big screen tv, then I suggest what I ended up doing. I went through the whole phase of getting the plans, sopending about ten hours of me and my friends time in creating the projector. I bought several types of lenses and built several different designs...some worked better than others.

Then one day, while at work, I noticed that we had a Sharp 1500 LCD panel, and since I also had an overhead projector available, I decided to fiddle around with it. The LCD worked, and I hooked up my computer to it, man!! I had the screen size of my computer about 80 inches on the wall with no loss in resolution. The neat thing about it was that it had adio and video outs. So the next day I brought in my vcr and watched Gladiator on it at about 150 inches. I was so impressed with the system that I decided to buy an ovehead projector and an lcd panel somewhere.

I looked all over online for store that sold the items but everything (overhead and LCD) was in the thousands. I wanted a 3M overhead that had dual brightness control, preferably a 9500 or above; and a Sharp 1500 or above LCD. 3M's go for $700 and up, and Sharp go for...well it's in the thousands. I then went to Ebay (good old Ebay) and found a 3M 9550 and a Sharp 1650 (has 16 million colors instead of 16,000 in the 1500 model) for a total of $350. Now it's not like I have that much money to throw towards a big screen, but I was just amazed at this thing. When I received the unit, I bought 75 inch foamboard from office depot and put it on the wall. I put the overhead about 6 feet back and sat it on a 2 1/2 foot end table, my couch went in front of the projector facing the screen and turned it on. First of all, the screen size ended up being about 115 inches because the Sharp 1650 LCD screen panel is several inches bigger than the 1500, but that's why I wanted a good 3m, because they have an extra "element" which can increase or decrease the image size without moving the actual projector.

I've watched endless movies on this thing, played endless games on it, and had the screen as big as 200 inches without any loss of clarity. The only reason why I'm letting you know this is an option is because I went through this whole "make-your-own-projection-tv- thing," and yeah it was fun, but after the time and energy you spend into it, you want something to show for it. Anyways e-mail me if you have any questions.

-- (askme@afreeinternet.com), December 04, 2001.

Hey TJWilson, The idea has been braught up before, but is probably worth revisiting. The main reason I did not try it is that I did not have 2 matching monitors to use. I think your way will work fine but while the subject is up, what if you use 3 CRTs and feed them a split signal 1=R, 2=G, 3=B, this is how the real CRT Based units work (except I think each CRT is Monochrome, one red, one green, one blue). Or check this idea out, how about 2 monitors that match in size exactly, 1 color and one black and white. (the theory being that the black and white one would only add light (in the right places), as the black and greyscales are really the "lack of light". By the way anyone unsatisfied with there best results, consider doing one in black & white (the results are better light and contrast wise) you might be happier with it.

The LCD Board is Rolling along fantastically, come check us out!!!

Hey whinner, good to see you back, check out the page (PDF) on fresnels that William recommended a couple posts back. There is a great chart of fresnels, comparing dimensions and focal points, I think you'll find the lenses your looking for there.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), December 04, 2001.

I came across this idea while searching around on E-Bay and I was rather interested in it. But I am not fully convinced it as good as what people make it out to be. So I have a few questions...

1. What should I expect if I plan to build a basic homemade frensel lense kind..?

2. How well does this work?

3. How far away does the TV need to be away from the wall you're projecting it on? Is it possible to have the TV 20-25 feet away?

4. What is the best way/route I should take if I want to build one of these (relatively cheap..under $100)?

Lastly, does anyone have any pictures of their own? I haven't come across many images of these things. If you have any or seen any send me the link. Thanks..

Atom

-- Atom (adamw127@hotmail.com), December 05, 2001.

How about using a curved mirror (like a doctors head mirror) directly in front of the TV screen, this would reflect ALL of the available light onto a small flat mirror which in turn would reflect the light (and image) through the hole in the center and onto the lens. Would that brighten up the image?

-- Rich (rizlazz@excite.com), December 06, 2001.

after thinking about it some more maybe a doctors head mirror would distort the image too much but what about the mirrors found in telescopes? they are designed to reflect images.

-- Rich (rizlazz@excite.com), December 06, 2001.

::Sigh::

A telescope's mirror is designed to take in LOTS of light and convert it to a SMALL area (the eyepiece). That's the opposite of what a TV projector would do. Those of you that are new here, don't keep asking the same questions over and over. Everything you need is on this page (and a lot more). The projector can be as far away from the screen as you want, but it will obviously affect screen size and resolution. As for curved mirrors, that's just not necessary. A flat mirror right next to the lens will be the best way to go. This is fun the first few days, weeks even that you have it built. But, keeping the windows sealed with black curtains and the room pitch black grows old just for a bigger picture gets old. The picture will come out blurry, no matter how well it's built. Think about it, you're expanding a tiny picture to a huge picture--you're going to lose a lot of clarity.

Yes, it's fun to build. Yes, you'll eventually take it down to have your TV back. No, you don't need to over complicate this to make it work. Yes, I'm done talking now.

-- n/a (na@blah.com), December 06, 2001.

Hey Rich, Look back at J dawgs idea about trying to make the image from a 19" TV small enough to feed a slide projectors optics. If I understand your idea correctly, you have suggested basically building a newtonian telescope w/ a parabolic mirror, a small 45 mirror and somebody knocked the idea because it was for putting a big image into a small eye peice. With some experimentation I beleive you could get the plans for a newtonian telescope and build it, replacing the eye peice with a slide projectors colimator tube and might get some surprisingly good results. The thing is a parabolic mirror big enough for the purpose would be very expensive. I suggest using a 5"- 10" TV, and check into how to make a parabolic mirror using aluminized mylar (silver party balloon material) and a suction system. Sounds like a massive undertaking, but deffinatly a unique aproach which promises to yeild unique results. William could probably provide a lot more insight on this. A Fresh idea!

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), December 07, 2001.

Today I looked at walmart for a lens and I found one for $0.97 and it was as slim as a credit card, so I bought it. Now I am watching my 13" tv blown up to about 60" and it looks perfect(as can be expected). the lens is a square fresnel and is about 4"x2 1/2" if you want to try it look where the coin wrapers are they shoul be close.

-- Michael Davidson (michaelmdavidson@suscom.net), December 08, 2001.

This project has made some people very happy, and some very frustrated. My advise is..........TRY IT. Some of you don't have very high expectations, and others want perfection for twenty five bucks. Listen, this project has not been perfected yet, give it time. All great recipes come from trial and error and handed down ideas from others. Hell, if this did what a production LCD projector did, I'd have them all over my house. I loved building and tinkering with mine. And, yes I did get frustrated from time to time. I tried a lot of different things. I wanted mine to project a huge image. I had it set up to project an image 120" side to side. I also had another set up at 60" side to side using the lenses out of the arm of an old overhead projector. There is no doubt that smaller the image the better image, and the better the lens the better image. If you want pretty decent results, build the box using the lenses from an overhead projector and keep it at around 60". You'll get a much clearer image and better brightness. If that is not good enough for your tastes, step up to an LCD panel/overhead projector combination. The combination is not too pricey if you pick them up used on ebay. Otherwise let's all be patient and let the progression of this project take its course. No need to get hostile.

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), December 08, 2001.

HEY ALL YOU INTERESTED IN BUILDING ONE OF THESE, GO TO http://bstvcentral.b0x.com they have excellend instructions with lots of diagrams and pics, they also have 3 different designs for the projector that make it way easier to focus and stuff. I made mine from the 3rd instruction set and it works almost perfectly except for sometimes it acts like a camera and the foreground of the image is clear, but the background is blurry, or vise versa, can anyone help with that?

-- Derick Johnson (kickasscarrot@hotmail.com), December 09, 2001.

I tried this yesterday and I had to use a lens from officemax. $7 The one from wal-mart does'nt work It worked pretty good

-- matthew henry (psxplanet@hotmail.com), December 11, 2001.

I have produced a new message board for those of you who have ideas for experiments, new gadgets, or just want to see what concepts and ideas others have come up with. The new board was designed for the people who feel they cannot post new ideas here, because this board is limited to the 100" tv project. Check it out at....http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl? msg_id=007Les......The new message board is still in its beginning stages, so spread the word. There is not alot of information there yet, but if we are patient and get everyone talking we should be able to make it a success. I am going back to my 100" tv project to see if I can improve it further for the Summer. I want to put it in my garage and use it when "the guys" are having card night or whatever. Have a great day

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), December 11, 2001.

Hello all, I'm just popping in to lend my endorsement to Chances new page, way cool. Come on by "What were you thinking" whenever you need to post an idea that doesn't conform to an existing forum. Or come on over when you've got a creative block, for some fresh perspective. Drop by and ask people if your great idea is as good as you think. This thing could develop into a great resource for hobbiests.

Plus we all know, one idea leads to another, who knows what we might come up with. There are 4 or 5 really interesting project ideas over there already its worth checking out.

Remember; "If your bored, then your boring", "There is no such thing as a stupid question", & "One mans junk is another mans treasure".

Peace, Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), December 12, 2001.

The address for the New message board "What were you thinking" is

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=007Les

For those of you who could not find it before. The above address posted on Dec. 11th works if you remove the space following the question mark. For some reason whenever I paste an address on these message boards a space magically appears. So please try again. Thanks again

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), December 13, 2001.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

FEW PROPOSALS

1. Mike, Chance and you other guys that are here for long time, summarise what you did about this thing and what results you obtained, and post them here. I know you did it few times ago, but this time include your OHP experiments and compare results you obtained with diferent types of lenses.

2. SEARCH THE WEB !!!!!!!!!! I'm sure that all the answers we are searching for are already on the internet, and we just need to find them. Regarding that, I surfed a little on the net, and when I typed key words "crt rear projection display technology" (or something like that, i'm not sure), I found more than 1000 sites with very, very interesting stuff (Mike, I saw something about light source for lcd projector, and I think it might be useful to you). Since I'm using computer on work, and don't have my own, I haven't had enough time to read that stuff, but believe me, it's worth checking.

3. Print some diagrams and pictures from:

http://www.maxpages.com/bigscreentv http://broch.subnet.dk/projector/start.htm http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html http://bstvcentral.b0x.com

Then go with that to TV store and talk with selesmen about 100inchTV. I'm sure they'll like the idea, and if so ask them to connect you with some repair guys, because they shoud have some diagrams of rear projectionTV's, either on cd-rom or paper (and that's what we need - the real stuff).

4. Finaly, one idea: magnifying mirror is sort of lens with silver coating on it's back. Try to chemicaly remove silver from a mirror as big as screen, and to use that mirror instead of fresnel. It should have longer focal lenght than fresnel, but smaller magnification, which is, I think, better for this thing. Somebody please try it and post results here.

I cant't realise many of my ideas, because I live in Yugoslavia, and it is very hard to find materials and finance the experiments here. So, try to do something about those proposals, so we could move on, becose this is getting frustrating.

By the way, what happened with William C. Buirge???

-- The whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), December 17, 2001.

Try and project the image on a large peice of of white construction paper. I have seen several around, and it just doesn't work right if the surface doesn't reflect enough light. Take a bunch of those bright shiny poster boards from walmart and make a movie theater screen and it should be tons brighter.

-- Dirk Diggler (cybertechnics@earthlink.net), December 17, 2001.

Hello all, Hey Whinner, I'll try to find time to do a summary again, but I did very limited experimenting with the OHP. I just wanted to provide some encouragement in that direction when I did it. Over all the short answer is that the LCD project holds a great deal more promise, unless you do this one with 3 high powered CRTs, 3 proffesional lenses, something to converge and align the images etc....

FYI- as far as I know a magnifying mirror is NOT a lense over a mirror it is the Mirror itself that is the lense. The concave parabolic shape of the mirror bounces the light rays around organising the in the way a lense does. So anyway I think if you, remove the silvering from the mirror ALL THATS LEFT IS A CURVED PEICE OF GLASS. It may still have some magnifying qualkities though.

If you want to try there is a chemical called "aftha" that my freind gets me from the floor and tile store he works at. This should work. I removed a similar silvering from the back of a GameBoy.

WARNING; I have been reading on how to silver your own mirrors, for a different project, and there aare many different and volitile chemicals used in most of the "recipies". SO BE CAREFUL; WEAR GLOVES, SAFETY GOGGLES & MAKE SURE TO USE A WELL VENTILATED AREA. WHEN WORKING ON POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS PROJECTS NEVER WORK ALONE!!!

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langawy@bigfoot.com), December 17, 2001.

WHATS UP YALL!!I WAS RUNNING THROUGH ALL THE COMMENTS AND SUGGESTIONS EVERYONE HAS PUT IN THIS SITE, AND I THINK THEY ARE GREAT!I AM PLANNING TO START THIS PROJECT WITH MY LIL BROTHER, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF ANYONE CAN SEND ME SOME PICTURES OR DIGRAMS ON HOW TO SET IT UP.I AM A VERY VISUAL PERSON, SO THIS WOULD BE A BIG HELP.I KIND OF UNDERSTAND HOW TO SET IT UP,BUT STILL ALITTLE UNSURE.CAN SOMEONE HOOK ME UP WITH SOME PICTURES/DIGRAMS WITH A SET OF INSTRUCTIONS TO START THIS PROJECT.THANKS AGAIN FOR ALL THE GREAT INFO.SMART GROUP OF PEOPLE!!!!!!!!

EMAIL IT TO: PERUVIANBABYFACE@HOTMAIL.COM

-- Abraham (peruvianbabyface@hotmail.com), December 17, 2001.

Anyone try using a Trinitron monitor? You get the resolution of a monitor that way (well it only matters if you have high resolution to begin with) and quite good brightness.

-- Dan (governor34@hotmail.com), December 18, 2001.

Has anyone thought to try appropriating a light gathering material used in night vision scopes? I may try an experiment that involves two chambers: one to increase light source and one to project image. The idea is this: The first chamber may need to straight-walled or angled, depending on what makes this idea work. The gathered light would then be projected in the next chamber for enlargement. There is a chance(and a very good one) that the light gathering lense would diffract the image, so try it at your own risk. One more thing: Try contacting lense companies like Edmund Scientific for your lensing needs. You can go for the cheaper freshnel lenses and get the better quality from these companies. When I build mine, if it works, I will share all here. If you dont hear from me again, I didnt build it.

-- Robert Pike (rfpikeco@yahoo.com), December 18, 2001.

Hey Dan, I used a 13" Sony trinitron for mine. Your right you get better resolution and the other benefit is that the new ones are very flat.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), December 18, 2001.

Hi People. I´ve read all coments and i´m also very interested in this 100" Projection. Please can you also send me some information about this product??? ***PLEASE***

A BIG THANKS FROM AUSTRIA ;-)

-- wdvoracek (wdvoracek@hotmail.com), December 19, 2001.

This is absolutely hilarious! There have been three important posts on this board that I’ve read – Early on, a poster writes, “do NOT do this...” the subject should have ended there. Later, a gentleman recalls old screen magnifiers once used to increase the viewable size of smaller televisions (simply a Fresnel- like lens placed in front of the tube). Yes, this worked, but absolutely sucked and was soon discarded as a waste of plastic. And a post from December 6, in which the author points out that all this makes a great science experiment...but one that you’ll eventually want to dismantle. This poster was immediately pooh- poohed by you guys, but he is absolutely right. Let’s be clear: this IS a scam...not this board or the subject, but the fact that some people charge $20 for plans that claim you can build a workable, replacement big screen projection TV. The fact that so many people have posted to this board shows that the plans are NOT complete enough to produce anything even close to what they advertise. Nonetheless, this DOES work! You can see it in action - bright and sharp - any time you walk into your favorite electronics store – it is called Projection TV; doesn’t matter whether it’s rear, front, sitting on a tabletop, or hung on the ceiling. To get the brightness and clarity you are all searching for...without turning off all the lights, painting the ceiling black, covering the windows with heavy black curtains and covering yourself head to toe in pitch so you don’t absorb light – in short, without scaring the snot out of all your neighbors making them think you’re not watching Silence of the Lambs but rather acting it out with needle and thread...you’ll need to buy a big screen TV. There’s a reason they’re so expensive: these guys have worked out all the problems you face. Superior electronics, precision optics, more lumens than you can possible create with 3mm plywood, a $7 plastic magnifier, and a 13” upside-down TV!!!! Get a life!

-- ScamMan (itsascam@scambusters.com), December 19, 2001.

This board acts as a succesful catalist for bringing together curious minded industrious people who will eventually move on to other things having learned something about optics, but more importantly haveing learned to take advantage of the internets ability to connect free thinking people who wish to share knowledge and enhance one anothers abilities. This would seem to me to be a more positive pursuit than running around the net spreading negativety because your not clever enough to keep yourself productively occupied!

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), December 20, 2001.

I would have to agree with Mike. This a hobby to most, but a fun ideas to tinker with i have one built at home and it does work and it was fun to make. I use this board to get ideas, the internet was designed to create a way to share ideas but some use it to promote negativity. Lets not let a few people ruin what i think is a good hobby.

-- Rick (rl@ace.com), December 21, 2001.

It is amazing to me that you have established the fact that there are only three important posts on this board mister scam. You must have been disappointed when you made your own unit, or can we conclude that you haven't even attempted to make your own. Were you upset when you purchased the $20 plans. In my opinion you read a few posts and came to the conclusion that it is a worthless project, without even trying it yourself. You mentioned that the one trying this project should give up and go purchase a projection television. If you remember correctly, the first generation projection televisions were far from perfect. Yes, they have come a long way and have progressed into high defenition and produce a high quality picture. Will they ever be able to be flat like a plasma tv? Probably not. But should people stop purchasing them because of this? Ok, this may never get to the point of high definition that the projection tv's today produce, but suppose someone were to market a lens specifically for this project with the optics to bring forth a projected image with the quality of first generation projection tv's. If the lens was large enough, and inexpensive enough, I think you would rethink your comments. In closing I say.... this project has possibilities, and I don't think people here are willing to give up just yet. Only through persistance does perfection come. Keep up the good work people, if you stick with it, eventually someone will have the answer we have been looking for. For me, I'm in for the long hall.

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), December 22, 2001.

can anyone help me?? i have the projector working great!! the only problem is its about 8 feet away from my wall, so the image is over 140inches!! is there any way to shrink the image without moving the unit closer to the wall, my wall is probably about 80inches, but any shrinkage would be great!!! just email me your suggestions: usmi27defconunit1@home.com: thanks!!

-- kozman (usmi27defconunit1@home.com), December 24, 2001.

Hey Guys! I just made a huge break through with the part about the LCD screens. Awhile back I bought a cheep VR helmet for the SNES for 30 bucks on ebay thinking of converting it into a computer vr helm. Anyhow I pulled it out tonight and took it apart inside is a high def. LCD back lit screen. Right now im splicing the plug on the toy to change it into a SVIDEO or RGB cable. This should allow me to use a computer input or a Super Def. Video input from my DVD/VCR. Im planning on making it into a projector, also another kinda cool thing inside it the daughter board that has the pin outs also has audio plugs to the head phones im thinking of using this for built in speakers on the projector. Sorry about the pictures though, my camera isnt working right. Im thinking off using the LCD off that :) The helm is called a stunt master or something like that I can get more info if its needed. Anyhow wish me luck :)

-- Adam (kegger@san.rr.com), December 28, 2001.

Ha ha, you know what you just said? shrinkage, hahaha! erm... Well, the only way that i know is to use a lower magnification on your lens or move your tv closer to the wall. Hope this helps! hehe haha shrinkage.....

-- rich (haha@yahoo.com), December 30, 2001.

I have just finished my first attempt at this, and was fairly suprised, i have a clear picture (although not as bright as my tele!) if anyone in the UK needs help finding the frensel lens or constructing etc, please feel free to email me, David

-- guvnor jones (unerd_01@yahoo.com), December 31, 2001.

Whoops... I hit the print button and didn't know it.... Before long my printer was out of paper with a bazillion comments to this 100" projector thing. I think that 100" would be unmanagable. I would be happy with 6" (lol).

-- Whaaazzuppp (a@b.c), January 02, 2002.

Hey sounds like you won't be wanting for bird cage liner for quite a while.

Hey if anybody is tired of there projector box or just wants an excuse to make another. Here is a really neat idea;

Build the projector box in the same way but, build it around a fishtank, light the tank from the back (careful we don't want a fish fry here). Now you have the most unique childs night light anyone has ever seen. Also the overall dimness of the projector box would be a good thing for this purpose. Make sure you leave a way for the child to enjoy the fish during the day, and remember you gotta be able to clean the tank, feed the fish etc...

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 03, 2002.

Hey guys, I just got my plans for the 100" TV i ordered em, if you want I was going to scan them and post them on my webpage, any takers???

-- the man with tha plans (uwantplans??@igotem.com), January 03, 2002.

I can't see supporting or encouraging those greedy individuals who have taken these plans from each other and marketed them as there own (I've been told they can be found in publications upto 35 or 40 years old). Also from what I've heard there just about all the same plans and some will even sell you a $7.00 retail priced fresnel with it for $15.00. Effectively doubleig the cost of your lense and possibly geting, a better organised set of instructions than those here. I will be more than happy to applogise if you can point out one item in the insructions that is not covered on this board.

One final note almost evryone of these adds for these plans that I have read are guilty of false advertising. Please don't expect much more than a semi-usable science fair project out of this thing. Don't get me wrong it is fun, educational, and in this case a good social activity, but it will NOT be anything near even the first commercial projecton TVs.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 04, 2002.

If anyone is interested, I have just started this project and I am putting a link from my webpage to the 100" project, I just started this today and I will be updating my website with the progress I make along with pictures of the final results and hopefully soon actual video of the end result. I also opened a new topic on the messageboard about the 100" project as well, please stop by and check it out. more to come very soon, I just started this today. Any tips or advice please post in the message board.

[FMa]Gorgasm

-- [FMa]Gorgasm (fmaklan@yahoo.com), January 04, 2002.

oh yeah...... duh! the link is http://www.geocities.com/gorslair

-- [FMa]Gorgasm (fmaklan@yahoo.com), January 04, 2002.

i just wanna know if ican make this 100inch tv thing on my computer monitor if so do i need to use the same plan as posted and what special materials do i need to make this projector by the way i live in bc canada and where can i find this fresnel lense email me for some picture of the results please i need answer pass ASAP thanks and have a good day

-- christian (ccruz3@shaw.ca), January 04, 2002.

If you had a TV out video card just build the projector for a TV and then hook up ur video card to the TV

-- [FMa]Gorgasm (fmaklan@yahoo.com), January 04, 2002.

is it better than using my monitor ?

-- Christian (ccruz3@shaw.ca), January 04, 2002.

guys, check this out!!!

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_8_4/zenith-pro-1200x-projector- 11-2001.html

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), January 05, 2002.

i just made one f these and am pretty impressed, i used an assortment of free directions of the internet and made it in 2 hours

2 problems, 1 possibly solved

1. picture is dim, i saw the post earlier on possibly lining with tinfoil so i asked my science teacher about it, the guy is smart! he said the tinfoil would work good so ill try it and report back

2. the sides of the picture are blurry, maybe a lens from an overhead projector? where could i buy one of these? also any other lenses found that work gret?

i saw someodys post from earlier today and they said use single monocular(one side of binocular) i think they were being sarcastis but could it work? when you look through binoculars u egt a crisp focused image, this woul be great if it worked,

any ideas?

-- mike (mike_man_2020@yahoo.com), January 05, 2002.

Sounds like a reasonable idea. Try it out and let us know.

-- Binocularman (bin@cu.lar), January 05, 2002.

I have read alot of different things about this 100 inch tv. and one of things I have read is that you don't have to turn your tv upside down.does anyone know how this works? Because I have seen plans for sell that say that there is a way.

-- chaun myers (chaunmyers@yahoo.com), January 05, 2002.

http://geocities.com/easton17066/screeninversion.html

BE VERY VERY CAREFUL WHEN DOING THIS PROCEDURE. THE INSIDE OF YOUR TELEVISION CAN BE LIKE A BOMB IF YOU AREN'T CAREFUL. READ THE INSTRUCTIONS OVER AND OVER BEFORE YOU EVEN OPEN THE BACK OF YOUR TELEVISION TO BE SURE YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING. YES IT DOES WORK. I DID IT ON THREE DIFFERENT TELEVISIONS. I CUT THE APPROPRIATE WIRES AND SPLICED THEM TOGETHER WITH WIRE NUTS. I MADE SURE THEY WERE TIGHT AND WOULD NOT COME LOOSE. ALSO MAKE SURE YOU DONT HAVE ANY WIRE STRANDS COMING OUT OF THE WIRE NUTS. YOU DON'T WANT ANY WIRE STRANDS MAKING CONTACT WITH ANY OTHER PARTS INSIDE THE TELEVISION. I CANNOT BE RESPONSIBLE FOR LOSS OF LIFE OR LIMB. GOOD LUCK. ONCE COMPLETED YOU WILL NOT HAVE TO USE MIRRORS OR TURN YOUR TV UPSIDE DOWN. CHANCE

-- CHANCE (LETSNECK@AOL.COM), January 07, 2002.

http://www.bstvcentral.b0x.com/bsgal.htm

-- Lee Aguilar (leeaguilar@hotmail.com), January 07, 2002.

Hey genious, how bout haveing a little respect for the kids that are attracted to this board. Maybe you could start your own board and show us all the clever ways you've thought up to slaughter the english language to oblivion.

By the way geniouses generally have 3 digits in there I.Q., you may have been reading the I.D. number on the test.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 07, 2002.

Here's an idea. I was just skimming across this forum, and looking at the LCD projector idea and I thought.. what's the major hurdle in getting a good picture? Brightness, quality of lenses.. so here's my question.

Would it be possible to take more than one TV and multiply the amount of light by basically arranging these things side-by-side, and aiming them at the same point (light-doubling, whatever you want to call it?) With that in mind, you could take two 19 inchers and get double the brightness. That brings to mind the question of the lenses.. where will you find good lenses of that size? Well if we can double the brightness, why can't we triple or quadruple, or even quintuple it? Increase the amount of units while decreasing the diagonal size of the TV?

I'm not an engineer or a physicist to any extent, and I'm sure the procedure for aligning the pictures would probably take some work, but again, I'm sure some mechanical guy could gear up something that would rotate lenses, or TV's, or mirrors, or whatever.

Brush it off if it's dumb, i guess..

-- Todd Hendricks (djsqueak@djcentral.com), January 07, 2002.

Hello projection vetrans! I'm pretty friggin glad I found you before I blew my money on some website, and I'm even more excited that I found a group of people working on this. Anyway, names Paul, just a formal hello. I'm starting this project fairly soon, but first I'm going to take it up with my physics prof. He's done some work with parabolic mirrors and image projection, so hopefully I'll have some pertinent information by around the end of the week. Good luck to everyone, and wish me the same

-Paul Distalled@aol.com

-- Paul (Distalled@aol.com), January 08, 2002.

Hey Todd, Theres no such thing as a dumb idea. The method you have described is actually the way the pro units work. I posted quite a few ideas along these lines a while back but can't afford the time or the money for a bunch of matching monitors right now. Think about a compromise with to TVs matching in size One Colr the Black & White (the idea is that the black and white would only add light to brighter areas while not detracting from dark areas).

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 08, 2002.

OOps, That to should be a TWO.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 08, 2002.

Hi all, This 100 inch thing is not a scam, it really works. I have just finished making a Big Woody(see BSTV)projector and managed to get a pretty reasonable picture, though not up to usual tv standards it is quite watchable. I carried out some experiments and found that if u line the inside of the focus box with tinfoil(shiney side down)that will improve the brightness, I also had the idea of fixing a small 200 watt halogen lamp into the focus box using a computer fan to keep it cool. This brightened up the screen brilliantly, but alas it completely blotted out the picture, so back to the drawing board on that one. Another tip on screen brightness is to hunt down an old Bell & Howell 16 ml projector screen, I bought 1 for 10 bucks and it really helps to brighten the picture up. I am still experimenting with the project and if I come across something usefull I will post it on this site. BIGJAYUK.

-- JAMES PILNICK (JIMMYPILNICK@HOTMAIL.COM), January 08, 2002.

Mike - Wouldn't the B&W TV kind of "Wash out" the colors though? like, add enough white light to a already lit area and it gets that much closer to white. Seems it'd be a better idea to use multiple color monitors set (hopefully) with the same color temperatures.

-- Todd Hendricks (djsqueak@djcentral.com), January 08, 2002.

Todd, Yes mulitple color monitors would be better, Black & White would be cheaper. Also your probably right about the color mixing, but I have noted that these projectors, when projecting black & white images have a much better contrast and brightness.

Again let me recommend a pure black & white projector to those of you who were unsatisfied with the color one. Its great for old movies and stuff, and is more impressive in overall picture quality.

Also, try to limit the amount of time you spend watching these projectors. The atmosphere necessary to veiw these is dismal and dark and the dimmness of the overall picture is probably causing strein on your eyes. I watched mine for about 2 weeks, and became concerned that it might be affecting my overall attitude it is somewhat depressing sitting in the dark with your eyes squinted for to long.

Check out the LCD board too.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 08, 2002.

Can someone please let me know the quality of picture using an LCD Panel and overhead projector. I spoke to an audio video specialist at http://www.invsol-inc.com (they have great deals on LCD panels, projectors etc) and he dissuaded me from buying an LCD Panel. Said the picture would be blurry with a lot of ghost images. Do you see this problem ? How would you compare the picture quality to that of a good TV ? Thanks

-- Sandip (sghosh@email.com), January 09, 2002.

I was extremely satisfied with my commervcial LCD unit. Come over to the LCD board http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui There are testimonials there from several individuals who have baught commercial units. And several memebers have had success with building there own.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 10, 2002.

Sorry about the spelling again, I'm going to try composing in Word and using the spell checker then pasting to post from now on. I realize those of you using translation services are probably not able to read my posts. And boy was my face red when someone pointed out that I, of all people had misspelled genius in my attempt to muzzle our profanity infatuated friend. I can't type properly so I use Two fingers and it seems as though they are always busy trying to keep up with my thought processes. I am also an atrocious speller to begin with.

So bear with me as I attempt to develop a better habit for posting. Remember I am posting in American English so some of you fellows over there in Great Britain may still think I'm not spelling correctly.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 10, 2002.

Couldn't you take an overhead projector and replacing the light bulb and the glass with a tv, so that the picture from the tv would do the same thing as the prjector would. I was just thinking of a way to use an overhead to do this because the picture is so good with them.

Also you could put black carboard from the edge of the tv screen and put it all the way up to the lens on the top of the projector so that more of the light would get up to through the lens.

I don't know this seems like it would work, but somebody will probaly come up with a reason why it wouldn't. But still I think I am going to buy and overhead projector off ebay and do a few experiments with this one.

-Thanks

-- Jordan Bauer (jbbauer54@msn.com), January 10, 2002.

I mean like, taking out the bottom base part of the projector and replacing it with a tv so that the tv picture will be projected into the lens on top of the projector, making a projection onto the wall or screen.

-- Jordan Bauer (jbbauer54@msn.com), January 10, 2002.

Here are few of my thoughts!

When you look at the picture no. 4 in that PDF file William C. Buirge ( RIP?) mentioned, you will see that non-perfect lens is not working well, or in other words, lens is not deflecting all the rays that afe falling on it properly, so they are not all focused in one point.

Another thing. Light rays are not traveling parallely from screen to the lens, but from every pixel rays are spreading in each direction. Every pixel is transmiting one light ray that is properly falling on lens, and many of rays that are falling on lens and deflecting at the wrong angle, and therefore making image on the wall blury.

And naturally, there is the question are you using the correct lens (that is why I am permanently repeating to you to use the lens from OHP or some other concave/convex lens).

Anyhow, here is what I did to partialy solve this problem.

I am using glass concave lens (5 inch diameter). I placed a peace of foambord with 2 inch hole on it in front of my lens, at aprox 3 inch distance. This way I enabled only corectly focused light rays to pass to the wall, and prevented rays that are wrongly deflected in the lens to come to the wall. That reduced brightness a bit, but made it lot sharper and reduced blur.

Mike wrote some time ago about similar thing (shutters), and I mentioned it in one of my previous posts, but wrongly wrote "iris" instead of "diaphragm" (I found better dictionary meanwhile). Try this with fresnel lens and post here the results.

By the way, I tried binoculars and camera teleobjective, but with no results!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), January 11, 2002.

Hi everyone,

I have made my own unit and tested several techniques: regular 3x fresnel lens with different diaphragms, overhead projector arm, overhead projector fresnel lens (the plate of the overhead projector), mirror at +/- 45° or reversed tv, and different screens.

Here are my results: The best picture I get with Fresnel lens, 6 inch. diaphragm (14 inch. tv), mirror, and screen made of fiber board painted with white ceiling paint.

Why a fresnel lens: I couldn’t get a 6 inch. or bigger concave lens at reasonable price. The fresnel lens does not allow for perfect focusing but is a lot cheaper. My overhead projector fresnel lens is probably a 6x or 7x, making focusing almost impossible, I couldn’t catch the entire picture in it, and the projected picture was far to big. The overhead projector arm looked great, screwed on the side of the tv. Focusing was easy and the picture really sharp. But the size of the lens, 3 inch. diameter, make the image so dim, it’s hard to watch an entire movie, especially “darker” ones.

Why only 6 inch.: The bigger the diaphragm, the brighter the picture, but also the blurrier. I chose 6 inch. as a compromise between brightness and blur. I think it will depend on the quality of your lens.

Why a mirror: In my own opinion, reversing the tv as two major inconveniences, first left and right are inverted (reading text in a movie or dvd menu a real pain in the ass especially if watching a movie in a foreign language), second you must put your projector on a table or something taking a lot more room than when using a mirror as the projector sits on the floor.

About the screen: A good screen is really important. If you can’t get an actual screen, using ceiling paint is cheap and gives good results.

About my box: The first I made was made of cardboard following instructions found on BSTV. The second one was made of fiberboard still following BSTV instructions. But the final one I made following my instinct. The fresnel lens is placed between two pieces of glass as it is not perfectly flat and so flexible it would bend during focusing. It is placed on a fiberboard rectangle with a 6 inch. Round hole as the diaphragm in the middle of it. This piece of fiberboard is held by nuts and washers on 20 inch. bolts glued to the tv set (focus is accurate and I can lock it). To ensure darkness, I use four pieces of fiberboard attached to the bolds and ended with foam so I can focus. The mirror goes on top of the box supported by two fiberboard triangles glued to it. The whole thing is taut and stable so I can easily move it and get it ready to work.

Some tips for better picture: - Turn contrast on full. This is what gives your picture its brightness. - Turn brightness high - high/medium, not on full. Full brightness increases the overall light but also increases blur. - Turn color/saturation high - high/medium. It helps balancing the lack of light without the blur but it can make the image look fluorescent. - If your projector is connected to a computer (like mine) you probably have several other settings available (saturation, gamma correction, anti flickering….).

Well, that’s my thing.

Several things I mentioned where already discussed on that board and most tips are well known by most of you guys. But I hope this could help new comers and maybe open new sights.

-- EarT (eart92@hotmail.com), January 11, 2002.

I was looking at some of the ideas on this site and come accross the problem with the remote not working properly. My idea was not to go out and buy a remote extender but desolder the remote eye and placing it on the outside of the box . Its just a 2 wire sensor and easy to extend the wires without paying $80.00 for the extender. 10 minutes tops !

-- mark g (memturbo@yahoo.com), January 12, 2002.

Heya all well yes the tv projector works but not that well Now i have built a lcd projector if ne one is interested in looking at the pics email me lcd is so much brighter and it dousent have to be dark! to tell u the truth the tv projector would never work that well because look at the crt video projectors Look how bright the crt tubes in them are to get a good image

-- jordan (jord4231@hotmail.com), January 14, 2002.

There is such mixed reviews on this subject I'm pretty anxious to try it. I think if its done right and with some experimenting u can turn something pretty cool. but if the tv thing dont work i have a GREAT idea, which im pretty confident will work ( i think ).

Try making a tiny version (shoebox size maybe) and put your old alarm clock in there *upside down (i'd rather flip my clock than my tv), most clocks with those red LED displays have a bright adjustment. i'll try making one after i try the tv. feel free to try it out. radio shack sells a crappy projection clock and frankly it sucks and its like over 30 bucks. Get an old alarm clock from the thrift store for one or two bucks. with the right placement (hide your ghetto looking box) it can look pretty cool at nite.

-- Joe C. (menotyou69@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

can someone search the web to find some program for reversing image on the computer screen? it would be the easiest way to solve problem with reversed picture.

also, has anyone tried to put projector on curved computer screen, picking up image from screen filter? if so, what results you obtained.

EarT, put a peace of foamboard with diaphragm few inches IN FRONT OF FRESNEL and experiment with diferent size of diaphragm. can you post here what type of lens is on your OHP (is it convex/concave, what is the diameter, focal lenth etc). i am asking that becose my OHP had two lenses.

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), January 16, 2002.

Very Creative Joe C., it will also work with the LCD projects meathod and an LCD Clock or even an old Watch.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 16, 2002.

I was really excited about trying this product until I found this site. I was going to use a 19inch computer monitor and run an "complete entertainment system" through my pc w/ATI radeon and DTS setup, but now that I know that this is really just a Science fair project I won't bother. Thank you very much, because I might have wasted alot of time and effort on a project that really isn't right for me. I think that I'll just sit closer to my TV. :-)

Eric

-- Eric (epontbriand@brainchildsolutions.com), January 16, 2002.

Hey Eric, Have I got a project for you! Come on over to where the air is clean, I can tell you how to get, how to get to the LCD site!

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui

Sorry spending too much time with 4 year old neice.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 16, 2002.

I just came back to post my results from my experiment with my new ghetto projection tv. To those who say that it is total crap, u must not know what your doing b/c it works. Now let me first say, of course noone "expects too much" from a projection tv made out of cardboard.

I only wanted to try it out and see what happened. I tore apart an old boombox cardboard box wiht a razor blade, yard stick (barely used it), and some duct tape. i didnt bother painting it. i threw this together in 10 mins. i didnt want to waste time if this thing didnt work. i hooked it to my 13 inch tv, at 3 oclock n the afternoon, 3 windows in the room, shades up (in other words: it was NOT dark). and ta da, i got a pic. i didnt make it huge maybe only like 4 feet or so (bigger than any tv i have), i can see how if u get bigger it might not be sharp unless in perfect darkness. But u ppl who are taping aluminum foil on windows and all that are nuts.

My rig was pretty crappy, i mean youi could see the light coming ouit of the edges and it still worked! not good enuff to watch but if i cleaned it up i think it will fulfill most ppl's expectations. im gonnna make it nice and out of fiber board probably. i want to build it into a coffee table or something. and yes its true ur screen gets screwy when u turn it upside down, i aint gonna do that , im gonna first get a sharp picture first THAN work wiht mirrors, i know it can be done. i used the very same box and and filled the space with a towel and used it on my 9 inch tv, it was just as good.

one thing ppl were sayin was , they took the fresnel lens and just held it in front of the tv and it worked better. i can see that may be true. the reason I think is ... is because u kinda jam in the lens (taped to the board) and it bends the lens causeing blur. u definitly need the box itself though , i think just to catch all the light and to stop the light from coming out from behind the lens and shining on the wall.

can anyone who has used mirrors show me what they did. I mean do u need a mirror the same size as the lens opening? anyone successfully hook up enuff mirrors to align the picture correct without turnnig ur tv upside down. im gonna draw up some plans and show u all .. anyone feel free to email me at menotyou69@hotmail.com or talk to me on AOL MeNotYou6969 lets all design somethig nice and easy that will work.

-- Joe C. (menotyou69@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

Hey Joe, Way to go. If you want to flip your image and not your TV you should use an odd number of mirrors (as an even number of mirrors puts you back where you started) 1 mirror at 45 degree will do the job with TV on back. And I was thinking a 3 mirror set up would do the trick for bending the light around to keep TV upright. As I was diagraming it in my head I think I came up with a simpler solution, try this.

If you were to mount your mirror on the bottom plane of the box at a 45 degree angle facing the ceiling your image would be corrected on the ceiling (this is where most turn TV on back. But, what if you take that same mirror and twist it 45 degree perpendicular to the first 45 degrees. Your image is still corrected but it is now half on the ceiling and half on the wall (depending on your set-up you may need to preceed this with 2 other mirror in order to be able to "overshoot" the box) and is shooting from the bottom corner of the box back over its opposing shoulder.

Now you should be able by turning the TV on it vertical axis, to rotate the image to where you want it, but above and twisted a bit. By using shims or spacers under the TV at 4 corners w/ individual heights you should be able to rectify the image.

Vua La, No turning TV over. However it sits at a twisted angle instead of level.

I am sure some one can come up with a way to use multiple mirrors and keep the whole thing neat and level, but this is a way to do it with just ONE. Go ahead upgrade your system without spending a cent.

Would someone tell me if this works as I no longer have my Ghetto Projector set-up, opted for LCD.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), January 17, 2002.

I surfed on the web a bit yesterday, and I think I found the cause of all our problems here.

Look at the OHP`s specifications and you will see that all of them have doublet or triplet magnifying lens (not the fresnel lens, fresnel is not magnifying image, but only evenly dispersing light from the light bulb). My ex-OHP (ex because I had to return it to his owner) had two lenses, and I thought it was like that because it was very old model and that newer models have only one lens. But that lens that looks like one lens is actualy multiple (three) lens. Why are OHP`s build like that? Probably because only one lens causes color and geometric distortion (astigmatism), and to prevent that you need two or more lenses. So, all of you guys that have your own OHP, PLEASE disassemble OHP`s arm and look what lenses are in there, and then post it here.

I think that what we need are the same types of lenses like in OHP, only the bigger ones, and not the fresnel lens you are using, because magnifying lenses in OHPs obviously are doing their job very well.

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), January 18, 2002.

Well just wanted to know if anyone of you has tried it out with an LCD monitor? I am not sure how bright the picture is...coz I have a latop at home and was really excited about trying this out with it?

Any comments are welcome

-- Faiz Shaikh (fasgf3@umkc.edu), January 18, 2002.

Hi all, If u are searching for a x3 fresnel lens , e-mail jalacchi@hotmail.com . He sells the lens for 1295 plus instructions. He is based in CANADA

-- bigjayuk (jimmypilnick@hotmail.com), January 21, 2002.

My OHP's lens is 3 inch diameter and concave/convex. I'm not sure concave/convex is the actual designation. It is concave on one side and convexe on the other.

-- EarT (eart92@hotmail.com), January 21, 2002.

http://cgi.ebay.ca/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1693740419

Here is a link to an ebay auction of an item most would need if they were to use an projection panel instead of an lcd.. the problem with the lcd's is the driver boards and the extra work you'd have to finish up..

-- Darryl P. (darrylpp@yahoo.com), January 22, 2002.

Would you all recommend the 100 inch TV design then. You can't really complain about brightness for $30.00 !!!!!

Regards

Simon

-- Simon Lee (simon@lee1287.freeserve.co.uk), January 22, 2002.

check out this auction. This thing really works and he only charged me $9.

http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=1326222632&r=0&t=0&showTutorial=0&ed=1012200442&indexURL =0&rd=1

-- Brandon styles (poserinc@yahoo.com), January 23, 2002.

Hey EarT - Do you have any pictures of your box you can share with us?

Does anyone have a web page up with pictures of their completed box? Every link I try to follow is 404.. Thx!

-- Erik (erik8881@yahoo.com), January 23, 2002.

Hey Erik go there: http://www.msnusers.com/100inchTV

I know it's MSN, I know it's full of ads, I know it sucks, but it was fast and easy to setup, and everybody can post pictures or documents.

-- EarT (eart92@hotmail.com), January 23, 2002.

Has any of you guys experimented with opaque projector?

I think it might be solution for 100inchTV!!!

Check out this one:

http://www.kintronics.com/Plus/DP-60.html

it has f=323mm (12.7') F=2.45 lens, which means diameter of lens is 131mm. It is actualy combination of two or more lenses, they are color-corrected, and usualy big enough to project bright image. So if any of you have an opaque, try to use lens from it instead of fresnel lens. It should give you much better image, and with no blur. Also, check out these sites:

http://www.glassmart.com/opaque_projector.asp

http://www.dickblick.com/zz530/23/products.asp?param=0&ig_id=4237

http://www.dickblick.com/zz530/19/products.asp?param=0&ig_id=3603

http://www.dickblick.com/zz530/04/products.asp?param=0&ig_id=3100

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), January 25, 2002.

anyone who wants to know how this works, without paying for it should check out this site. BSTV Central - Home of the 100 inch TV Projector

-- David Simmons (dcs997@yahoo.com), January 26, 2002.

ok

HAS ANYONE AT ALL HERE PERFECTED THE PLANS

this guy thinks he has can anyone confirm this?

http://www.geocities.com/usmcemti/100__PROJECTION_TV_PLANS.html

I WANT RELIABILITY m.langway is getting great ideas but i for one need something solid,reliable to go on. PLEASE WRITE ME IF YOU HAVE PERFECTED YOUR 100 inch tv

-- christian morris (chris_clear47@hotmail.com), January 27, 2002.

Well, I made my projector over the last 2 days. Since then I have been trying to quantify the quality of the picture. Before I discuss the results let me speak to the specifications of my "100 Inch Television".

13" MCA Color TV

Reversed the polarity of source TV because color did not work when the television was upside down. I did attempt uplugging it, turning upside down, waiting 10-15 minutes, then plugging it back in. This did not work, so I opened the the TV and spliced the wires. I do have to admit I was quite concerned about electrical shock. To protect myself I wore rubber gloves, rubber soled tennis shoes, and stood on an old tire while I worked on it. Then when I plugged it back in I ducked under work bench for fear of the possible implosion.

Lens is a page magnifier from Staples.

I used a modified version of the basic plan. This is a box with no ends and the width and height of the television screen. The only modification I made was I used 1/4" hardboard material from The Home Depot.

I have placed this contraption in a spare bedroom with one north facing window that I have covered with cardboard to block out nearly all the ambient light.

I have used some foam rubber to act as a baffle to reduce the fuzzines along the edges of the projection. Basically the foam rubber forms a 5" square opening at the projection end of my box.

For fine tuning the image I have the lense mounted on a 1/4" piece of hardwood that has been cut to fit snuggly inside the box. In each of the four corners I have inserted black drywall screws about 1/3 the length of the screw. This gives me a handle to reach in and pull the lense towards the front after I have pushed it to far back. I use a ruler to push the lense in place, at the same time the ruler allows me to accurately measure the distance of each corner of the lense panel to the front edge of the box. Measuring insures that the lense panel is perpendicular to the edges of the box.

The projection surface is drywall covered with an almost beige colored paint. I suspect that a white semigloss pain would be an excellent choice, but my wife won't let me paint the wall.

Now to try to quantify the results.

Results on the TV Guide Channel - I can't read the current time on the far left hand side. However I am able to read the television listings, especially easy when they reach the center of the screen.

Football Game Fox - It is difficult to make out the score in the fox box. Almost all stats displayed at the edges of the screen are difficult at best.

Cartoons work great!!!

Brightness - I consider the brightness to be adequate, but the room has to be dark. I remember watching movies on a 8mm projector at my grandparents house when I was a kid. It reminds me a lot of that experience.

If I went to the movie theater and it looked like this I would probably be upset, but I doubt I would get up and ask for my money back. Actually as I remember the movie "Bringing Out the Dead" looked about like my screen does anyway.

When I started considering this it was my goal to make it look like a nice piece of furniture, and use it on a regular basis. Then, as I read this entire board I decided that I just wanted to try to see what kind of results I could get. I am resonably content with my outcome. What I enjoy about it most is showing my friends my "Ghetto Big Screen TV". They walk in and see a glorified cardboard box with lime green foam rubber sticking out the front, sitting on an old saw horse. This immediately serves to lower their expectations. Then I bring down the houselights and wait about ten seconds before I turn it on. Almost invariably they are impressed with the results. The usual comments usually include questions like "If you can get these results with $20 worth of parts and an old tv, why hasn't the television idustry perfected the concept using like $200 worth of parts.

Finally, what will I do with this project now that I am done? I will probably keep it up until most of my friends and family have seen it in action. Then I will take it down to the basement to collect dust. That way when I am an old man and my grandkids come over and start looking through my junk I will show them what big screen TVs were like when I was a young man.

-- Mark (timeforcake@prodigy.net), January 30, 2002.

Why don't you, geniuses, emulate a regular projection TV and be happy with a 40" to 50" diagonal size! There is insufficient brightness (in lumens) to project the picture to a wall of the dimensions you hope for. Think about building your own standard rear-projection tv and your TV will not be in the way as when you are projecting the image looking at the wall.

-- LYKE AYE SED ABUV (VerySensibleGuy@AskAndTry.Net.Au), January 31, 2002.

Although I am convinsed that opaque projector's lens is the right thing, an idea came acros my mind.

Has anyone tried multi-lens configuration?

What I mean is this. Divide tv screen at 2 or 4 parts, and use the same number of fresnel lenses. Because fresnel is deforming the edges of picture, use only the inner part of each lens to project each part of tv screen. Also try to put panel with 2/4 diaphragms in front of fresnels to cut off deformed edges of each picture.

I know it will probably be very hard to synchronize 2/4 images, but it should give much more light than only one lens, and much sharper image. I don't have lenses, so I can't try this

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 01, 2002.

Perfection is relative and subjective. You'll be happier striving for your own satisfaction.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 01, 2002.

I made a irc chatroom on dalnet its "100inchtv". Iam using a ultraoptix 81/2 by 11 lens not sure of the x. I get a really blury image I mean really blurry. Could it be because it has a little Light coming out of box?

-- Adam (atombomb00@msn.com), February 01, 2002.

Try flipping the lens. I did the project with a 13 inch Sharp TV and it looks GREAT! Just make sure you get a good white screen, i used posterboard and project the image onto that. All in all if you use things with A/V inputs you get a better picture. My gamecube looks sweet on it buy my VCR doesn't due to the single cable I have it hooked up with. Also try adjusting your focus if flipping the lens doesn't work.

-- PC (P12C16@aol.com), February 02, 2002.

Thx for the help I fliped it and it worked. And for some reason with my 8 by 11 lens I got from office max u need to use the whole rectangle peice. Not cut out a whole. I used it with tin foil and it faded out the pic but it was clear thx to flippin it. So using black paint or black material Iam sure I will get a good pic. I dont need more light with the tin foil trick I get enough light Iam using a monitor a 13 inch.

-- Adam (atombomb00@msn.com), February 02, 2002.

Adam, I'm not sure what you were talking about "works without need to cut a hole", but it is possible you have misunderstood a portion of the project. There is no need to cut your mag lense. If you find the outer most comlete fresnel ring or near to it, trace it write on the lens with pencil and mask out the rings outside of the circle with black opaque material. This helps because the rings outside the last full ring cause "ambient light" emission. Also if you make a second aperature (mask frame out from lense) which can be adjusted in size and carefully adjust with text on screen, you can find the point where your picture is sharpest. Also the black interior will make a difference, and the tinfoil thing creates more ambient light, not more image light.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@mayberry.com), February 04, 2002.

hello ...

I heard about the fresnel len for the "big screen tv." I bought the len but I have not start putting everything together just yet. I was hoping that there is anyone one would help me in the instructions. I'm wondering that what is the usual length to for the box (distances between tv screen and the box) for best view.) And I was told that to measure the length of the tv screen only, not the whole thing around it. Well...What if I put the tv inside the box, will the image going to blurry or it will not work since the light from the tv is not focusing into one point. Thanks

-- ngocchau (ngocchau@asurfer.com), February 04, 2002.

This has to be the best page I've landed on today. A 100inch TV is a dream! At some point I'll get myself a 16X9 widescreen but until then, I may just have to try this.

I need to do some more research but check http://www.originalplots.com/ I plan to add a section with pictures of my own experiences, different sized TV's and free plans all in PDF format. Booya. Watch for the link to appear on the left hand side! This will be great!

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 06, 2002.

Ha! In good faith I've posted a page dedicated to this awesome hobby. Give me a little time to set it up. I have a digital camera so I'll post my results on-line. Visit the site, tell me what you want to know and I'll try to post it when I can find it! It's all free.

http://www.originalplots.com/100inch.html

Bryan O'Neill

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@originalplots.com), February 06, 2002.

Hi, I have no idea where I have been hiding seeing as I've only just learnt about this 100" TV!!!!!! Anyway I have the lens, some plans and am trying to push myself into making it. However sites I've seen show the basic job to look well too 'basic', is anyone aware of any plans on the net where I can make a more attractive and permanent box for my lens and TV, something like a coffee table perhaps? One last comment, if you're making a complete box to place the TV in, does the hole where the power cable comes out of affect the light into the box and if so how have others overcome it? Thanks for your time anyone and everyone, please contact me josflat@aol.com or by replying on this board to enlighten me on my questions raised. Jo

-- Jo (josflat@aol.com), February 06, 2002.

Ok, well I just spent the last 3 hours reading every little post on this page. Lets just say I have alot of time on my hands. I first learned about the whole 100 inch TV plan on ebay. People have been selling that information on there for quite some time. I knew once I saw it there that it had to be somewhere online. I found many plans but all fail to provide pictures and explain in detail. I checked every darn site posted on here and not one had complete building instructions with pix and diagrams. I really want to build one of these things and am searching here in Japan where I live for the right lenses. But truly someone really needs to have a site that works with all there plans and pictures (step by step) to help others. I have noticed many people are asking for this here but there is nothing like this. I feel someone should build a site that everyone can go to and learn how to build this 100 inch TV with step by step easy to follow instructions. This would help out alot of people. If anyone could please email me complete and exact details of this with step by step pictures, I will post them on my web site for all to see and learn. I really would like to see everyones plans that have suceeded at this! Thanx

-- Josh (NEURONIGHT@yahoo.com), February 07, 2002.

I also went to an electronic store here. I checked out a small 13" plasma TV. I asked a guy there if he minded if I tryed something and well, he really didn`t give a crap. I found there the top of an overhead projector and place it near the screen of the TV. I put the picture on a white wall nearby and my god the quality was unreal! For as much lite that was in the store the picture was great! Im sure if I had $1,200 to throw away on the plasma TV I could make a very nice projection TV with perfect quality! Has anyone here used a plasma TV?

-- Josh (NEURONIGHT@yahoo.com), February 07, 2002.

Hi... I bought the fresnel lens and I have built one on Feb 5, 2002. Well, I have tested the tv. and I did not work-- probably because My box I'm created had too many lights going in and out. Anyway, I have heard that You guys and in the instructions told to measure only the screen of the tv and not the box around it. Well...I did and it is not possible to cover all the holes. I asking please If any one here have tried this, Could I measure the box around the tv..In that case it makes it easy for me to cover all the escape light but I do not know if it will reduce the brightness or not showing the display screen at all. And Does anybody here know what color is the best to paint for the inside of the box. It is Silver or Black (for the brightness). thanks I will post pictures and plans once I have my big screen is successfully built so everyone could do it without wasting their time. please constribute an answer to my problems

-- ngocchau (ngocchau@asurfer.com), February 07, 2002.

I am in the process of compiling a plan, with pictures, in PDF format...FOR FREE. I want to make sure it has the best information, and lots of diagrams and pictures so it may take a few weeks. I also want to perfect it myself! Talk about a Holy Grail assignment! I'm lovin it. Let me know what kinds of things you want covered and I'll try to include them.

Here's a little info on screens which I found interesting. It's posted on my page.

This not a dead link! I promise.

http://www.originalplot s.com/100inch.html

Thanks.

Bryan

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 07, 2002.

Stay away from these sites that are pure sales, and have popup windows when you open the web page. You know they are scams. I've been reading through the posts and found some good sites from good people that share their knowledge. I will be attempting to do this in a few weeks. Since putting the tv upside down can be trouble, the best thing I though of was to use one of those old cabinets that used to hold a record player and the top used to lift (to access it) by 2 little pneumatic rods like in a hatchback. Someting like that would be IDEAL. I will post once I get started.

Many people say they have built this and I've yet to see a picture of the result, not the box itelsf, but what the display looks like on the wall. Personally 100" is way too big as I don't have a wall that big so I will try to get a 2X lens intead of 3.

Good luck all.

-- Monty (ytnom@hotmail.com), February 07, 2002.

MY PROJECTOR IS AMAZING!!!!

While I was reading reviews all over the web about this 100 inch tv thing I noticed that a lot of people were talking about using LCD screens because of the picture quality and brightness.

Well I have a 5" lcd screen for the ps one, I FOUND OUT A WAY TO WATCH TV ON IT! I can simply hook up my vcr into the LCD tv, IF YOU PLUG THE CABLE CORD INTO THE VCRs INPUT THAN YOU CAN TURN THE CHANNEL USING THE VCR MAKING ABLE TO WATCH TV ON!

So I just built a box for a lens thats a 7X11 fresnal lens. I put the LCD screen in the back of the box and put tape on it to hold it up from falling down.

ALSO ANOTHER THING THAT I'VE NOTCIED TO HELP OUT ALOT WITH BRIGHTNESS AND QUALITY ON THIS WOULD BE SINCE THE SCREEN IS ONLY 5" AND THE LENS IS 7x11 INCHES THAN THE LENS IS BIGGER THAN THE SCREEN, MAKING IT SO EASY TO GET QUALITY.

NOTE: you can get a playstation LCD on ebay for about half the price of what they sell for in the stores. I bought mine on ebay for $68.00 including s/h.

feel free to email if you have any questions about this.

-- Tricky (jbbauer54@msn.com), February 08, 2002.

hey guys, i found a good site and thought i would post it here. it has three FREE plans and pictures!!!!!

check it out.

http://www.bstvcentral.b0x.com/

-- Jordan (greeny151@yahoo.com), February 08, 2002.

I JUST CAN’T UNDERSTAND WHY YOU DON’T READ ANY OF THE POSTS HERE. YOU CAN’T MAKE TV PROJECTOR WITH FRESNEL. WITH IT YOU CAN ACHIEVE ONLY BLURRY OR LESS BLURRY IMAGE. FIND SOME COLOR CORRECTED PROJECTION LENS INSTEAD OF FRESNEL.

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 09, 2002.

I got my hands on the new Sony D-VM1 portable DVD player with a small LCD screen here in Japan. The LCD screen has a brightness control nob and gets very bright. I just made a 70ft screen on my wall using an old shoe box and a 3x lens! This is truly kick ass!

-- Josh (NEURONIGHT@yahoo.com), February 11, 2002.

Still experimenting and waiting on some new information! It seems that monitors smaller then 19" work out better for brightness.

I'm still working on the plans. I've already got almost 8 pages worth of quality info. Keep checking the site and tell me what you want to know in the new guide!

http://www.originalpl ots.com/100inch.html

-Bryan

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 12, 2002.

Hey you guys with the LCD based "box projectors". If you can remove the backlight assembly, add a small fan and a stronger light source w/ a diffusser (fresnel) between the new light and the LCD screen. I would guarantee an improvement of at least 200% over what you have already acheived. Check out the LCD projector site.

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=006hui

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 13, 2002.

WOW! thats all I can say about reading all of these posts. I have a few questions though. I an new to all of this, I haven't ordered lens or anything. My questions are these. What type of lens do you use 2x, 3x, 5x? I've seen ebay people selling 5x lens saying that they are much better is this true? ok, now the determining question. If I order these plans I will mostely use it to play ps2 and watch Anime (cartoons) will this work better than watching normal tv. in the anime, which contains subtitles (writing at the bottom of the screen) will they apear backwords or will they be ok. Thanks for your time. Any other tips would be greatly appreciated

-- Wizardofwoz (awozolek@kent.edu), February 13, 2002.

No one buy plans! I'm going to have the best set of plans...EVER on my site very soon - ALL FOR FREE!

Most of the plans you buy will tell you that you have to turn your TV upside down. This is, was, and will be a bad idea unless it's a flat screen LCD. TV's weren't meant to be turned upside down. It can damage your set, and cause you hassle.

Using two mirrors it seems you can project onto a surface and keep your TV upright. I'll have pics and more coming soon.

Bryan

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 14, 2002.

Ok, here's what I'm thinking. Arrows point movement of Box 2 for focusing. I'm not sure how the mirrors would fasten yet. More to come on the site. But it's a start.

Check out the site for updates! Bryan

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 14, 2002.

Hey guys, If you really want to know all about this tv you HAVE to go to this site ok?

http://www.bstvcentral.b0x.com/

It will tell you everything you need to know, and best of all, THEY HAVE THE MOST DETAILED PLANS AND THEY ARE FREE!!!!! Beleive me, you'll be grateful you checked it out.

-- Joel Mansell (jaguar23@iinet.net.au), February 15, 2002.

Hey guys,

The plans at http://www.bstvcentral.b0x.com/ are good, and free, but it might be more work then some are willing to put into it. I just posted my first verison of free plans on the web!

http://www.originalpl ots.com/100inch.html

It's 11 pages, detailed instructions, and much more. And it's FREE! Just scroll down the page. It's under downloads.

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 15, 2002.

Hey Bryan, GREAT Stuff!!! Great Attitude!! Great Graphic!!

OK how the heck did you get the diagram to post, I know several people who are gonna be asking this. I'd really apreciate a description of how you did it, as I am involved in several of these boards. On our LCD board were referring people to a yahoo sight for images. Your knowledge is needed, come to our rescue!!!

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 15, 2002.

I've always been a movie lover. When I saw this I had to try it. It's too cheap not to! The pics have come from many "educational" kids sites across the web. Of course most plans will tell you turn your TV upside down. Maybe I'm crazy, but I'd like to find a better way if a TV over 19" is used. That's taking it a notch higher then any plans you'd purchase on the web.

The actual diagrams I made myself with the help of PhotoDraw 2000. Of course, for ease of printing for the viewing public I exported the file with Adobe Acrobat into PDF. I totally plan to add, and revise the plans as needed. I want a cheap projection TV as much as everyone else! I'm glad people are checking it out! Much more to come! Thanks for the kind words.

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@originalplots.com), February 17, 2002.

You want to know why you shouldn't trust these "Its not a scam" messages? They write officemax OfficeMax. They don't know when to use their,there or they're, but they are extremely cautious to write out the names of businesses with the appropriate capatilization.

ps2 rules

-- Ryan Hamel (rhamel224@juno.com), February 18, 2002.

http://www.ravado.com/stuff/ProjX_mirror_set.jpg

-- ReverendG (ProjX@ravado.com), February 19, 2002.

This is to address the issue of righting the image without inverting the television/monitor. It is my understanding that it is safer to have the set facing downward. There is the issue of supporting the whole thing, but if you go this route, I'm sure you can figure out a rig that will do it. If the television/monitor is placed at 45degrees, with the mirror at a lesser angle, the image is righted with very slight image skewing. This is the best easy solution I have found so far.

I want to thank all of you here for posting your trials and errors, insights, and ideas. I think the keys here are patience and a good lens. I just built my box today with an acrylic full-page magnifier ($5 @ Staples). The boxes are Bailey's Irish Cream shipping boxes which fit my old Samsung 13" perfectly. I altered the inner box to make it slightly smaller. I have the usual newbie complaints that the image is either too blurry or too dim, depending on adjustments. So far, the opening for the lens seems to be the deciding factor. The smaller the opening, the clearer (yet dimmer) the picture. I started with a 7" round opening, and reduced it to 3" for the best balance of clarity and brightness.

With everyone talking about buying or disassemling LCDs and getting more precise, and no doubt expensive parts, rest assured that I will keep working on the low tech versions for all the dumpster-divers among us.

Good luck, and good health.

-- ReverendG (ProjX@ravado.com), February 19, 2002.

I tried a 5" screen and got mixed results. The picture was bigger, but not near the output of the 19". A 13" screen may be the sweetspot sized monitor to use for this whole project.

I like the idea of facing the screen downward. The only real question now would be how to mount it, so the monitor was secure. Hmmm...

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@originalplots.com), February 19, 2002.

Hey Bryan, Just noticed on your graphic. Using only 2 mirrors puts you right back to the same image unless your lense is also performing a flip. If your lense is doing it there would be no reason for the mirrors though. If you use an odd number of mirrors your problem should be solved.

By the way I am still awaiting an answer on the graphic posting method, if you have read even a small amount of this board you will realise that I have been an unselfish major contributor here.

Mike

PS. Currently Running Own Tests on What were you thinking board, making quite a mess which it now occurs to belongs on this page. I will be most happy to begin tests here.

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 19, 2002.

anyone considered using lens from opaque projector? no? ok!

when you finaly discover the reason why you have to put smaler hole on the box to get clearer, but dimmer image, it will be nice to try an opaque!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 20, 2002.

Let me apologise ahead of time for any snide remarks that I made yesturday on the boards. I was very frustrated and am stressed out at the moment. I have a bad habit of becoming very sarcastic when frustrated and vented in the wrong places.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 20, 2002.

The whinner is right about the opaque. I think the confusion has come from that he is suggesting to use the opaque optics and the TVs light. This is technically the same thing you guys are doing but with a setup that already has proper angles & distances. The set-up I tried with the opaque projectors light on did not work, but if you utilise the light from the TV you get about the same or better results than full assembly on your own. It also works utilising the optic set-up from an old OHP. You will have to experiment as you do now, but if you start out "ahead of the game" your efforts are more concentrated on tweaking the final product. The final product is certainly watchable, but if your television habits take up a lot of your time you will find it a dismal environment in which to spend so much time.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 20, 2002.

-- test (imfatter@excite.com), February 20, 2002.

img src="http://www.geocities.com/rizlazz/righthand.jpg">

-- (imfatter@excite.com), February 20, 2002.

-- (imfatter@excite.com), February 20, 2002.

-- (imfatter@excite.com), February 20, 2002.

-- (imfatter@excite.com), February 20, 2002.

http://www.geocities.com/rizlazz/righthand.jpg

-- (imfatter@excite.com), February 20, 2002.

Hey "ImFatter", I found out that they are pointing to a graphic already residing on the web. The code can be found in the document source on this page. And someone (I leave it anonomous so he doesn't get flooded with requests) has graciously offered to put up some stuff for me. I have photos of 2 versions of my box projector coming for you guys and if I can get a hold of the diagrams I was using again they will be coming as well, just finishing roll of film. I'm waiting for about 3 shots I need to take on another project that got stalled momentarily.

I would appreciate it if you could post some text on the page so that people will recognise that I am not the one continueing to test.

Mike

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 20, 2002.

Posting what? A simple image to the board? Type the following in the box before you hit submit.

<a href="http://www.blah.blah.com/images/nameofimage.jpg">

Keep in mind that big pictures will add to the loading time of this page. Bryan

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@oneilldesigns.com), February 20, 2002.

Just a quick question, I have set up my box and put the lens in facing the correct way. As yet I have not painted the inside of the box black, but will be doing that toninght. I focus the picture as best as possible, however I get a white glow around the white parts of the picture and it is blurry. What can be done about this? Will painting the box black help? Or is there some other reason? Please help. Thanks!

-- Joel (jaguar23@iinet.net.au), February 21, 2002.

Hey I'm new at this 100 inch tv thing, so i have a question. I ordered a 5'6 inch lcd monitor you can check it out here:http://www.mp3playerstore.com/stuff_you_need/special/index.html for about $100 and trying to get a 5x lens off of Ebay, How well do the quality of this will be or do you think it'll even work with such a small screen? Thanks

-- ZombieRes (zombieres@yahoo.com), February 21, 2002.

Mike, it seams to me that you are the only person here that is reading my posts !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I spoke with an optics engeneer, and he told me what i already knew: it is not possible to make tv projector with one plano/convex lens (ordinary glass or fresnel, it doesnt meter).

When using ordinary plano/convex lens, there are many of aberations (color, geometric etc.). you can readabout it on:

http://www.fresneltech.com

this is the reason why i am posting messages to try another lens. That optics engeneer told me that with lens from opaque projector picture will be OK, because it is built for similar purpose as our tv projector. Also you could use lenses from old printing aperature, used many years ago in printing proces (before computers). they have lenses with adequate focal lenght etc.

Its hard for me to translate to english all the details he told me, so if any of you know any optics engeneer, speak to him.

Point is that you are concentrating on the wrong problem!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THE BOX IS NOT A PROBLEM, BUT THE LENS IS.

I know that because i tried 5 simple plano/convex lenses, and with all of them i had same problems as you with fresnel.

Mike, you wrote some time ago that you have some opaque. Experiment with it and post results here. Also, please send me photos to my e- mail.

I hope others will finaly start reading my posts

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 22, 2002.

Hey "whinner", I have to many projects going right now to take anything on at the moment. But I will be on the look out for a small color TV that I could use, both my opaques are for fairly small enlargements.

Hang in there, there are a hundred ways to do everything, point is to find the one thats best for you.

I've got some really interesting things going on in the field of magnetism now, you should check it out, over at the what were you thinking board.

By the way my e-mail is "m(underscore)langway@bigfoot.com" m_langway@bigfoot.com.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 22, 2002.

Found this site today... It has FREE Plans in PDF or Flash with color pictures of the finished product. I am not going to try to build one since I do not have the room for 100inches of TV. Just thought you would like to see my new finding... BTW: I just bought a 52inch RCA Scenuim and I love it.. here is the site.....http://bstvcentral.b0x.com/ Enjoy

-- (mcvey_1@yahoo.com), February 23, 2002.

mike, check this out

http://sharp-world.com/sc/library-e/techn_top/journal2000/pdf/11.pdf

might help you with your lcd projector

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 25, 2002.

I just bought that 5x lens from ebay, built the box, painted it black and sealed the edges. Sure, it works, and I was fairly impressed... but mann, the brightness was so low, I couldn't make out some of the text and some faces. YES, i fiddled with the TV settings-- brightness, contrast, sharpness, etc.

and YES, the room was dark as a basement at night. I'm not asking for advice or help, rather, I'm just going to pay the money and get a real TV.

There was a post just like this before saying that this is nothing more than a rainy Sunday project to kill time. If you want a projection TV, buy a projector! or go see a freaking movie!

All in all, as far as I'm concerned, it IS a scam.

-- AC (supernaoki@hotmail.com), February 26, 2002.

mike, check this out also

http://www.extremetech.com/article/0,3396,apn%253D4%2526s%253D1021% 2526a%253D15893%2526app%253D2%2526ap%253D3,00.asp

(check spaces)

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 27, 2002.

it seems this url is not the best one. it doesnt go to right page. try to cut and past these words in yahoo search and then go to the first listed url:

The optics in a projector are used to channel the light from the lamp to the imaging engine and then to the screen, maintaining as much efficiency and accuracy as possible.

good luck!!!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), February 27, 2002.

Okay here it for anyone who cares and if you dont care then why are you on this FAQ. This is my fourth project. Started with fare results and now my fourth is perfectly fine. Not A $5000.00 TV but woth the time and around $40.00 I spent on all 4 projects. I had a big screen i 1993, it was an 88 model, this picture is abou the same as that one, I paid $1500.00 for it used and it was a 51". The screen I have with my 19" tv is 120" exactly. My whole wall is covered. Now to explain further, I have two inserts for my box, on for DVD movies and one for playstation and cable, the second box is made for about 90". The small details on the 120" didnt come in quite well enough. I move the TV about * inches closer to the screen and wallah ! TIPS For anyone wondering why the fresnal is used and not regeular magnifying lens it's simple. The fresnal is used in almost every lighthouse in the world (you caN chEck this out on the internet, type in FRESNAL and most of the matches will have "lighthouse" with it.) The fresnal focuses the light into a beam. (Maybe its fresnel with an E.) Magnifying glasses dont do this as wEll as the fresnaL. With a beam of light you get all the light focusing on your screen and less ambiant light about the room. I know the fresnal is the easiest to obtain s I was skeptical too, but hey, just convenient for us. Dont make a square box, make a triangular box with the top cut off. Dont make the opening much bigger then the lens size you are going to use. Blurred edges- Your screen is rounded so round your lens, I just taped the edges of my lensdown very tight and i bowed the lens just enough to straighten those edges. Flat screens are ideal. If you can't seem t bend your lens then you will have to sacrifice the edges of your television. About 2/5" on the sides and 1/4" top and bottom. The box sould fit over those edges and yu will have to block out the light. TV's vary in the way your projection will look. Newer the television, the brighter the colors, and vice-a-versa. The plans at bstv are good but outdated. Not the best results from those. This worked very well for me, fun too. Anyone ever been to the drive in? I have one in my house and the picture is a little better.

-- Chris L. Fryer (CLFchris74@cs.com), February 27, 2002.

One more thing, you have to tape a small box to the end of your triangular box BEFORE you slide in your focusing (lens) box. Or else you will lose light and picture quality inside the triangle.

-- Chris Fryer (CLFchris74@cs.com), February 27, 2002.

Hey Chris great stuff, and your "triangle" box sounds like it would do a great job of eliminating ambient light escaping from projector. I pictured what you were talking about sort of a a 3D trapezoid am I on the rght track, this may be helpful in upgrades of my LCD set-up. Is it only the outer box with a regular retangular lense box insert? How do you adjust the focus?

Hey "whinner" I am not ignoring you, things are very hectic for me right now, I feel like a chicken runnin around with its head cut off. Thank you so much for the URLs I havn't had time to read through the material yet. It seems very pertinent and interesting and should be a great help to my understanding of optics and light. If you will write me at my e-mail (just copy and paste it if you can't click it direct) I have a couple surplus items at the moment that you might be very interested in. Write me soon cause I have offered the stuff first come first serve at the LCD board already (will try to hold the optics I think you'd be interested in). I only expect that you pay shipping.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), February 28, 2002.

I am going to buy a digital camera today, and I will get some pics up as soon as possible. At least by March 5th.

-- Chris Fryer (CLFChris74@cs.com), March 02, 2002.

Has any tried a better quality fresnel lense? I have played with the $5 page magnifies from the office supply stores. However I was reading here http://www.edmundoptics.com/IOD/DisplayProduct.cfm? productid=2040 that "High groove density allows higher quality images". So I was curious if anyone has tried a lense with a higher groove density.

-- Patrick (pdown@bigfoot.com), March 06, 2002.

Has anyone ever tried the 6X fresnal lens? If you look on ebay they have some, but not many. I am using a 3X lens and was wondering how much better the 6X lens would be than what I am currently using. I don't even know if they are really 6X, its not that hard to lie about the magnification power.

Please e-mail me back and tell me if you know about this.

-- Tricky (jbbauer54@msn.com), March 09, 2002.

After spending hours reading and designing/modifing a projector box, over the last 2 days, ive finally reached my goal, to have a good colour/light large projection which was watchable. On Matrix ws DVD, my current picture is 38inch X 78 inch, and i dont thin id want it any bigger. My box is dodgy as well, im hoping to cointue to perfect it as much as possible then make a replica of it out of wood. Im using the back of movie posters as my current screen. Can anyone tell me how much better (if its better) shower curtain are? And im guessing overhead projector screens are ideal.

Also thnx to everyone who contributed to this page, its helped me alot.

-- Trent Naylor (nrk3y@optushome.com.au), March 09, 2002.

After thinking for a long time about how i would invert the picture using 2 mirrors. i finally cracked it, and made a diagram for all those who are interested in inverting the tv without opening it up or turning it upside down.

-- Trent Naylor (nrk3y@optushome.com.au), March 10, 2002.

THIS SITE WORKS http://www.rickleephoto.com/rlcoll.htm

-- Mike Agrello (Censored@anonymous.to), March 10, 2002.

Built one of these things today... creating web page with pics asap.. will post link soon

-- Mike Agrello (Censored@anonymous.to), March 10, 2002.

Web page is up with pictures... http://www25.brinkster.com/mikeee/mikeserver/tv/index.htm

-- Mike Agrello (censored@anonymous.to), March 11, 2002.

Gee, I was looking thru some stuff at Ebay and saw someone selling fresnal lenses so I typed "fresnal" into Google to find out more info .. and that's how I found this board.

It was great reading thru all this stuff - this thread's been going since May, 2000.

Kudo's to all the people working hard to perfect this project - keep going - I'm up to my eyeballs studying Flash5 & ActionScript these days, but I'd sure like to give it try eventually. Don't be discouraged by the nay-sayers - hey, the easiest thing to do in this world is to sit on your a$$ and criticize - anyone can do that! Takes guts and benefits us all when people stay the course and keep trying to come up with answers. Thanx, again, Chris :) !

-- chris (jazchris@sympatico.ca), March 12, 2002.

Okay, I stumbled across this site and since I had nothing better to do with my time, I went out and got the items to make my very own 100 inch tv. After about an hour and a half I was done. So yes, it works, freaked the heck out of me. I watched Survivor tonight on my 10 foot tv screen and although it was super cool, I had the biggest splitting headache when the show was over. I would not recommend watching this larger version of your tv, for longer than an hour, unless you have a really hugh room and can sit at least 20 feet back. I felt as if I was at the movies and sitting in the front row, no wonder the major headache afterwards. I came up with a few modifications to hold the 2 boxes to he screen, if any one is interested you can e-mail me and I can give you more info. Have fun, definately a project that is fun and rewarding. Although I would still watch tv on my regular tv, no headache that way. But I will continue to watch the big screen, just not on a daily basis.

-- lovelyy2j (lovelyy2j@hotmail.com), March 13, 2002.

I was reading across this board the other day and got bored and decided to try and make one of these with my 13in phillips tv. I took a cardboard box buthchered it all up, taped it together and taped on a sheet magnifyer i found at a store for 72 cents. Put it all together (I only used one box instead of 2) I turned it upside down and projected a nice image on my ceiling. I was surprised it worked so well. Now im going to pick up some black spray paint to paint the inside of my box with and make a new box with no light to escape. if i get all this done i should have a pretty good picture. So anyways thanks all of you who contributed to this board and inspired me to make this, it was well worth it.

-- ZombieRes (zombieres@yahoo.com), March 13, 2002.

h ttp://www.originalplots.com/images/bryans_100inchTVguide.pdf

Free TV Plans. PDF Format, about 475KB Enjoy!

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@originalplots.com), March 14, 2002.

Oops, did I forget to close that bold tag. Sorry. Oh yes, The information on my guide is not complete, nor is it all mine. All the information is compiled from many sources. The guide itself is mine, and I've tried to make things a little clearer, and yes, it's still all free. A new version will be up soon. I'll be sure and include a bilbiography...Most of the pictures came from online tutorials for school children! haha. "Fun with lenses" and so forth. Great stuff, but all free to the public.

Thanks for the praise tho. If any of you have additions or information to include let me know what and I'll include it in future updates! Thanks

http://www.originalpl ots.com/100inch.html

-- Bryan O'Neill (bry-@usa.net), March 21, 2002.

Nice work Bryan, very profesionally done...a cool website.. really impressed

keep up the good work..

-- Ravin (ravide@2die4.com), March 22, 2002.

UK LENSE - sourced

order online £8.95 www.magnifyingglasses.co.uk

-- kwong (qt2469@yahoo.com), March 23, 2002.

I took 100" TV instructions from original plots...

Can I take the lens from Overhead Projector?? Will it work??

-- Sid (skorhonen@hotmail.com), March 25, 2002.

Hey all, Just dropped buy to thank you guys again. I suggested a few weeks ago that some of you building this project around LCD monitors, should try replacing your backlights with more powerful ones. Well my LCD project came out very well but was only 72" image, I am very, very happy with quality, but my big old screen was lonely to be filled up. So I combined the fresnal box from my very first 100" TV, with the LCD project and vua-la. I can now easily choose between 115" inch image (slightly dimmer than my 72") and 72" image. 115" is great for sports and watchin in the dark, 72" is fine to watch with 2 60 watt bulbs on in the middle of the room, and great for movies. When watching either in total darkness, the screen actually illuminates the room, like at the movies, its not dark and dismal.

Thanks again, Mike

-- Mike Langway (m_langway@bigfoot.com), March 25, 2002.

I have read the majority of this post and by Mike's last response it sounds like he's got a pretty decent system worked out with the LCD projector. I have built the 100 inch TV with the fresnel lens with decent results and was thinking about trying to build a LCD projector. I have an idea of how it works but I was wondering if Mike might be able to elaborate on how you built your LCD projector and what parts you used.

Thanks, Trent.

-- Trent Fettig (teefer22@hotmail.com), March 26, 2002.

Nice work. Iam also intrested building my own projector. I found one site from somewhere, you all might like to see. Someone is manufacturing this projector system. Too bad its some foregin language for me http://www.homecinema21.com/product01-3.html

-- Markus Vertanen (from Finland) (markus.vertanen@quicknet.inet.fi), March 27, 2002.

Hi .... i live in australia and want to build one the only prblem is i dont know where to buy a page magnifier (fresnel) in australia ....does anyone know where i can buy one from australia ... will be greatly Appreciated thanks Aaron

-- Aaron C (audiosoup@hotmail.com), March 30, 2002.

HI-would like to thank kwong for link to magnifying glasses.co.uk. I now have the 5" lense for my project. Having now taken the trouble to read all comments one rainy day it appears most of you are doing the same as me with regard the projection tv. I've tried using page magnifier and ohp lense which produces a full focused image but is washed out with halo effects. By using a convex lense from from cheap hand magnifier, initially 4" dia 2x and now 5"dia 1.5x I get a very bright crisp image that is out of focus around edge.I'm using a Sony flat screen tv 14", rewired scan coil to invert image, black painted poster board from Staples to form pyramid light box base dimension size of tv screen, 15" tall, 6" square hole at smaller end. This is then blanked off by another piece of board with a 5" dia hole cut in. Now sandwich lense between two lengths of 5"dia cardboard tube, one piece 2" long the other 6" long. Insert the shorter end first into 5"dia hole at end of pyramid. The tube can now slide in and out to act as a focus mechanism. The 6" length of tube acts as a light guide now helping to prevent the blurring of image around edges, although still not 100%. The tv was then mounted on wall stand 5 feet above ground so that you can sit underneath. Next problem a cheap screen. Using white screen, paper, cloth, was dissapointing. I've tried sample screen materials from one of the biggest theatre/Imax screen suppliers with poor results. I now use 4'x 8' screen made of mdf or hardboard, comes white coated, but spray over using a product called Simoniz Chrome Paint spray, from an autofactors. The finish looks like molten solder and you can just see your reflection. Mount two T shaped legs of wood 3' base x 3' high. Mount screen 18" up the legs. Screen is free standing so that it can be slight set concave and also tilted toward viewer. The screen is set 9' from viewer. The image can be seen in a darkened room with two 40w wall lights on, but in total darkness you get the full cinema experience. The colours are vivid, sharp and at times almost appear 3D, primary colours appear with a neon effect. Be selective of what you watch, normal tv production is crap. But watch those Hollywood blockbusters and be blown away by the experience. Its well worth the £40($60) i've spent!

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), March 31, 2002.

i'm from australia too (adelaide) i bought mine after 500000 phonecalls from a local newsagency for $6.60 - just ring around and ask for a full page magnifier and explain what it is...my unit is pretty cool but i'm going to have to try the lcd projector now (i'm hooked!)

-- gavin messenger (gavmess@dingoblue.net.au), March 31, 2002.

for the guy in Adelaide. You can get page magnifiers from Big W in the book dept. for $2.95

-- theprof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), April 01, 2002.

I've read a good number of postings about this 100" tv and was wondering if anyone has tried using lenses out of an old opque projector? The reason I'm asking is of course because it is I have one It is about 10 inches long, 6" diam. and contains three lenses ( )( ), it is marked Charles Beseler Company, East Orange N.J. USA 18" E.F. Series III. Would this correct inversion, Could it be mounted in the throat of the box and slid back and forth for focus instead of the second box or should I break down this lense and use a single lense?

If I use the page magnifier and am building a small unit (for 13"tv ) can I cut this lense to fit the projector box?

Thanks for all the great info and any help you can give me!

Peace, S

-- S. (legaucy@hotmail.com), April 01, 2002.

YYEESS! use opaque lens.dont break it. use it as it is. it is color corrected and it would give you much better result than fresnel.

for others:try to put one fresnel at the screen, so that middle of fresnel touches middle of the screen.it should pick up all the light rays coming parallely to fresnel and concetrate it. then put other fresnel or OHP lens in front of it and focus picture. this would solve the problem with rounded edges of tv screen and give much more light (some guy suggested glass long time ago, but this would be much better). try this with 14/15 inch computer monitor, because fresnel is aprox. that big (it has to cover all the screen) somebody, please try it and post result (i cant do it becose i dont have fresnel)

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), April 02, 2002.

I read somewhere that the projected image on the wall will NOT be inverted if using a television with a screen larger than 19", which means the TV does not have to sit upside down during us with a regular fresnel lense and no overhead projector arms/45degree angles. IS THIS TRUE??!! I have a 27" Magnavox only a few years old I would like to use for the 100" project if it doesn't need to sit upside down. Otherwise I'd rather purchase a cheapo 13" TV to use for the project and have that one sit upside down. Thanks! I'm excited to do this!

-- Heebz (heebz@hotmail.com), April 02, 2002.

Also, roughly how much does it cost to get your television Scan Coil inverted by the local TV fix-it guy?? Is this a reversible process too?

-- Heebz (heebz@hotmail.com), April 02, 2002.

My simple advice. If the TV is over 13" - DO NOT TURN IT UPSIDE DOWN or you risk damage to the TV. If it is under 13" - Go for it.

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@originalplots.com), April 02, 2002.

Has anyone used a 6x fresnel lens? Does a 6x work better than a 3x lens? I am currently working on this, but don't own the 6x. I will post pics and info when I get things exactly right. BTW, thanks to all for the info!!!

-- Harry (forwhatitsworth@wldrothzzz.com), April 02, 2002.

I have not yet built one, but I ordered a 3x lens on ebay. The guy I got it from said that there is no such thing as a 5x or 6x lens, people just say the lens they are selling is 5x or 6x so people will pay more. I don't know if that is true, does anyone know?

-- Adam (adamjs77@yahoo.com), April 03, 2002.

Also if I use a 27" tv would the whole image be projected or would the edges get cut off or blurry? Because most 27" have higher resolutions than 13" or 19" so the picture quality on the wall would be better.

-- Adam (adamjs77@yahoo.com), April 03, 2002.

Hi guys, I think that many of you have put in alot of effort to get this thing right. What i suggest is to get those who have tried it and works great to post some pics so that others can see and compare...if its not too much to ask. Thanks

-- Ravin (ravide@2die4.com), April 04, 2002.

If your looking for a good cheap material to make the projector boxes,try "COREFLUTE". This is similar to cardboard carton only its placticised,more stable,can be cut with a knife and is available in black. Also,has anyone tried using one of these TV magnifying screens as the lens. I think there slightly curved (may solve the problem of blurred edges) and cover the whole screen on a 13" tv

-- theprof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), April 04, 2002.

Hey Whinner, I'm the guy that suggested using glass on the tv screen. I'd use your idea with the overhead lenses, but I don't have any. I'm trying to get an overhead projector arm from Mike with the lens thing on the arm. Anyway, good idea though, I'll try it as soon as I get the overhead arm. This is to Adam, DON'T FLIP YOUR 27 INCH TV! BAD IDEA. Use a little tv that is around 13 inches, that's what size I use, and its fine. And, flipping your 27" tv is just gonna be a pain in the arse. And to the other dude that was asking if you can cut your lens, that's a no. Don't cut the lens, just cut the hole in your slider smaller.

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), April 04, 2002.

Oh, before I go. I wouldn't use a 6x lens. I don't know if picture quality is better, but if the 6x lens is really 6x, then the tv is going to be very close to the wall. The lens is going to make a HUGE picture and the tv may get in your way. Say if I have a 3x lens. The tv is 8 feet from the wall making a 100 inch picture. Now, with a 6x lens, at 8 feet the picture on your wall or whatever you use is going to be like 200 inches. I know you guys want big screens, but 200 inches is a bit overkill to me. Just a suggestion.

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), April 04, 2002.

HEy ...im biuldin one of these 100 inch tvs tomoro ...and i have gone through this whole site looking at all the plans ...i have just one question ...in all of the plans the place where the lens goes in round ...my lens is rectangle, do i cut it into a circle ...if not do i stick it dirrectly in the middle?? please reply if you can!

Thanks Aaron

-- Aaron C (audiosoup@hotmail.com), April 05, 2002.

But if I used a 27" TV without fliping it, by using mirrors, then would the lens pick up the whole image or would it not see the edges?

-- Adam (adamjs77@yahoo.com), April 05, 2002.

Ok, if you use mirrors with your 27 inch tv to flip the picture back to normal, that should be fine. I think the edges won't be cut off because of the tv's size. And, Aaron, if you mean cut your lens into a circle, don't do that. You tape or glue your lens to a cardboard slider (or wood, whatever material you are using) that has a circular hole cut in it. The cardboard around the circle will block the light from going through the egdes of the lens.

-- Richard (ruthfmly@yahoo.com), April 05, 2002.

Ive been making my projector for a while, trying different things to werk out the kinks, i recently hit a break through with my burred edges, it seemed not matter how small or large i made the actual lens opening it still seemed quite blurred at the edges, but by adding a 3rd boX!!! :) which doesnt need to be enclosed , on the front of the inner box. the front of the 3rd box has a circle cut out slightly smaller then the 2nd box , and it its the right distance (4 inches for me) from the inner box it will dim the picture slightly but the sharpness makes up for it. And YES there is a black circle sitting on the frensa lens as well, it helped but not as much as adding the 3rd box as well, hopefully if i put some foil in or white paper it will create some ambient light and lighten the picture without adding blurriness. Anyway, even if it doesnt im EXTREMELY pleased and satisfied with my results. and intend on using it alot to watch my DVD's.

-- Trent Naylor (nrk3y@optushome.com.au), April 05, 2002.

hey guys just a suggestion to anyone who doesnt want to flip their TV screens over...dont use mirrors..otherwise you could lose up to 10% of the light for one mirror(learned this in physics today)...instead try a prism.....i havent actually built one of this..but im gonna try sometime Dan

-- dan (dandeboer_123@hotmail.com), April 05, 2002.

Hey All.....i finally came round to buildin one of these 110inch tv things ....it came out pretty good for the 8 bucks that i spent ...i just have question ... i cant afford a proper screen and the picture on my wall isnt that good ...what can i use as a screen ...?? and is there a certain colour which is good for a screen?? thanks again .

-- Bradley (audiosoup@hotmail.com), April 06, 2002.

Last post:

What color did you use inside the box? Was it white or black? Just wondering if anyone has tried both to see if white will improve the brightness of the picture.

Also, I am interested about what material I should make my screen out of. Someone posted that they used a white shower curtain.

Does anyone have instructions to build the projection system by building a Box-Inside-of-a-Box??? Thanks to any reply.

-- Doug (dnew12@yahoo.com), April 06, 2002.

to the whiner.......

In response to tour January 16 post....... I have a pc program that converts the screen image upsidedown and backwords. I use a 15 inch monitor without having to turn it upsidedown and I dont have to use mirrors. I saved alot of "tweaking" time with this program. Email me and I will send it to you.

-- MrMaster (gktwil@yahoo.com), April 07, 2002.

I have had a opaque projector lense sitting around the house for a couple of years and have trying to find a way of using it for something other than frying ants and this is it.

Whinner is right, the opaque lense is crystal clear and no distortion or blurry edges. I tested the lense by simply holding it in front of the tv about 15" from the screen and, vola, the image was on the wall across the room. I built a box out of black foam core, 4.99(US)per sheet @ Office Max, and even bought as page magnifyer to compare setups, The problem I see with useing the page magnifyer is fuzzy edges, and that the 8.5 X 11 sheet doesn't fit in the box, are the frescals smaller or should I cut it, I would perfer finding a smaller lens, preferably around town, just to fool around with. It works great and if you have small children they are so impressed a 13" tv 5 feet tall!! Please pass the Jiffy Pop.

-- s. (legaucy@hotmail.com), April 07, 2002.

Would it be possible for someone to send me some pictures of projects they have done? I'm having trouble getting started and would like to get some pointers. thanks

-- brian (bconpc@netscape.net), April 07, 2002.

Im thinking of getting a good lens and have read all your qualms and luckys but is there such thing as a 6x lens....http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1343480397&r=0&t=0&showTutorial=0&ed=1018559228&indexURL=0&rd=1 theres a guy on ebay selling them than theres this other guy http://www.b-adeals.com/ProductAuctionPlansInfo.htm says you dont have to flip your tv cuase of the pvc one hes using... which one is good has anyone bought from either or have the similar stuff... thanks... I did as a beginer bought the one from office max for $8... $3 more than on at staples when there the same anyways... i got the idea and want something much more crisper... obviosily cause that picture was blurred ... I built a temp box in less than an hour with all you guys tactics but i know the lens isnt the best so i know i should get some better...lol... i can return the one to office max tommorow .. thanks guys...

-- LB (illalb@yahoo.com), April 08, 2002.

Well the tv just bit the big one.. it was a 13" sharp and now that it has been upside down the thing just clicks, won't turn on for more than a second.

I read somewhere that there are wires that you can reverse in order to flip the text around in a tv, could some one refresh my memory?

also when I opened up the sharp to look around I noticed a black burned spot in the main board, It appears that the heat from the picture tube had been rising and heating up the board when turned upside down, it it possible to buy a new 13" and turn the picture tube upside independent of the cabinet? What tv's or monitors, size make/ model are y'all using?

Peace,

,

-- S (legaucy@hotmail.com), April 09, 2002.

Hello guys

If anyone of you are using PC monitor with your "projector" and don't like the idea of turning it upside down try this: http://www.system7.org/Archive/Windows/fungames/

there's a small utility Screen Flip (1,7kb) that turns screen upside down :)) There is one problem, it stops after a mouse click - but look - you can watch DVD, DivX movies that way.

Hope this helps

Michal

-- Michal Feherpataky (michal@feherpataky.com), April 09, 2002.

Can anyone recommend a suitable material to use as a rear projection screen,thats easily obtained and not too expensive? Im using a 27" t.v. and my projected image is 84"x64".

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), April 09, 2002.

I turned the tv back over(right side up) and it started working(took several hours), Then I tried to just turn the picture tube over in the cabinet, refused to work, now I have righted the tube and am looking for info on possibly changing the yoke and rewiring the picture tube to invert and reverse the picture. Does anyone know what would be involved in such a project?

-- S (legaucy@hotmail.com), April 09, 2002.

somewhere in the depths of this thread there is a url on how to do swap what wires..i did it to mine and it works fine :) wait until the whole page loads, and then go to "edit" then "find on this page" and type in "http" then go through every post with a url until u find it....you also might answer a few of your other questions on the way :)

-- gavin messenger (gavmess@ihug.com.au), April 10, 2002.

I found the website gavin was talking about. Here it is:

http://geocities.com/easton17066/screeninversion.html

Does anyone know if it matters if you have a circle hole for the lens or a rectangle? People say circle is good but will somebody please explain why. Thanks.

-- Adam (adamjs77@yahoo.com), April 11, 2002.

THIS SITE IS SHIT I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU ALL FALL FOR THE LOAD OF BOLLOCKS THIS GUY IS PRESENTING AS FACTS, YOU LAMERS. WHO WANTS A 100" tv ANYWAY????!!!!!! MY 1" tv IS GOOD ENOUGH FOR MY WHOLE TOWN!!!

-- my arse (dfsghsh@wdyg.com), April 12, 2002.

FOR THOSE WONDERING HOW TO INVERT YOUR SCREEN.

Ill try and explain how to invert the tv via 2 wires inside of it. Now for starters i must STRESS that you should turn your tv off and let it sit unpowered for at least 24 hours. WHY? Tvs and mointers even after they are turned up can hold upwards of 10,000 volts of electricity. But if you willing to take the risk, i aint resposible.

when you open up the tv will see the picture tube then at the back of the picture tube some stuff and a circuit board. What you are looking for is the gold wire wrapped around the picture tube, 2 of the gold wires are connected to another two wires(on my tv there green and yellow) they could be any colour. There will be 4 wires connected behind the gold wire, but u only want the 2 which are connected to the 2 gold wires!. these wires control the horizontal.

Step2. Now we have the wires we can choose 2 ways to invert our picture. The Basic Way : cut the wires and cross them. e.g a-a b-b is now a-b b-a, then tape em up and you should have a inverted picture.

The not as basic way. Find yourself a 6 pin switch(it has support high voltage im told, so the electricity doesnt jump)(and some extra wire) i used a switch of an old AMP, cut the wires then connect the 2 ends not connected to the picture tube to the middle pins, hmm think a picture will make this easier

a b <- top pins the top pin wires and the bottom pin a b <-- middle pins wires both connect to the two b a <-- bottom pins wires connected to the picture tube but as u see in the dia gram one is swapped over. Now if you did it correctly when u flick the switch the picture will invert when ever u want.

-- Trent Naylor (nrk3y@optushome.com.au), April 12, 2002.

oops seems my little text diagram didnt werk heres another


-- Trent Naylor (nrk3y@optushome.com.au), April 12, 2002.

lets try again

-- Trent (nrkey@optushome.com.au), April 12, 2002.

If anyones interested i'm using Sony Trinitron flat screen tv model no KV-14LM1U. If you swap over the yellow and brown wires that go to the small circuit board mounted on top of tube just behind the scan coil (the large copper coil around neck of tube) this will invert image. The beauty of this tv is that you can set it to widescreen mode and eliminate any out of focus at top/bottom of image. Move screen back and throw away part of image out of focus. Although for max enjoyment use with DVD or digital decoder. I've modified my design. Lense is now mounted at one end of 5" dia tube, 6" long, the other end has a piece of card with 4.75" dia hole to help focus image. Inside of box is lined with an old black cotton T shirt to produce a matt non reflective surface.

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), April 13, 2002.

Why hell i got this thing so I could beat off to my pornos and shit now the pussys are about 3 feet tall every bodys dick on there makes mine look small now. What a Rip!

the gibster

-- Christopher Stuart Gibson (csnow82@aol.com), April 14, 2002.

went to an auction 2day and picked up a 6 month old 85 inch roll-up projector screen with tripod for $100 aust! (about 40ish US) i got it for the up and coming lcd projector, but thought i'd try it on the 100inch tv first - it almost doubles the brightness and sharpness!! i know it's been said before, but it's just another example that you MUST have a decent projector surface to start with otherwise you will get no-where...

-- gavin (gavmess@ihug.com.au), April 16, 2002.

To MrMaster (gktwil@yahoo.com)! i have send you email, but you didnt send me the program. is that program "screenflip" michael was writing about? "screenflip" is reversing only frame that is at the screen at that moment, and cant reverse animations. please send me your program on my mail below. thanks

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), April 16, 2002.

I made the projector and I got the picture pretty good but it is blurry around the edges. How can I make the whole picture clear? Also what is a good surface to project on? I got the metallic silver spray paint but I don't know what to spray it on. Is there some kind of fabric that might work?

-- Adam (adamjs77@yahoo.com), April 16, 2002.

DANGER< DANGER< DANGER Will Robinson.

YOUR TV SET IS CAPABLE OF SHOCKING THE HELL OUT OF YOU EVEN WHEN UNPLUGGED. THERE IS POTENTIALLY LETHAL VOLTAGE IN THERE EVEN AFTER UNPLUGGING. DO NOT OPEN YOUR TV SET UNLESS YOU ARE A QUALIFIED TECHNITION. I'd hate to see this board producing tragic results.

Mike

-- Mike Langway (M_langway@bigfoot.com), April 17, 2002.

http://www.sasami2k.com/ is a great Windows Media player replacement that will allow you to flip you media files up-side down. No need to flip you monitor, for those using one.

Hope it helps!

-- Ken (ken@helpdesk.com), April 21, 2002.

Im still working on test projectors, i just got a new 13' tv to work with(makes a total of 3 tvs)anyways i was noticing on my sheet magnifyers that if you hold the sheet up close to the tv the image stays the same but if you move it back a couple of inches it inverts, so if i put two sheet magnifiers equal distances so that both images flip wouldn't that flip the image back the normal position without having to turn your tv outside?

-- ZombieRes (zombieres@yahoo.com), April 21, 2002.

Pals, I read lots of messages on this board and can tell that most of the discussion is around the subject which is really not that difficult. You could save yourselves lots of time by just recalling your school science classes about "how the lens works".

I decided to end this, so that we can exchange some truly useful info like which lenses are better, which coatings absorb or reflect the light and which screen to use.

For those who suffer from American education is the rest of this message 1) Fresnel lens works just like any other lens, the only difference being lower price, hence worse quality, and better size/money ratio 2) Main parameter of any lens is its focus distance. Can be derived from power of the lens. For 2x lens (which most of the sheet magnifiers are) the focus is 25cm (naturally the lens power quoted by the retailer is an approximation). 3) The lens magnifies the object in your case it’s the telly if it’s located within 2 to 1 focus distances from the lens (in your case 25- 50) the close it is to focus distance the higher the magnification. 2 focus distances from the lens will result into the image of the same size. Beyond, 2 focal distances you get an image smaller then the object. If the object is closer then 1 focal distance you get a virtual image (you don´t want that). See below for additional reading and java tutorials. 4) it do get the reversed image, even if you flip over the telly you want be able to read the text. to get avoid this you need to use two lenses. Since your lenses are not huge (lets assume they are smaller then your tv) your first one should reduce the image or keep it the same size (theoretically it should also improve the focus). So, position it >= 2 times focal distance from the tv. With a sheet of paper and a bit of brains you can find where the first projected image ends up (hint: somewhere between 1 and 2 focal distances on the opposite side of the lens). You get a reversed and reduced in size image. This is your new object now, which you will now magnify and reverse with your second lens, and project on the wall. Your second lens needs to be positioned within 1-2 focal distances from the FIRST PROJECTED IMAGE (yes, the one you found with sheet of paper and bit of brains, and the one you called "new object"). I repeat (since you didn´t study very well, you probably don´t get it first time), not from TV, not from the first lens, but from the image. Naturally, after this exercise you will end up with a rather large cabinet (theoretically, for two 2x lenses and 21inch telly for 2m image 3m away from your second lens you will need 1.6m long construction (so your tv will end up around 4.5 m from the wall) (same thing with 14inch telly will result in 1.4m cabinet). The good bit is, you won´t kill yourself by trying to reverse the picture of your TV with a screw driver. 5) theoretically, you should loose quality with every lens since fresnel lens is really pants, but it´s worth trying, try flipping them over, they change their focusing characteristics depending on which side is facing the object. 6) If you are lucky enough to get 7"+ size optical quality lenses (try stealing one of those NASA telescopes) 2.5x or better magnification do try to do this with them they are better quality, will require shorter cabinet and your girlfriend won´t kick you out 7) Do paint your cabinet black on the inside. Those people who say put the foil or paint it silver are wrong (at least because or professional optics is black inside) because non-black surfaces reflect light and that light interferes with the light that goes into your lens. 8) Do make an effort with the screen it will improve the experience.

Additional reading: http://www.opticalres.com/kidoptx.html#MainPoints http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/lightandcolor/lenses.html http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/geoopt/lenscon.html this is for those who can´t read - interactive tutirials: http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/lightandcolor/javalens.html

-- Dima (bill.gates@microsoft.com), April 25, 2002.

http://www.originalplots.com/100inch.html just get it free.......

-- darkangel (solodarkangel@canada.com), April 28, 2002.

Hey, is there any possible way to get the picture brighter and clearer? I built a tightly sealed box where no light comes out but my picture isn't as clear as some other's that I have seen. What else could I possibly do get it look better?

-- Joseph Marquez (josephDM@cox.net), April 28, 2002.

joseph, you have to use a good screen and a high quality fresnal lens (glass one from a ohp)

-- gavin messenger (gavmess@ihug.com.au), April 29, 2002.

IMAGE QUALITY DEPENDS ON A NUMBER OF FACTORS

THE SIZE OF THE TV THE AGE OF THE TV. If your not using a late model (preferably flat screen) tv., that has a VERY clear, bright, sharp picture, you will NOT get a clear, bright projected image, regardless of what lens or screen your using.

THE TYPE OF LENS. THE MAGNIFICATION OF THE LENS.

If your using a small screen tv.(12"-19")you need to use a 3X lens. If the tv is 20"-27" then a 2X lens is needed. The further the tv is away from the screen, the less the light output (obviously) and you start to lose definition and brightness. The quality of the lens will have some effect on the projected image, and the main criteria here is to use the THINNEST, CLEAREST, lens you can find. You can use one of these el cheapo PVC lens from Kmart, providing it looks very clear; some lenses have a "milkish" look about them.

THE SHAPE OF THE PROJECTOR BOX.

Unless you using a lens the same size as the tv. the box should be TAPERED,with the opening slightly larger than the size of the lens. The reason for this was brought to light by an earlier writer. The light in the box from the tv sprays out like a garden hose,going in all directions. Tapering the box helps to concentrate the light toward the lens. The other thing with the box is DON'T PAINT IT BLACK INSIDE. Even though this has been recommended by many people and sellers of the product,it will reduce light output of the projected image. Black absorbs light, and you don't want to lose any light energy in the box.

And finally, a 100inch image is not going to give you a clear,bright, picture. Use an image no bigger than 85", and it will be very watchable. I hope these things will help.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 01, 2002.

Making the box pyramid shaped doesn't helpe too much. I have tried both a box and pyramid shape and there isn't much of a difference. At least that's what my results were.

-- Joseph Marquez (josephDM@cox.net), May 04, 2002.

It depends on the size of the tv. If your using a small tv,the shape of the box isn't going to make much difference,but if your using a larger set(I'm using a 27"tv in a rear projection setup)it does help to enhance the light output. One other thing that I have found that dramatically improved the clarity of the image,is to make the focussing box no longer than 7". The lens is "masked down" about an 1" allround and fitted to the tv end.The other end has another mask that is 11/2" smaller allround than the size of the lens,oh, and you can paint the inside of this box FLAT BLACK,but not the projector box. This setup tends to improve contrast and clarity,and also clears up blurry edges. I get an 75" image on my rear projection system,that is bright and sharp,with no edge blurring,using this setup. Give it a try.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 04, 2002.

Whoever is looking for a projection screen, I have a tripod stand, 48x48 inch screen that I bought and realized it's too small. It's silver and it's only got about a one inch rip towards top-right corner, and little wrinkles that you don't see when your projecting something onto it. I'm willing to sell it for $30-$40 bucks. Just e- mail me and we'll work it out.

-- Joseph Marquez (josephDM@cox.net), May 05, 2002.

hey Prof... I'm not sure if I'm understanding you correctly.. you say you have a good picture at 75" in a rear projection setup..?? what are you talking about?? how did you create this "REAR" projection setup anyway?? I thought this 100" tv was a front projection project?? I'm not trying to sound patronizing or obtuse.. I am sincerely interested in how you created your system.. sounds like you know what you are talking about.. if only you could be more specific about how you are achieving your results.. please post a reply.. thanks.. M&M..:)

-- M&M (M&M@aol.com), May 07, 2002.

M&M... The reason why I'm using a "rear projection" set up is that with the 27" tv, and the fresnel lens I'm using, the projected image filled the width of my room (13') from only about 6' away from the wall. This was totally impracticle for viewing, with the big set so close to the screen. I then found that I could get a 75" image that was brighter and clearer from just 2.5' away, ( which is about the minimum focussing distance for the lens ) so I turned the tv. around, facing me, and placed a 75" transluscent rear projection screen in front of the tv projector. I don't use any mirrors to fold the image, ( as is the case in rear projection tv's,) because unless you use top quality, front surfaced mirrors ( very expensive ) you will get "ghosting" and loss of light output with any other type of mirror. To invert and reverse the image, I use a Scan Coil inverter switch. The only disadvantage of this system is that you lose about 4' from your room. My Home Theatre room is 26' long, so its a small price to pay for the huge tv image I get. If your interested in making one of these rear projection systems,I can give you further details of construction and materials.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 07, 2002.

Prof: I was wondering where did you get your 75" translucent screen and for how much price it would take to get one. I'm thinking of getting a fresnel lens from edmund optics (11" x 11") at $81.00 which is expensive. Do you know where I could get a same quality lens at a cheaper price.

-- (ramgol@hotmail.com), May 08, 2002.

Prof.. Thank you so much for such a prompt reply:) It sounds like you have accomplished something very interesting and I would like to make the attempt. I am definitely interested in further details of construction and materials..:) Please post any info you may have or send via my e-mail address. I have a few other general questions that perhaps you could elucidate. I think others may be wondering as well. 1. How much brighter is the image with your rear projection setup? Can it be viewed in the daytime? or with lights on in the room? (as we all know from building the front projection unit, if built correctly, is watchable only in the dark with very limited ambient light. 2. How does your 75" system look and compair (image quality not cabinet)LOL.. to rear projection Tvs that are available commercially/retail? 3. Where can one obtain the lens you are discussing? is it a convex or fresnel? 4. Where can one obtain the rear projection screen you are discussing? and 5.Lastely. I'm still confused about using a reflective material inside the projector box to improve projected light?? Many others say it should be black inside to reduce light from bouncing around inside the projector box and washing out the image.. I have yet to experiment with reflective material inside the box... but I'm getting pretty good results with the flat black on the inside... (front projection setup that is...) any thoughts from you or anyone else on the post may get this last matter resolved.. anyone experimented??? thanks.. M&M..:)

-- M&M (MnM9860@hotmail.com), May 08, 2002.

Prof: Would a pyramid shaped box for a 27" be better than a regular box for a 13"? Because I've tried a regular box for the both and the 13" is much better. Thanks

-- Joseph Marquez (josephDM@cox.net), May 08, 2002.

M&M...and fellow experimenters,

Thank you all for your interest in my project. When I first came across this 100 inch tv idea about 3 months ago, I thought it would be a bit of a laugh, but maybe there was something too it. Since then I have been working on it EVERYDAY, trying many variations on the original design. I now have 24 web sites on this project, including sites from Germany, Portugal, England, Austalia, and America. It seems the whole World is working on this projection system !! Anyway, to answer your questions M&M...

1. The rear projection image is no brighter than the front projection image, for the same size image, ( at the moment that is... I havn't finished with it yet ) because the screen is freestanding in front of the tv, so it is affected by ambient light and room lights. My next experiment is to enclose the whole system, from the tv to the screen,in what will look like a huge pyramid shaped box. I think this will enhance image brightness, because ALL of the projected light will go to the screen, just as a commercial rear projection system does. This then should enable me to watch the tv image with some light in the room.

2. Well, as I've explained, its not as bright at the moment, probably a little better than some of the earlier rear projection systems.

3. The lens I'm using is the cheapest one on the market, it cost $3 AUD. It's a 7"x10" pvc fresnel lens ( page magnifier ) and I bought it at Big W. I bought 3 of them and used the best one. Surprisingly there was a difference in quality between all 3, one of them wouldnt even focus properly. This was unexpected for a mass produced optical product, It makes me wonder how accurate some of these more expensive lenses are. On that point, I've looked at the same size lenses costing 6 times the price, and they look identical, a bit of a ripoff.

4. I experimented with many different materials for the screen. Being a "cheapskate" I wasnt going to pay a rediculess price for a professional rear projection screen, and also, they are designed for a much higher light output as from an LCD projector, so I tried several easily obtained materials without much success until I came across one called "MONTAINE". This is a synthetic mix of polyester and nylon, and is a dress material, it only cost $16/m. and is much more effective than cotton based materials, plus it doesnt crease. I then made up a frame 69" x 39" ( 16:9 ratio ) out of 38x19 pine and stretched the material across it and mounted it on legs. Later, I'll make the frame out of aluminium tube.

5. Some people have suggested using alum. alfoil inside the projector box to brighten the image, but in my experience this is not a good idea because even though it may INCREASE light output, it tends to washout the image. Conversely, painting the box black has the opposite effect, it tends to DECREASE light output. The ideal seems to be to leave the box unpainted, the cardboard is matt and neutral in colour....

And Joseph, to answer your question about the shape of the box. When I first made mine, it was the rectangular shape which was a pretty big box for the 27" tv, with the 7"x10" lens at the other end. Now if you use the analogy of the garden hose sprinkler pushed into one end of the box and a 7"x10" cutout out the other end and turn on the hose full blast, water is going to go everywhere and some will hit the end of the box and bounce back, and some will go straight through the opening. Now if you taper the box to the size of the lens opening, ALL the water will go through, NO BOUNCEBACK, and when you apply the principal to the light from your tv, a similar thing occurs, and the greater the difference between the size of the tv image and the lens size, the greater the effect. But hey, if your getting good results with a rectangular tube, then there's no problem.

I hope this has answered everyones questions and that I've explained myself clearly enough. If anyone is having any other problems, I will try to help.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 08, 2002.

...Oh, and the other fellow who is thinking of buying an $81.00 lens!!! This is obviously not a " page magnifier " type fresnel lens. I think it is probably a TV MAGNIFIER lens, that is used by people with impaired vision,and is placed in front of the tv. I havent had any experience with these lenses, so I cant advise you on whether there suitable for this project. If you buy it I would be interested in hearing if works.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 08, 2002.

Guys, the clarity of my projection is so good. What I did differently was add a THIRD BOX!!!! The third box is 7x10 inches (size of lens) and the extends about 5 inches from lens. On the front of the box is a hole that is a bit smaller than the original one on the lens. When I put mine on, the blurry edges were completely gone and the whole screen was GREAT. Also, I used a white 72x72 shower curtain as my screen and for $6 bucks it helped my image.

-- Joseph Marquez (josephDM@cox.net), May 09, 2002.

Im kind of not good at doing things like this... is there anywhere 1 of the projection things alredy done ??? its a 19inch tv... also, will i have to flip it upside down ???

-- NeoSW (neosoldierw@icqmail.com), May 10, 2002.

Having sorted out any focus problems the next to be sorted is brightness of image. I,m using a hardboard screen painted with chrome effect paint. Looking around for something similiar but better i,ve discovered that the reverse i.e. dull side of kitchen aluminium cooking foil produces an image twice as bright as the painted screen. Only problem now is to fix it smoothly to flat surface. Will try this weekend using wall paper paste or similiar, anybody have any solutions?

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), May 10, 2002.

How many of you guys would buy this product right away if the box came with it? I'm thinking of selling the lens myself but also providing the box.

-- Joseph Marquez (josephDM@cox.net), May 10, 2002.

prof. please, send us those 24 web sites on this project (from Germany, Portugal, England, Austalia, America), we might came up with something together! also, please read my post from April 02 about puting two fresnels and try it(since you have 3 of them), i think it might help, but i dont have them

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), May 12, 2002.

Whinner.... I tried your idea of using 2 lenses when you first posted the info, but without much success. I found that if you place the first lens up against the tv screen, the second lens out from it, I couldnt get a clear focus and what did focus was only part of the image. This was probably due to the fact that I'm using a 27" image and as you mentioned, you need the lens to nearly cover the screen. I then tried moving the first lens away from the tv by a few inches and placing the second lens about 10" in front of it, and managed to get a full infocus image. However, the image was bigger than the single lens setup ( which I dont need ) and light output was reduced. I agree, this setup should work well if your using a small screen system, infact the Portugal web site system is designed around the same idea. I will include some of these websites in my next post.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 13, 2002.

HOW DO I GET THE PICTURE NOT TO BE UPSIDE DOWN AND BACKWARS

-- noAH (NILLARD5181@AOL.COM), May 14, 2002.

Oh my god, i wish some people would read at least the beginning of this board. Anyway, to reverse the picture without opening up your tv would be to tilt your tv straight up and put a mirror angled towards your screen at a 45 degree angle. Just turning your tv upside down leaves you with a backwards picture. If you don't want to turn your tv upside down or upwards, read the board and there's a message saying how to change the wires around inside the tv. This is a dangerous method, so be careful, I haven't tried it.

-- Richard (astro007_@excite.com), May 14, 2002.

I flipped the wires on my tv and there wasn't any shocking problem. Also, I had a friend hook up my tv where I can flip from inverted to non-inverted with some special switch. The switch only costs about $4 dollars but you need to know what you're doing to hook it up.

-- Joseph (josephDM@cox.net), May 14, 2002.

Here are some of the websites that I have found helpful in building a projector unit. Some of these sites have been around for a long time, but if anyone is just starting on this project, I would recommend that you have a look at them.

http://www25.brinkster.com/mikeee/mikeserver/tv/index.htm

http://100inchtv.com/index.html

http://www.100inchbigscreen.com/

http://webone.com.au/~caoz/wwwboard/index.html

http://www.stereo3d.com/bbs/messages/3974.html

http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/lightandcolor/javalens.html

http://www.hometheatervillage.com/guides/Screen_Guide-72.pdf

http://bstvcentral.b0x.com/

http://www.books4you.addr.com/TV_Projector_Fresnel_Lens.html

http://www.originalplots.com/100inch.html

http://www.originalplots.com/images/bryans_100inchTVguide.pdf

http://illfuseill.tripod.com/index.html

http://geocities.com/easton17066/screeninversion.html

http://shop3.webmailer.de/cgi-bin/ePages.filereader? 3c6d48fa00900ad4271aac172c250664+DE/catalogs/417426

http://barrioperu.terra.com.pe/lumendoza/manualA1.htm

http://www.herma.com.au/

http://www.b-adeals.com/Category100.HTM

http://www.audiovisualizers.com/madlab/lcd_proj.htm

http://www.100inch.orcon.net.nz/

http://www.tv-2-100inch.co.uk/

http://build100inchtv.netfirms.com/

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 14, 2002.

I'd still like to add that my plans are free, and have lots of information unlike some on that list above. I'm currently trying to create one with an LCD screen. Should be interesting. I'll update the plans when I have more. In the meantime. Here was a good idea from one of the links above.

-- Bryan O'Neill (bry-@usa.net), May 15, 2002.

Last weekend used pva glue to stick kitchen foil to my hardboard screen.Result image was two to three times brighter than chrome paint.Could view image in daylight room with curtains closed. The image was also brighter towards the edge of the screen. The downside was the foil wrinkled. Next tried sheet aluminium. This was even brighter if a bit too 'metallic' image. But very difficult to get curve just right to focus light back to viewer. Now searching for sticky backed foil. Had thought of using metallized mylar. Prof. has provided some interesting internet links, would be nice to see some genuine screen shots from fresnel lens projects, get the projector in the shot!

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), May 15, 2002.

bob... If you have a look at this website http://www.stanleyssignsupply.com/plotter.htm I think you might find what your looking for to metallize your screen. Scroll through the whole page, and if this product is suitable, just go to a major Sign Co. in the U.K. They will either sell you the film or tell you where you can get it.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 15, 2002.

By the way..... If anybody wants to make an inexpensive, high gain, white screen, you can use High Density Polystyrene foam sheets ( available from Ceiling contractors ) backed with hardboard or MDF. This material has a pearlescent appearance, and gives an image quality similar to a Da-lite glass beaded screen.

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 15, 2002.

Well, I am going to try this project this summer with a 15" computer monitor. I am kinda excited, yet leary at the same time due to all the posts (I have read everyone of them) on this website. The problem is that no one has TRULY posted anything worthwhile besides http://barrioperu.terra.com.pe/lumendoza/manualA1.htm and http://www.originalplots.com/images/bryans_100inchTVguide.pdf

SO... I am going to post my project at my website (professionally designed by me I might add), and we'll see how things go. I feel confident that I have a hand over most people due to the fact that I am a Computer Engineering student and I had to take 4 advanced engineering physics classes (one specifically on optics).

However, that could be just me and my red hair blowing hot air... I have yet to do it, but I will post later on this month (or the beginning of June) with HIGH QUALITY digital pictures. What really gets my goat is that NO ONE HAS POSTED PICS OF WHAT THE ACTUAL QUALITY OF THE SCREEN LOOKS LIKE!!!! I have seen lots of pics of the boxes, so lets see if a young comp.E student can get it right!

I will give you guys the link as soon as I have something to post!

Respectfully, JoeBro Theta Chi ~ Epsilon Kappa

-- JoeBro (joeatuofi@hotmail.com), May 16, 2002.

For those experimenting with front projection..How about using 4'x8' foam core insulation that has a metalic foil coating on both sides.. One side has printing on it, but the other should be free of print on most brands and might be useful as a screen... It can be found in most building centers like "Home Depot" and the like, (in the insulation section).. You have to be careful with it.. it's sensitive to damage, and you have to find one without dents,creases or wrinkles, I think I might give it a try.. So far I've tried 1. foam core poster board, works real good but too expensive and too small, I can only get it 2 1/2'x 3' for US$9.00. 2. painted finished plywood.(flat white = mediocre-really too dim, but no hotspots.. gloss white = hotspot glare on screen made it hard to watch..brighter but still too dim.)3.silver spray paint on the foam core poster board...not much difference imho. maybe a tad brighter. Has anyone tried chrome paint?? or textured paint, like sand finish to break up the projected light and reduce hotspot glare? how about that reflective paint used in road signs?? Hey prof...and everyone posting, thanks for all your input..your posts have kept me busy as I'm sure everyone involved in this project. I tried the foil inside the projector box..it did brighten up the image but I also lost alot of detail and contrast in the projected image..maybe due to light scattering.. I just taped the foil as best I could to the inside of my projector box, I couldn't really get it flat. it was kind of wrinkled. does this matter?? how about cutting mirrors to fit the inside of the box?? And speaking of mirrors, is anyone using a mirror to right the projected image??... If so Where are you placing your mirror.. before or after your lens?? ie:(inside or outside your projector box?) and does anyone think this makes a difference?.. please post... M&M..:)

-- M&M (MnM9860@hotmail.com), May 16, 2002.

Are there any TELEVISION TECHNICIANS out there, that can tell us if we can increase BRIGHTNESS over the normal controls, without blowing the set up, and how to do this? WE NEED HELP!!!

-- Prof. (nurhadi@bigpond.com), May 16, 2002.

I have a couple questions, 1. i was wondering what works the best for a screen, i was thinking of getting one of those pull down blinds that are completely white. 2. how do you get rid of the blurieness around the screen. Otherwise i am pretty impressed at what you can do for 30.00 when making this projector. I am also wondering what people have done to make it look good, i am think of getting 3mm plywood or 3mm oak veeneer plywood and making it look nicer, i was wondering what people have done to make it better.

-- Meth (meth@somewhere.com), May 16, 2002.

I'm not sure if someone brought this up already, but I have a fairly large dry-erase board here so I tried using it as a screen. The results were fairly positive..... the glossy white surface of the board helped brighten the image quite a bit. The focus improved as well, but it is still sort of blurry. I'm using a 13" tv with a dvd player connected through standard RCA video. Like a lot of you, I'm using the $7 Office Depot plastic fresnel, so that has something to do with the blurriness. While I understand that a 13" image projected to over 40" (diag.) will result in blurriness, does anyone have any pointers as to making it sharper? Better screen material ideas? Better yet, those people who said they added a second lens or multiple boxes to get a super clear image..... could you possibly put up a picture of your results?

-- Paul (sunstedt@worldnet.att.net), May 18, 2002.

Hi.

New here, but I have been reading this thread, and am now up to date.

Just wanted to tell you all to take a look at this: http://www.ubid.com/actn/opn/getpage.asp?AuctionId=29153894

This is actually what you people are all trying to make, and they are selling it for about $79. I am also trying to make one, but if I don't succeed, I'll get me one of these things.

----------------------- NeoMotion

-- NeoMotion (neomotion@gmx.net), May 20, 2002.

I built one of these things, but the picture was too blurry, so I stuck a deep-fryed hot dog in there along with a spare car tire. Image is wonderful now. Thanks for the tip!

-- Al (goose@hotmail.com), May 20, 2002.

Hi fellow TV With a Box and Duck tape around it guys! .. I've been researching this whole 100" TV deal and have decided to build one. I've ordered a lense off of eBay for 10 bucks and I'm going to try it with a 19" TV. I've read almost all of this discussion group forum and it seems pretty cool to me. Just letting everyone know that I'm joining this discusion group and will be looking forward to talking about it with you. Thanks everyone!

-- Ry4n (ry4n@yahoo.com), May 20, 2002.

about lens:read the mesage that guy with e-mail legaucy@hotmail.com posted on April 07. opaque projector's lens is the best.it is achromat lens, and the bigger it is the better it is

box:pyramid shaped box will not concentrate light. try my idea with two lenses. probably it will be blurry (because fresnel is not color corrected, but it should be brighter.

paint:look inside of photo camera, in chamber where you put film. it is black, isn't it?. if you don't paint it black, refracted light from inside of the box will come out through lens. image will be brighter but more blured.

third box: because the fresnel is not color corrected, edges are messed up. third box only cuts off light rays that are not deflected correctly through lens. that is why the image is sharper, but darker!

IT'S ALL ABOUT LENS!!!!

read this, and you'll get it!!!

http://www.edmundoptics.com/techsupport/DisplayArticle.cfm? articleid=267

Application Primer 3: THAT'S IT

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), May 21, 2002.

Has anyone thought of using one of those reflective emergency blankets for a screen? Or would that shine too much and make glare? For #1.96 a peice at Wal-Mart's sporting goods department, I think it's worth a shot.

-- Ry4n (ry4n@yahoo.com), May 24, 2002.

I've been in touch with a thermal blanket manufacturer, apparently the metallized mylar if it comes folded is full of creases, but can be obtained off a roll. For a screen i've recently tried reflective film both white and silver from a graphics supplier, with poor results. In the past have tried samples from major screen supplier, all unsatisfactory. About the only surface not tried is a beaded screen. I've now settled for my first attempt at a screen, chrome paint on mdf sheet curved to reflect light as in a torex screen. But also important is viewing position. I sit just under the lens of projector so that angle of reflection from screen is small.

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), May 24, 2002.

I wish projection screens weren't so expensive.. Has anyone tryed building an LCD projector? If so, are the results much better than the normal CRT Television projection setups?

-- Ry4n (ry4n@yahoo.com), May 24, 2002.

well ive read this whole post and it seems to me that you all are having the same probs. focus and clarity. now firstly just remember that you have prolly only paid bout $20 for this so dont expect to much. however i have a site you lot may be interested in.

www.bstvcentral.b0x.com they have free plans for 3 different types of projectors and also some good links to building an lcd projector. that is my next project. i also thought for those of you finding that text doesnt focus quite right..try getting a glare reduction screen for a computer monitor and place it over the tv. im sorry guys but this is not something that will replace your smalll telly

-- in4ma (me@home.com), May 26, 2002.

About 25 people have posted the BSTV link so-far in this little message board...

-- Ry4n (ry4n@yahoo.com), May 27, 2002.

to Sebastian John :

read very carefuly my last post, it is all there. try to find the lens from some old opaque projector. bigger the lens, brighter the image. those lenses are build for similar purpose, and i think they are the best for 100inchTV (i mean focal lens, size etc.). i tried the lens from overhead projector, and image was great, only dimm becose lens was too small, and small amount of light came through it. the lens from opaque is basicaly the same, only bigger, and will give you much brighter image.

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), May 29, 2002.

please, search the web for opaque projector with the biggest lens, and than try to contact its manufactorer, to buy the lens as the spare part!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), May 31, 2002.

hey everyone! Wow took me around 4 hours to sort through and visit all of these wonderful projection TV sites! Im looking forward to building one of these as a summer project. I was just wondering if anyone has build this as a permanent replacement for their computer monitor. I would love to watch my movies on the big screen, seeing as I only have a dvd drive. It would also be great to play computer games on the large screen! I use my computer for everything else though, like aim, homework and browsing the internet. Is it wise to use the projection as a permanen monitor? My room isn'y exactly dark in the summer, but it isnt bright. Could I still see the screen properly? This is such an intriguing topic, and Im glad to see the internet being used in the way it was meant to!

-- alex (gubert@loadmail.com), June 02, 2002.

Just attempted a few different builds,one cardboard one wood,the image was blured both times,not very easy to watch,I think im going to go and buy a digital home theatre projector,get a pull dowm screen and watch normal television.If you can watch a blurry movie etc build one otherwise save up and dont be tight asses,always worth a try though. I think i should sell $3 lenses on ebay for $20,then I can afford to buy a farkin cinema.....hmmmm.....

-- p heal (p_healey_@hotmail.com), June 02, 2002.

For everyone planning to build one of these:

This is a wonderful invention, however, do not expect your projector to replace your normal TV. It is way too dim and blurry for that. Atleast, it is for everyone I've heard of that's tried it. Maybe some of you have got it to work perfectly somehow? If you really want to get into it though, look into building an LCD projector, which is what I'm going to start on soon.

By the way, have any of you tryed building an LCD projector? If so, what are the results?

-- Ry4n (ry4n@yahoo.com), June 03, 2002.

I tried building a lcd projector last year, thats what brought me to this and the other site. Consisted of wooden box 6" square by 14" long. Fan on the rear, two 50w mini spot lamps. The other end had sheet of glass, slot in bottom of box for air cooling of lcd then piece of fresnel lense to provide even illumination of lcd (and to prevent the image of bulbs forming on screen)then lcd panel. Focus was done by single simple 4" dia magnifying lense. The temp. achieved at lcd when running was 23 degrees C, so heat wasn't a problem (but noise of fan was!). I bought 5" lcd from Maplin electronics here in UK, which had built in pal decoder which i would drive from vcr. When opened up the screen is driven by two sets of 'ribbon' cable to two edges of screen, tried to extend, this was a nightmare! When installed lasted 5 minutes before it failed due wiring. Had reasonable picture but pixelatted. At this stage gave up getting too expensive a hobby. I still wanted a big screen projector though and remember tinkering with tv's back in the 1970's when at school. For me the tv is giving far superior and silent results. I don't think lcd will match tv, i may be wrong? Give it a try. Good luck.

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), June 04, 2002.

I think that too many are wedded to the idea of using the fresnal lense in tv project. In my experience it is very poor optical product only good enough for its intended purpose. I'm using a simple convex lense knowing that i need a good achromatic lense, but where do you get them from. Could use opaque lense but hard to get hold of in UK. Also light output from monitor insufficient to produce good image. Bare in mind monitor is designed to be viewed from two feet away and tv from across a room, i would not like to sit two feet from my tv! This at best is a spare bedroom project for best results sit in total darkness. By the way does anybody know of any health problems from this project. The light from tv use to travel out in about a 170 degree arc, but is now focused on to my silver screen, which then focuses light back to my eyes. After about an hours viewing it would give me a headache. But i think you can get a similiar effect at the cinema.

-- bob (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), June 04, 2002.

This site is so interesting, I feel compelled to compile/put out some more useful information for the internet community. $10 for Ebay scammery is just ridiculous.

A few points here. Professionally, I work with expensive optics (microscopes, cameras, analog and digital projectors, etc) every single day, so I have a good deal of hands on experience with high- end optical equipment. I built my first one of these things a few years ago as a gag, but after my REAL rear projection TV broke, (and they wanted >$600 to fix it), I started messing with the "cheapo" solution more seriously about two months ago. And after actually reading the last 181 pages of this thread/board! There are many good points buried in here, among the noise and junk.

First thing, as was mentioned previously the one-lens projection TV idea has been around for at LEAST 30 years. I remember seeing magazine ads for the "build your own projection TV" in the back of popular mechanics magazine when I was a kid. This thing has been DONE TO DEATH, and TAKEN TO ITS LIMIT decades ago! There is just physically no way that an ordinary television can do what an expensive projection TV can do, no matter what kind of lenses or mirrors or design you use! Despite the EBAY hype, anyone who is expecting that kind of performance WILL be disappointed. Here's why:

An ordinary 13 (say 12) inch TV is designed to make a nice bright viewable image over about a one foot square screen. Try to enlarge that same image to 100 inches (say 96 inches, ie just over eight feet), and you effectively decrease the brightness of the enlarged image, not by eight times, but by SIXTY-FOUR times, since the new image is 64 times as big as the original in area! With an image 1/64th as bright as an ordinary TV image, now you are required to sit in total darkeness squinting with your pupils totally dilated in order to watch the picture! The limiting factor with any projection TV built out of a normal TV tube is always going to be the image brightness, and there's just no way around this.

The "authentic" rear-projection TV uses extra bright projection tubes brigher than the ones used in normal TVs, it uses THREE of them (one for red, blue, and green) to effectively triple the image intensity, and it also uses a special fresnel lens-type screen to redirect all of the image light in parallel outwards. In effect this makes a considerably brighter image, but also explains why with these sorts of TVs you can't see the image well if you are sitting off to the side of the screen. By the way, I've actually tried it with mine, and this kind of screen makes an EXCELLENT screen for the "cheapo" 100 inch TV if you can get your hands on one.

Why a Fresnel lens for the cheapo TV, by the way? Simply because it is cheap, light, and easy to work with. Costs $5, tape it in place, . . .done. A comparable 7 or 8 inch diameter 3x glass lens would be expensive, hard to find and difficult to mount. But by all means, if you have one, use it, it should give you as good a picture.

I've done quite a bit of mucking with the $10 special, and despite all the drawbacks, it certainly *IS* possible to get good results. My current prototype uses a Sharp 13" (normal) color TV, and a $1 (yes you read that right) "page magnifier" fresnel lens bought at a "Everything's $1" store. "Good" results meaning that you can watch a TV program, actually see faded but correct colors, read screen text and close captioning (in normal orientation), and identify actors by face! You aren't going to get the same sharpness as your original TV, but you still can get a decent viewable picture. As has been suggested previously as well, you DO get nicer contrast with a black and white TV, I've tried that too with a $7 yard sale special!. I particularly like this thing for Kung-Fu movies, for that authentic gigantic fuzzy "drive-in" experience! I would imagine that using it for "flight simulator" or driving simulation video games would be awesome, too. CArtoons for kids would be a hoot. I do use my VCR remote to control the channels, but I've found that it IS possible, actually to turn the thing on and off THROUGH the lens with the TV remote control, so I don't have to mess with the setup. I have found that my Black and white TV can be inverted with absolutely no change in picture. I then use one mirror (a special optical one from my defunct projection TV) to correct the image right to left. My particular color TV image messes up near the sides only when inverted. Since its only the sides, I just deal with it, but once I perfect my "box", I'll either rewire the TV, or place the thing on its BACK (facing towards the ceiling) in the box. I've found that unplugging my TV for 15 minutes does NOT help with my model.

So how do you maximize the image you get with the $10 special:

1. Room must be as dark as possible. That also means no light must leak from your TV, **EXCEPT** only the image and only through the image lens. 2. The inside of the "box" should be painted FLAT BLACK to absorb reflected light. (Yes, it DOES make a difference). You could line it with black paper, or build the whole thing out of black cardboard too. Contrary to what some posters have suggested, painting the inside white or lining it with foil only increases STRAY LIGHT, ie **GLARE**, coming out of your lens. Yes, you end up with a brighter picture, but the picture QUALITY is noticeably worse. 3. Likewise, you want the lens put in back of a ROUND hole, which is the diameter of the largest "circle" on the lens. Again, I've tried both ways and this definitely DOES make a difference. If you don't do it you end up with a brighter, but fuzzier picture, as above. 4. You want a HOOD in FRONT of the lens (of course, painted black). Again, reduces glare, as above. What I mean by this is a can, or cone shaped piece of paper taped onto the FRONT of the contraption to prevent stray light from coming out. 5. TV must be adjusted properly. You want the color intensity to be higher than normal viewing since the projection fades the color. You want the TV set to maximum sharpness, and brightness just a LITTLE more than normal. Again, too much brightness and you end up with more glare, NOT a better picture. With my TV, (which has electronic adjustments) I've found that I can adjust it in real time using the remote control with the TV on. 6. Perfect focus is ABSOLUTELY CRITICAL for a sharp picture. The whole unit must be set up level and square to the projection screen, and the lens has to be centered on the TV screen, flat, and absolutely square to it. I don't think anyone has mentioned this, but it's actually quite hard to get good focus with the cheapo box-in-a- box technique. I am working on a screw mechanism using lag bolts for a nice fine-tuneable focus. 7. Better screen = brighter picture. They're expensive, but there's a reason why people refer to movies as the "silver screen." I think this has been covered here. 8. DON'T try to actually get a 100 inch picture! Unless your source is a huge TV (in which case, why even bother?), this much magnification just means your image will be incredibly dim, nearly unviewable (see above). Try for a more reasonable 60 or 70 inch image, and you'll have a noticeably sharper, brighter picture. Believe me, a 6 foot image on your wall 10 feet in front of you is **GIGANTIC**, and it will appear literally twice as bright as an 8 foot image. If you can stomach a "teensy" four foot image (ie as big as a medium sized 48 inch projection TV), you'll really have quite a decent picture.

One other thing. I'm a little suprised no one has mentioned it before in this thread. An old college dorm trick dating back to at least the eighties is to use one of these fresnel lens projectors in front of a computer monitor set to one of those "psychedelic" screen savers. (In the sixties and seventies they got a similar effect by cooking an oil drop on top of an overhead projector). This projects a whole wall of craziness that can be quite impressive in a dark room! (I'm told there are other ways to make this image look even "cooler" but I certainly wouldn't recommend those to anyone! ;-)

Now *I'D* appreciate pointing to any serious discussion about building an LCD based projector. IMO, that is DEFINITELY taking this idea to the next level, albeit one that the average schmoe doesn't have the cash or expertise to build. . .YET. . .

-- autopsy doc (autopsy_doc@yahoo.com), June 04, 2002.

hey autopsy doc, go here : http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=281

be prepared to read for a couple of days before you post though :)

-- gavin messenger (gavmess@ihug.com.au), June 05, 2002.

Boy was that last message of mine long-winded! Thanks for the link to LCD projector construction. Something tell me that these things will become the home standard in under 10 years.

One other thing about the $10 projection TV (not to beat a dead horse here). If you look at devices that are actually designed to project a big image: overhead projectors, film projectors, slide projectors, digital video projectors, etc, every one of them puts out so much light that if you look directly at the light source, you get blinded. That's how much light output you need to illuminate a big screen, and no matter what you do to it, a normal TV just won't do that.

-- ad (autopsy-doc@yahoo.com), June 05, 2002.

Look, everybody... Before you're going to post on this site, at least try and make the thing, first!

You don't need to fuck around with two mirrors to flip the image... blah, blah, blah - just get two lenses. That's it. ____ | |\ |TV|= | |/ ----

Then move the "="(a box with two fixed lenses) closer and further from the screen in the sloping box ">" until you get a clear image projected. What's your problem?

|\/|\/ |/\|/\

The "|" sybolises the fresnel lens (pronounsed frehnel) and the "\" and "/" symbolise the direction of the light.

It really is that simple

Visit www.cheesephilosophies.iwarp.com

~Dark Soul~ "Why delay the inevitable - I'm going to die someday, right?" 05/06/02 21:50 GMT England

-- Dark Soul (sd@hackuk.net), June 05, 2002.

autopsy doc:

first: " I work with expensive optics (microscopes, cameras, analog and digital projectors, etc) every single day, so I have a good deal of hands on experience with high- end optical equipment."

as i can see in your post, you wrote about fresnel ??????

where is that expensive optics ? have you experimented with it ?

second: " This thing has been DONE TO DEATH, and TAKEN TO ITS LIMIT decades ago! There is just physically no way that an ordinary television can do what an expensive projection TV can do, no matter what kind of lenses or mirrors or design you use! "

then, why are you messing with it!

third: as i see this thing, with good optics, box is not the problem!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), June 08, 2002.

Wow, I got my ghetto TV projector to work. I bought a 3x lens and plans on eBay (the plans were worthless) and I've had great results. I built the whole thing out of cardboard and duct tape and I'm using a 13" television. I'm getting huge 100" projections on the wall, pretty sharp images too. I got a 12" x 12" mirror cut and that works great too. I found an old home movie projector screen, but it seems like projecting onto our white wall works better. I have the whole set up in our basement, where it's dark enough to get a good picture. I'll try to do a write up and post pictures and plans onto a web site soon. I'm constructing a wood version tomorrow; i'll be sure and take lots of pictures. :)

-- John (first_blood2NOSPAM@hotmail.com), June 12, 2002.

Ebay has a photo of the alledged picture. It shows 2 retarded looking kids in front of an image on a wall.

-- ja ol (J@AOL.COM), June 12, 2002.

How come none of you dumbasses can post a pic? You can supposedly build a 100" projector out of bubble gum and toothpicks but none of you can get your cameras to work. Try sticking a moldy pickle in your box, it might not improve picture quality but it will certainly keep you entertained....asses.

-- ja ol (j@aol.com), June 12, 2002.

Hey guys, to save time, just send me a check for $10 and I will come over to your house and stick my foot up your ass. By the way, has anyone seen P-Diddy, I can't find him.

-- jen Lopez (JLo@aol.com), June 12, 2002.

Really, isn't there like a forum for all this somewhere!

This past week, I attempted to put together a 100" projector using a 5.6 inch LCD screen by Rosen. It's the LCD screen by GameVue for the PSOne. I got a box, a simple page magnifier, flipped the LCD over and pow, I was pretty happy with the immediate results. The only issue was it was a dark picture.

The lens was about 2 feet from the LCD screen, but the focused image was about 20-30 feet from the lens on the wall!

Used a white bedsheet for the screen. The only thing left (I'm figuring) is putting a light source behind the LCD. Light hits the sides of the box, back onto the LCD and out through lens brighter then what the LCD could do by itself.

Anyway, if any of you have been checking out my plans at

http://www.originalplots.com/ then I wanted to let you know I'll be revising and posting a new set of plans for this project, with nice color pictures of everything.

Despite the craziness, I'm confident we're close to perfecting this, and we can do it without people having to spend money. So check the page soon!

-- Bryan O'Neill (bryan@originalplots.com), June 20, 2002.

Salesmen eat cock. anyone can make a diagram. someone post a fucking real picture if this is for real. ...................... ..................... .....it would be nice if these damn salespeople would quit verbally shitting on everyones faces,

-- You all (bah@snarf.net), June 20, 2002.

Hi guys!

I just made a test setup with a normal TV. Because it is a big TV I want a rear-projection. I will be watching movies true my computer. A lot of you are talking about mirrors, but I found another way. It also works on front-projecten as well. I downloaded the codec divXg400 to flip the screen in my windows media player. Use the TV- out feature from your videocard to go the the TV. When you use front- projection, you can put a screen in front of your TV and everyting looks OK.

When you want rear-projection, you have to flip the screen so it will be mirrored. I am still looking for the right software for this, but I have a backup-solution. I have a creative DXR3 mpeg card so I can hook my tv on the card. I use divXg400 to flip the image, and to "mirror" it, I use HHplus software. In this testfase I am using a normal bedsheet for the rear-projection.

Good luck! Waddy

-- waddy (waddy@easynet.be), June 22, 2002.

Well, here goes nothing. I have started building my 100" tonight using plans I purchased from www.b-adeals.com. I really like the concept of their plans, they have a different design from anyone else's I have seen. Right now I'm in the process of "unplugging the TV and letting it sit for a while" to correct (i hope) the color change problem so many have experienced from the tv lying in an unnatural position. I will let you all know how it goes and what my results are. I am currently using a 2x lens from office max, but I have a supposed 3x on its way. Should be here soon. Will be neat to see the difference between the two lenses. Wish me luck!

-- Robert Fulcher (malyon@bellsouth.net), June 24, 2002.

this is obviously not a great idea, noone seems to be pleased but i still want a ghetto screen of my own. can anyone email plans to ne at holaaustin@hotmail.com?

-- austin partridge (holaaustin@hotmail.com), June 25, 2002.

Well, Mr Austin Partridge, go to: h ttp://www.originalplots.com/images/bryans_100inchTVguide.pdf to find out about how to make one of these astounding tv projectors! These plans are better than those i paid for on eBay, and they are free. Wow! Go there now to be amazed or just stunned.

-- JibberJabberDC (webmaster@jibberjabberdc.co.uk), June 26, 2002.

Robert Fulcher, try this!

when you get your second fresnel, try to atach 3x directly to the screen, and place 2x normaly in the box (like others did)!

it should make image much better and brighter (3x should pick up most of the light of the screen and beam it to the 2x)!

i dont have the fresnels and i cant try it, but i think it should work much better that way! please post your results here!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), June 27, 2002.

thanks bryan, i can't wait to get started on the ghetto screen, i was afraid you pointed me towards a site selling plans but these are very descriptive and free. cheers.

-- austin (holaaustin@hotmail.com), June 28, 2002.

Was that comment to me? I am not called Brian, so maybe i should butt out...

-- JibberJabberDC (webmaster@jibberjabberdc.co.uk), June 28, 2002.

i was'nt sure if it was bryan or jibber jabber, whatever, i give you credit too jib whanker or i mean jabber. gotta love the pommies. ghetto screen enthusiasts.. cheers

-- austin (holaaustin@hotmail.com), June 29, 2002.

Thanks for insulting me - much appreciated. I was only trying to help. Nice to know that you call helpful people "Whanker"'s...

To all other's out there that are thinking of building a Projector, the plans that i mentioned are free and are amazing.

-- JibberJabberDC (webmaster@jibberjabberdc.co.uk), June 29, 2002.

Well, i built it. I get a picture. Not too bad. Not too good either. However, note that i did NOT paint the inside of my box black. My reasoning being this; I got a pretty good picture, but relatively dim. I was afraid that if I painted my box black that more light would be absorbed and the picture would get dimmer. I still havent recieved my 3x lens yet, i thought it would be here by now. Maybe it'll be here on monday. All in all the picture isnt too bad, just dim and a little fuzzy.

-- Robert Fulcher (malyon@bellsouth.net), June 29, 2002.

Oh i see now Austin! You think i am Bryan from Originalplots.com, well, i am not! I am JibberJabberDC from JibberJabberDC.co.uk! I just found the plans and thought that you didn't know. Still, there was no need to swear at me!

Robert Fulcher: If you turn your TV's brightness up, and paint the inside of your box silver you will get a better picture. Try it.

-- JibberJabberDC (webmaster@jibberjabberdc.co.uk), June 29, 2002.

Silver eh? Never heard that one bfore, had thought about it but never heard anyone suggest it. I thought white would be too reflective, black would be too "absorbant"--why not try for the middle road and try gray-or silver. Im not too diaappointed with the picture. I watched a little Empire Strikes Back tonight and it was kind of cool....Just a little blurry. It seems like its soooooooo close to being really cool, but there needs to be something extra to really make it work well. Know what I mean? Im going to try a different design, just the basic tv sitting on its base with a box coming off the front to see if that helps(my current design requires the TV to sit on its back and my tv darkens up ever so slightly when its positioned this way). I will try black and maybe even silver if black doesnt do the trick. Cant wait to try the 3x and 2x lenses together to see what that does!

-- Robert Fulcher (malyon@bellsouth.net), June 29, 2002.

it was about 2 years ago that i first came across this whole 100" tv deal. quietly sitting at my computer, surfing ebay, i saw "100 INCH TV FOR LESS THAN $20!!". Hmmmmmmmmmm......i smell scam. i looked at the auction. it looked ok. but i didnt buy it. i searched google. i found alot of interesting links. ok, i thought. i took the lense out of a single slide viewer i got for $2. i held the lense in front of the tv with my hand. i looked on the ceiling. i could see John Cleeses head as big as i was. the picture was crystal clear. and that was only with my hand and the lense. i havent even built the box yet! email me for pics of it in action, or the lense.

-- Screw Xbox (lynx051@hotmail.com), July 01, 2002.

i finaly got 2 fresnels!

i placed first directly on monitor screen, and second on the box, and thats it!

NO BLUR, PERFECT IMAGE (stil upside down, but i will rewire the tube!)!!!

I TOLD YOU, BUT YOU WOULDNT LISTEN!!!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), July 02, 2002.

How can you project the full monitor image with the lens ON the screen? unless your using a lens the same size as the screen??

-- doubter (doubter@yahoo.com), July 02, 2002.

14 inch monitor with 14 inch page magnifier!

the one on the screen has bumpy side turned to the screen, the other on the box is turned oposite to the first one!

first one is collecting the light and beaming it to the second, which is magnifying and projecting image to the wall!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), July 03, 2002.

If your using the standard 7"x10" or 81/2"x11" fresnel lens directly on the screen, you cannot be getting the whole 14" image on the first lens to project to the second lens. If you are, then please explain how this is achieved.

-- doubter (doubter@yahoo.com), July 03, 2002.

i reduced image on the monitor less than 1 inch at each side, and it fits!

-- the whinner (milutinbre@yahoo.com), July 04, 2002.

This is kinda funny. I received an e-mail from a website advertising and selling this very project (100 inch TV). The site is at http://www.earthprofit.com and they refer to the project as "Laser X". What's interesting is that on the website it shows examples of the quality of images it projects, which is supposed to be superior to "any other" plans that are out there. There is one image in particular located at http://www.earthprofit.com/aboutlaserx.htm. If you scroll to the bottom of the page you'll see a stillframe taken from a video game that supposedly implemented the Laser X system.

Now if you go to another website: http://www.do-it- yourself.netfirms.com/projector.htm, you'll see a page which outlines in detail--color pictures and all--the steps one guy took to build his own 100 inch projector. If you scroll to the bottom of the page, you'll see a screenshot of an image his projector supposedly produced. Lo and behold, it is the EXACT SAME picture that was shown on the hi-tech Laser X site. So obviously one of these sites is bullshitting, the question is, which one? ;)

-- Daryus (daryusd@yahoo.com), July 04, 2002.

Neiter are bullshitting; they are both doing it. That image is a very common image used when companys are selling kits (look on eBay if you don't believe me). Anyway, the images are that quality if you use the right lens and plans.

-- JibberJabberDC (webmaster@jibberjabberdc.co.uk), July 04, 2002.

If my projected image looked like that, I'd throw the thing in the rubbish!!

-- doubter (doubter@yahoo.com), July 04, 2002.

Also-- D'ont be fooled by these images that some sellers of the projector show. Most of them have been "cropped" to hide the blurry edges and some are obviously not images obtained from this projection system, particularly the ones on ebay.

-- doubter (doubter@yahoo.com), July 04, 2002.

and Whinner--- thats great, if your using a monitor, but doesn't help if your using a tv like most of us!!

-- doubter (doubter@yahoo.com), July 04, 2002.

I can't believe people are still posting on here!

I put this place in my favorites about a year ago after building a couple of these.

It's amazing, but you guys still have the EXACT SAME conversations as a year ago.

Guy 1: Is this a scam? Guy 2: It's a scam don't waste your money! Guy 3: No one's getting money! It's just a project! The results are fun, but not professional. Here's all the things we've learned so far: Blah blah blah. Guy 4: Since no one else is doing this, I'll do it and find out. Guy 5: Can someone explain it from the beginning? Guy 6: How do mirrors work? Guy 1: I'm not sure, it might be a scam! [Repeat sequence for 2 years]

You guys, this project is dead. Everything you'll ever need (and a HELL OF A LOT MORE) is on this page if you could just READ IT! It's not a replacement for a big screen TV, it never has been, and it never will be!

I went to this site a year ago and nothing has changed--make it for fun, you DON'T NEED PLANS TO BUILD ONE, and otherwise DON'T WASTE TOO MUCH TIME ON THIS!

It's just a magnifying glass in front of a TV screen for Pete's sake.

-- OH MY GOODNESS (OH@mygoodness.net), July 04, 2002.

Whinner,

Some of us are planning to use a computer monitor so keep on posting. I believe that witha computer monitor the image should be better as a computer monitor has a better resolution than a TV.

I think that using two lenses is a great idea, specially if the image is enhanced by it. I would like to know if you used lenses with different magnification factors? Please tell me more about the X's of the lenses you used.

Thanks, Miguel

-- Miguel (msantos@cfl.rr.com), July 04, 2002.

what you could do is hook up a second computer monitor to your video card (with a vga splitter), and use that. You could probably get some driver that will flip the screen horizontally and vertically so you dont have to worry about inverted images

-- Paul Young (py@newmail.net), July 05, 2002.

hey just remembered something. In quake 3 you can set the FOV (field of view) to whatever you want. You could set the FOV to a negative number, and that would horizontally flip the screen! Only problem is that it would only work in Quake3, or any other game that people can think of where you can change the FOV.

-- Paul Young (py@newmail.net), July 05, 2002.

hey guys...you knwo there is a fun virus around that turns your screen up side down...the virus doesnt do any harm to your pc its just a joke virus i think you may be able to get it from www.irn- bru.co.uk and go to the fun bit this wroked for me but i havent tried the projection unit yet....im gonna try it soon...but anyway...this little fun virus will turn your screen upside down and will stop you form having to use mirrors or turn your screen up side down....and also i think it just summit like alt F4 to get out of the virus so it aint gonna cause any damage

have fun Shaun

-- Shaun (shaunceltic@btopenworld.com), July 06, 2002.

Just download the mimo codecs pack for your mediaplayer. In this pack you will find divx g400. When you play a movie, a little icon is shown on the bottom of te monitor. There you can select to flip the screen upside down. If anyone knows a way to use the lens with rear-projection and the subtitles are ok, without a mirror, please let me know.

-- waddy (waddy@easynet.be), July 06, 2002.

someone post actual pictures of their prjector instead of all these illistrations, with dimentions and step by step instructions with piuctures to make one.

-- brandon (boarderbm@yahoo.com), July 06, 2002.

Hello,

I was wondering if any of you have heard of the ready-made version of the projector sold by Select Dimension (www.selectdimension.com). I'd much rather buy this thing ready made, and I was wondering if anyone knows where I can buy one, and if the quality on any of the ready made ones is as good as a home-made one made really well.

Thanks,

Ahsan

-- Ahsan (ahsans@earthlink.net), July 06, 2002.

I am coming in a little late on this whole 100 inch ordeal but am going to give it a whirl, so just wondering a few basic tips: Is it best to use a smaller 19" or so tv or is it possible with a whole 30" or so tv? Also has it became apparent that one lense/plan is better than the others or are they pretty much all same. I came across them on ebay originally. Thanks to any who have any advice.

-- Nate (hrizonstickup@hotmail.com), July 10, 2002.

try www.DIYprojectionTV.tk free 100" inch tv screen plans.

big screen tv free

projector tv plans, free

free projection tv plans!

-- Liam frod (mail@bigscreentv.20m.com), July 12, 2002.

Look at my awesome pics of my very own projector. I made it in 45 mins. and it looks amazing!

Check out the site!

www.bigscreentvprojector.com

P.S. If you aren't able to achieve this quality then you should bite me!

-- Bite Me (biteme@hotmail.com), July 14, 2002.

Does anyone have any "GENUINE" photos of their projected image-- not something copied off Ebay!!!

-- doubter (doubter@yahoo.com), July 19, 2002.

I have 60 7x10 fresnel lenses for sale. Sold as one lot, will NOT separate. These are the ones sellers are pushing at eBay. I bought them direct from the Taiwan Source. You can see them at: http://www.3dlens.com/enter.html Item: #406

Specs: 180mm x 260mm (7"x10") Item: #406 Thickness: 0.4mm Weight: 26 grams Material: Optical PVC Groove pitch: 0.3mm Focal length: 30cm Magnification: 3x

All 60 lenses for $35.00 plus $6.50 for priority shipping. US delivery only. This is a savings of $45.90 over what I payed & their current prices. PayPal or Money order accepted.

Email me if interested & thanks for your time, Tom twr35@aol.com

-- Tom (twr35@aol.com), July 20, 2002.

I build mine today. ITS bigger than my S#!T, but the pics is blurry. Now I am happy.

-- asd (asd@bari.com), July 29, 2002.

Me read the instruction on the web to paint red inside the box and paint the lense with silver color for gooder result. And them tell me to put light bulp inside the box. Me got problem now. Me can not see anything. Me need someone help. Me buy the plan for $45. The plan suppose to work guarateed.

-- Joders Fraighiazag (Helpme@kas.com), July 29, 2002.

I have been working on this for a few years and mine works good. The deal with the pics people keep wanting is that the screens arent bright enough to take pictures of them. Unless you want to get a non digital camera and expose the film for a long time. They usually arent that bright.

Secondly... I am using a 8 x 11 sheet magnifier ...ada fresnel lens.. from staples for 7 bucks in the USA. It puts out 2 times the light and clarity as a smaller 3 x 5 fresnel lens so its worth the upgrade. With a good screen, mine will be a good replacement. I can watch it with a small lamp on too.

-- Ada (nono1230@lycos.com), August 01, 2002.

I've also tried to get pictures using digital camera. The results are poor which would give a missleading impression of good or bad the results can be to the human eye. In fast action sequences the eye naturally compensates for any out of focus around edge of screen. Using still frame i.e. from video recorder produces blurred images. Other than title sequences or video games with lots of still writing i thing the image is excellent considering the cost to set up. What you need is patience to experiment with different methods of focusing image and this is the ongoing challenge.Don't get to serious, its a cheap hobby on a rainy evening especially in the UK!

-- b (bobkirk@totalise.co.uk), August 01, 2002.

Hey, I just built the projector yesterday out of black foam core and a page magnifier from Staples. It works quite well even with my computer monitor on, giving off light. I'm attempting to reverse the image by using 3 mirrors so it will still be projecting on the wall.

The foam core worked out nicely because it was very light and it was already black, so I saved some money, not having to buy the spray paint.

I was wondering if I added a long tube to the front of the frisnel lense, would it decrease the size of the picture and concentrate the light? Cause I don't really want to move my tv closer to the wall to make the image smaller (the image is bigger than my wall and not very bright).

This is what my idea was: ____________ ____________ _ | | | |_________________ | | | | | | TV |Projector | | Box Tube | | | | |_________________| |____________|____________|_| | Fresnel

-- Eric (taz1328@aol.com), August 01, 2002.

-- (boarderbm@yahoo.com), August 01, 2002.

-- (boarderbm@yahoo.com), August 01, 2002.

well, I guess my entry didn't completely work out... so I'll give it another shot.

This is my picture of what I plan to make. I use 3 mirrors and the tube in the front is what I explained in my earlier entry. The frisnel lens is located in the white part in the middle.

Anyone have any ideas or comments?

-- Eric (taz1328@aol.com), August 01, 2002.

just rightclick and click show picture, it should work

-- Eric (taz1328@aol.com), August 01, 2002.

This better be it...

-- Eric (taz1328@aol.com), August 01, 2002.

how do u people post a picture on here? with out linking it?

-- b (boarderbm@yahoo.com), August 04, 2002.

ANYONE WANT AN EASY WAY TO MAKE A TV PROJECTOR WITHOUT USING 3 MIRORS AND LOOKS JUST LIKE AS IF U WERE LOOKING AT THE TV ITSELF? ITS EASY JUST GO TO------- WWW.100INCHTV.8M.COM/PHOTO6.HTML ------AND GO ALL THE WAY TO THE BOTTOM FOR A GREAT DIAGRAM OF IT. IT DOESN'T SCREW UP YOUR TELEVISION COLRO EITHER. ITS GREAT! TRY IT. ENOUGH WITH ALL THIS 3 MIRROR BULL.

IF SOMEONE TELLS ME HOW TO PUT PICS ON HERE ILL POST IT.

-- BRANDON (boarderbm@yahoo.com), August 05, 2002.

Just go out and buy a big screen tv. I tried making one of these and its junk. I spent $2,500 on a 62 inch hdtv and its much better by far. The only use for this crap would be a science project for your kids. However if you cant afford a HDTV this is good. By the way I am a nuclear scientist for NASA.

-- Steve Miller (jj125643@yahoo.com), August 17, 2002.

Obtain the sheet magnifier from staples 8 1/2'' x 11'' There is absolutley no reason to order online. Also go to this website to see what you are actually suppose to buy.

This is the sheet magnifier, try this link to know what you're going to staples to look for purchase is about 8$ US currency, maybe less.

http://www.staples.com/Catalog/Browse/SKU.asp? BCFlag=False&PageType=1&SKU=apo27570

-- EGL (fading112@yahoo.com), September 03, 2002.

hi everyone i have also decided to build the ghetto bigscreen. I can't seem to figure this all out some says "its works good" some says it "sucks" if anyone has acheived outstanding results and actually have people come over to watch this lay out exactly what you did most of this thread seems to be fragments. If one person could lay down the whole thing that got great results that would be cool.

-- studmuffin (cuztv@aol.com), September 18, 2002.

I finaly made one last nite!!!

YES it works, My wife couldn't belive it, neither did my Koumbaro George who is an Optom!. I ended up only using one box over the TV and moving the lense in or out. Its a 19" TV, I put it upside down, I watched Star wars the size of my wall, it tends to bleed the image some times (Fuzzy). My wall is a Semi-Gloss Acrylic but I will try the shower screen soon!!!.

The only draw back is that it takes up alot of room, and if you have other stuff in the room its uncomfy!!

I think that everyone should try it, and as others have said for $20 its great!!

Regards Steph

PS Recognise the Pontian, Armenian and Assyrian Genocide by the Turks...NOW

-- Steph Kakaleas (Kakaleas@Pontian.org), September 18, 2002.

Has the spittle-crusts in the corner of your mouth grown to cause your brain to seize? Keep your whore-lies to yourself.

-- Serdar Argic (sera@zuma.uucp), September 19, 2002.

50"-200" projection TV kit already made to be attached to 13"-14" TV, I found this site:

WWW.SELECTDIMENSION.COM

Did anyone ever order from them? I'm thinking about ordering but I would like feedback from people who already bought from them. $179us but saves trouble from having to make it. Thanks

-- Dave (none@tha4nks53.com), September 24, 2002.

I am looking for software to invert my computer screen, so I won't need the mirror.

Anyone know where I can find it.

-- Biz (biz@uirc.com), November 03, 2002.

This is really wicked. It really works!

-- Doom2312 (unknown3457@icqmail.com), November 04, 2002.

This is really cool now i can watch tv on my ceiling. I even hosted a chat room on lagnet: #Projector

-- N/A (2@2.com), November 06, 2002.

iv built my projector like the one on www.diyprojectiontv.tk ok the one on this site looks a little rough but if the tape was black it would look like a real projector iv mounted my fresnel lens in a box that can slide back and forth inside the larger box which helps with the focusing of it i got my lens in a sewing shop and im just waiting till its dark tonite to try it on a 14 inch portable im gonna use a projector screen the hole thing has cost me 3 dollars

-- (freestylefreakyabas@yahoo.co.uk), November 11, 2002.

I made myself a rig today. I bought a 8 1/2"x11(I think thats what it is) page magnifier from Staples for 11 dollars Canadian. I made myself a box with 4 sides, no back end (So i can get my Tv out if I need to) and my front end is a piece of cardboard with the lens on it. I have my 13" Tv in there, and I started to watch some shows. I tried the method of turning your TV upside, unplugging it and waiting for 15 mins but it doesnt work. So im gonna get a mirror. The best picture I can get is around 36" without it getting really blurry. The edges are blurry, anything tips on how to fix it?

-- Rylan (peco_777@hotmail.com), November 12, 2002.

if ure picture is blurry try turning the lens so as the side with the lines on it is facing the tv screen as this cuts down on reflections also make sure that its easy to refocus the lens i use is a box in a box which can be slid back and forth for easy focusing also u may notice that the picture on ur wall is a mirror image try watching the news and look at all the writing its all back to front this may not bother u but im gonna use a mirror between my tv and my lens to change it around

-- (freestylefreakyabas@yahoo.co.uk), November 17, 2002.

Hello all. I have just completed reading most of the posts as well as following most of the links. Next weekend I will be completing my first project with this technology and hope to be able to help other do the same. Since my time is very limited this week I will simply put up a page of images (This seems to be what people are asking for) until I have time to complete a proper site on this subject. You may follow the links below to my beta site:

http://www.hampy s.com/100intv/Temp/page_01.htm

Not sure if HTML tags work, so here is the link in text: http://www.hampys.com/100intv/Temp/page_01.htm

Happy building, Chad

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), November 17, 2002.

help i need pics and where do i find the lens

-- jr johns (jrs8711@knology.net), November 18, 2002.

jr johns, I am not exactly sure what you mean by you need Pics? You may view my picture pages from here by selecting [Pictures]: http://www.hampys.com/100intv/ I have compile a list of online retailers that sell Fresnel lens/Page magnifiers:http://www.hampys.c om/100intv/buylens.shtml

You can also purchase a Fresnel lens from Staples, OfficeMax, Office Depot and off of eBay. Let me know if I can be of any further assistance.

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), November 18, 2002.

Sorry forgot to close the Bold

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), November 18, 2002.

I completed my first Projection Box today using: 2 boxes 1 box knife 1 fresnel lens 1 roll of duct tape 1 Zenith 20” Color TV

Picture was roughly 8’ X 6’ and brightness was not an issue. The light areas of the picture seemed to have halos and I was not able to produce a very sharp image. Next weekend I am planning to create a similar projection box out of wood. The inside of the box will be painted black (Brightness is not an issue for me) and I will taper the box from the TV to the Fresnel lens. I will also attach a baffle on the end of the projector (The same type you see on real projectors).

Anyway, in my opinion, the project provided great results on the first try! Not movie theater quality but near what you would see at the drive-in movies.

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), November 23, 2002.

Yes when I hooked up my projection tv why is my picture so blurry. The Brightness and size is fine just blurry . Can you give me some idea. I slid the lens back and forth inside and out. And resized the picture but still can't figure it out. If it might be a lens. please state a info about a good lens to buy .. about 20 usa dollars at the most. I need the Brand, name, thickness, everything about the lens possable. Thank You so much for your time and effor. This is the best post reply I have ever found about the projection tv. e- mail me at here: ebay2021@hotmail.com or pm me on yahoo messenger id name: spider_2021 .

Spider--

-- spider (ebay2021@hotmail.com), December 01, 2002.

Spider, My first suggestion (And easiest) is to take a piece of cardboard and cut a 4 inch X 4 inch round (Or square) hole in it and hold it up to the end of your projector where the light is coming out. This should greatly diminish the luminance of your image but it should allow you to adjust the focus of your final image without any of the refracted light from your projector. If this makes your image sharper then your issue is light bouncing around inside your projector and creating noise in your image. This maybe what is causing your blurry image? (I had this same issue)

As for a lens, I am using the cheapest 2X lens I could find and I have been able to greatly sharpen and brighten my image with this lens. I do believe a higher quality lens may help your image quality but not enough to counteract the cost.

Hope this helps, Chad - 100inTV WebSite

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), December 01, 2002.

Does anyone know if lining the inside of the box with that Cheap BLACK FELT material help with the picture quality? THANKS

-- SEV (Rlb73@qmix.net), December 03, 2002.

I don't quite know about lining the inside box with back paper. I can't even get my picture to sharpen at all. Like I said the size is fine just it is blurry as hell. I have a page maganafier. I use cardboard for the box. Just can't get it too work. I tried the 4x4 box around the lens like you told me and there was no improvement at all. What size tv do you have? What is the largest size you can get for the best quality?

If someone has the plans plese e-mail them too me. Thanks Spider--

-- Spider (ebay2021@hotmail.com), December 03, 2002.

Black felt should work very well to diffuse the unwanted light if you want to go to all that work!

As for Designs, you can find the ones I have here: http://www.hampys.com/100intv/design.shtml

Hope this helps,

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), December 03, 2002.

Chat would the black felt sharpen my picture. My size of the picture is fine and the brightness is good. It just needs to be SHARPER!!. I use cardboard and a ferensal lens or whatever the hell it is called. Thanks

Spier--

-- Spider (ebay2021@hotmail.com), December 03, 2002.

I know its been a while since anyone posted a message on this board but, after reading all this info the past few days, and paying close attention to what everyone has repeated, I took it all in and built one... Holy Shit... To those morons who keep asking questions that have been answered here over and over, READ THE DAMN POSTINGS... I think Chad and Sean (I think thats the right names) had the best info, check out the websites... There's no scam, it's what you make of it. Take your time and do it right and it will be the coolest damn thing ever. I used a 19inch tv that I paid 9 dollars for at the Goodwill hooked my Xbox up to it, after reversing the tube wires, and now i'm playin football (clearly) on an 7 foot tv (I'm a big kid.) And unlike the rich pricks who can afford to buy a 52"+ tv, i dont have to worry about burning images into the screen, so bite me. Its the best thing since sliced bread... It's cheap, fun, easy, and well worth it... So, I just wanna thank the regulars to this board, and tell the new comers like myself to listen to whats on this site... I'll add my own experiences when I have to, but as for right now I dont have any hints cause I just read what you guys already had... Thanx

-- Rob Haller (Robfrmpgh@juno.com), December 04, 2002.

And one more thing, don't be a dunce and pay any web sites for the lens and the plans. Like everyone here has said just go to Staples or Office Max and get the lens, it's cheaper and in my area (Pennsylvania) they have 3 and 4x power ones. And there are enough links here to find a style that works for you... I recommend a box with an adjustable lens. Dont worry about putting lights in the box or painting it white ect... Honestly an older TV seems to work good, they seem to give off more light and and you can tune in a picture on it as well as adjusting your lens... Newer TV's dont let you tune in a picture, they just have the sharpness feature which actually diminishes light...

-- Rob Haller (robfrmpgh@juno.com), December 04, 2002.

Hey guys,

Can someone give an idea on reversal of image. coz i cant turn my TV upside down. Well anybody tried with 3 lenses i think it will work there. just an idea.

The first lens diverges the image (upside down), the second lens makes the light rays straight(like a TV image) or converge(hence no body found a solution with 2 lenses) but if a third lens is used then the image from the third lens will revert back the image and put it on wall.

may be it will work any ideas?

-- Anirban (anibap@yahoo.com), December 05, 2002.

This idea seems cool but there's so much bull from those big companies showing digital pictures saying that's your picture so that' a load of shit but the one guy that made one out of a overhead projector made a lot of sense someone else should do it too. I want to hear some more people that tried that

-- joe blow (joeblow69@msnhotmail.com), December 05, 2002.

im not really this guy but want to see some pics of the projector that was made from an overhead projector from some fuckin guy on this site

-- joe blow (jlink84@yahoo.com), December 05, 2002.

For those who are looking to get a sharp picture out of a ghetto big screen-- you're not gonna. GIGO. If you start with a low-res picture tube, you'll end up with a low-res projected image-- just bigger. You could put Zeiss optics in that cardboard box and you'll still end up with a big crappy picture. No amount of black felt, black paint, black lights, black wool, black eyes, black panthers, etc. will sharpen your picture.

This is interesting for the novelty, and might make an interesting rainy Saturday science project, but don't expect to compete with a $75K Runco (or a $4K Loewe or even a $1K Hitachi).

Cheers

-- My Name is William, Bill for Short. (bill@william.org), December 05, 2002.

Sorry I have not posted in a while, I have been very busy! I plan to post again tonight for others that have asked questions but I wanted to put up some information I had about using Mirrors. These are all project designs that "I HAVE NOT TRIED". Use them at your own risk.
http://www.hampys.com/100intv/pictures/inverttv.jpg
http://www.hampys.com/100intv/pictures/plan01.jpg< BR> http://www.hampys.com/100intv/pictures/projx_mirror_se t.jpg
http://www.hampys.com/100intv/pictures/tv_pic.jpg< BR> http://www.hampys.com/100intv/pictures/untitled.gif
If I have time I will get a few mirrors out and see what I can do with getting the image right side up and reading the right direction. Chad

-- Chad (JunkMail@hampys.com), December 06, 2002.

The link above from “Jon” is just a spam Ad site. If we have a moderator on this forum please remove the above response!

GIGO (Garbage In Garbage Out) is exactly right, your image will only be as sharp and as bright as the source. Again, my output is about equal to what you would expect to see at a drive-in movie. Expensive optics are not for me but if anyone is willing to put the money into it, let me know how it comes out!

I have never worked with an overhead projector or I would be happy to post information on the subject. I have talked to many people that have had great success with LCD technology and an overhead projector. Maybe some day when I dump a few bucks into this project, I will try it out. For now, I am just seeing what I can do for very little money.

Happy illumination,

-- Chad (Junkmail@hampys.com), December 08, 2002.

This is really wicked. I has build a test version. It works, but still need some modifications. If any 1 has a overhead projector then you should try splitting da lens. It is actually 2 lenses. It helps a lot.

What can I do bout da blurry edges, plz help! Thanks

-- ALI G (unknown3457@icqmail.com), December 10, 2002.

i tried the OHP lens! the image was big and sharp, but pale, becouse the diameter of lens was too small to let enough light through it! also tried lens from movie projector, much better image than with fresnel, but focal lenght was short, so i cant pick up all of the image from tv screen! glass lenses are much better than fresnels, they make much sharper image!

-- the whinner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), December 13, 2002.

I made this thing the first time trying to build it not trying to brag but maybe my plans are different. i have an exe program with the plans on it. If some of you would like it. ask or some one with a web site ask and I will email it to you. but i do frequent kazaa ppl been getting it from me there( few that is).

Doug dnt32@kazaa

-- Doug Simpson (Dasimpsons69@cs.com), December 17, 2002.

mine has the plans for what paint to use for the screen and what paint to use for the box and give the produ id's for them

-- Doug Simpson (Dasimpsons69@cs.com), December 17, 2002.

As I have not be in this forum or what ever it is that long but i have read thru (or should I say i have skimmed thru the entire page) Maybe i have missed some things that has been already brought up already, but some thought what to paint to use I have some suggestions. Maybe my terminology wont be the same. Because theey are not all from a book or listing or web page.

OK paint to use: these 2 are recommended by the plans that I bought

No. 1248 Testor's Enamel in Metallic Silver or

No. 1401 Krylon Bright Silver Enamel.

I dont know what they look like or anything I have not used them. I think they would be a very light silver and dull no gloss at all...I would think that they would be more like a silver primer type color.

I f you dont use the silver i suggest finding a paint in white that is lso like a primer without the gloss. when i made my screen I had blue paint in my living room on the wallsi turned the tv on with dvd player and paused it a a very bright scene where I could see the outline of the picture then I marked the outline then turned lights on and painted it with I think its was a flat off white color but not too off white it has a chalky look to it after it dries. and my picture is good I watch with some lights on and in the daytime it is watchable when i put a blaket over the window. I think if you paint your entire wall whtie it will not work as well. I plan to turn my carport into home theatre no windows, all black paint except my screen and ill have soft lights to use to navigate thru the caves :-) I think to get the best results is to dedicate an entire rom for this project. Ideas goto movie theatre and not just watch the movie look at the set-up as it is the same theory as we all are working with here.

-- Doug Simpson (Dasimpsons69@cs.com), December 17, 2002.

MAYBE HELP FOR THE BURRY EDGES IF YOU MAKE VCD'S

I have alot ideas for maybe different users. so I may be posting alot of stuff here, this page has revamped my unlost interest in this project. Even though i havent been working on it I think about it.Lost job too broke to buy stuff) lol.

OK Since the 1st thing i saw on this page was the "I know this isnt about VCD" Ima comment on how that may be of some use here with this project since there are, I assume PPL here that makes vcd's. I dont even have my project up now four kids nuff said( wait till I make more perm. box. SO HERe IS THE IDEA: When you makle your VCD use a cropping feature. to where your actual picture is smaller than your television screen. I suggest using black as your cropped area...but i have heard some of you wanting to use light to help with the brightness so maybe use white or multible colors, but I think black would really be the only option here but who knows this is science as we know it if its not tested then you'll never know then document it here or somewhere so the next person will know without having to go thru and do it himself just to fail if it doesnt work that is. documenting your project really helps in so many ways. I used to work in Quality fiekld and this is what we did when we were trying to make a part or product better there is a name for it but i forget should hav e documented it I guess. ok Im thru rambling

-- Doug Simpson (Dasimpsons69@cs.com), December 17, 2002.

LMAO..im back I thought it was called a feasibility test or study ...and it is. I didnt want to say it was that and it not be it so I research it. Im going to research feasibility test to get more on it to find all that needs to be on the feasibility documentation. Think I'll get a free website for this Project just for ythe feasibility test to where they can be posted their for all to see. If you all thinks a good idea.

-- Doug Simpson (Dasimpsons69@cs.com), December 17, 2002.

For serious home theatre aspirants only.

I you want to have fun and want to show your projector only to people who already are impressed by you and save just couple of hundered dollars plus have lot of time and patience..Go for 100tv thing..BUT IF

You are realy looking for hugh,sharp,better than projection TVs (40- 50 inch) picture and have 200-300 dollars I'll suggest you go for this plan (some has I think already talked about this).

- Go to ebay and search for 'LCD projection panel'. Buy an LCD projection lanel (minimum resolution 680 * 420). You can get it for 200-225 and get an overhead projector for 100 dollars (I got one with broken mirror for 55 dollars) and check the links below...

http://www.louisville.edu/~wchall01/diyprojector/howto.htm#method1 http://www.justexportcontrols.co.uk/andrew/projector.htm http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.phps=b89956f5c88a216d1a7e5cf fe5561307&threadid=5223

-- Hrishikesh (hrishikesh.pandey@weamfg.com), December 18, 2002.

Hi guys, having not looked in for a while i thought by now most people would have this sorted, instead there are still a few asking basic questions or kindergarten comments sent during break time! Perhaps its due to the frustration of having to wait for a load of crap to load before seeing any sensible comments. Talking of crap, idea i will be trying shortly, use tv (crt) based projection, purchase eDimension 3-D shutter glasses, dvd drive and graphics card with tv out and watch big screen 3-D movies and games. Merry Christmas.

-- (bk@somwhere.com), December 22, 2002.

Hey Everyone! I'm planning on building a projector TV for my 4 year old son to watch his Toy Story and other kids movies on, but I don't want to have to turn my TV over. My question and favor to ask, is could someone please scan and email me a diagram, plan or website that shows how to use mirrors to invert the TV image. Thank you very much for your time!

Martin Buckley MartyBuckley@aol.com

-- Martin Buckley (MartyBuckley@aol.com), December 30, 2002.

For a little more contrast control, use the SCREEN adjustment pot located on the flyback transformer (this is the device that has the suction cup wire connected to the tube). Caution - this is the device which is resposible for feeding the tube the 22+khz voltage. Getting shocked by this is not fun (work in the field). Simply ensure you are not touching anything but the control - you will be ok. I found that lowering the brightness in some applications gave the picture a lot more contrast and color.

NOTE: I have seen some flybacks with an auto compensating feature which will even out the brightness back to where it was. You will know it when you see it. From what I have heard nothing can be done to get around this. Stick with brightness, contast, and color adjustments.

I've noticed on mine with this screen adjustment in mind, that also lowering the brightness & contrast will solve some of the extremely bright text and also help with clarity. Cranking the color also seems to work well.

To project a correct image, I swapped the yellow & green wires on the yoke connector (this is the big collar snugged up on the end of the tube). This connector also has red & blue wires which I left alone. I basically cut/sawed the connector in half and reversed the green & yellow. This completly solves the backwards/upsidedown issue. If insulated properly one could contruct a nice switch to also display for normal TV use.

If the picture looks unevenly focused - try sandwiching the lens between 2 panes of glass and secure together. I used the glass which is used in 8.5" x11" picture frames, used one frame to sandwich everything together. Works well.

Right now I am working on an adjustable overlay which will control the size of the circular opening. In hopes this will allow more tweaking of the picture.

Using 13" Sanyo TV, flat black case, and a nice sized vinyl window shade which works ok but I am looking for something smoother and very white.

Also I hear the thinner the lens, the better for gaining light. I'm currently going to measure the thickness of my lens and compare with what edmundoptics.com has in their inventory. Should be high quality.

At 4' and smaller diagonal, the picture is good. Past 4' I lose brightness but still has some practical use - hopefully a different lens will work better. Currently using 3x lens.

So far movies are weak - depends on brightness and color of video. DBZ & other cartoons are great. Games depend on title but have enjoyed playing some.

Hopefully, web site with pics to come soon.

-- Pete B (pb316@hotmail.com), January 01, 2003.

Using fresnal lense for this project is waste of time. Use 7 1/2" diameter plano convex lens supplied by Surpluss Shed.com in Usa. Make box from cardboard or similiar 1" larger than screen and 22" long open at each end. Attach box to screen using screws or tape. Using two pieces of 1" thick polystyrene foam cut out 7" dia. hole in centre of each piece of foam and make external dimension of foam to fit inside box so that it can slide in and to focus lense. Sandwich lense between the two pieces of foam and hold together with tape. Place foam and lense inside end of box so that curved surface of lense toward tv screen. To finally focus image roll up piece of card to form 7" dia tube held together with tape, push into 7" dia. hole in foam on the outside, concave face of lense. At end of this tube fit card board ring 7" outside dia. and 5" inside dia.hole and attach with tape. This will remove the final blurring around bright images. To invert image either rewire the scan coil (if you know what you are doing), alternatively place large mirror at end of cardboard tube and devize means of holding it there. Tv may have to be mounted on its back so that setup looks like OHP. Final result will be poor unless a screen is made. Use 4'x 8' mdf sheet, spray white undercoat then aluninium or chrome paint to produce silver screen. Top and bottom centre of sheet attach to wall. Curve screen toward viewer along its vertical axis. Image 6' diagonal at 8'-9' from lense, edge and corners of screen are sharp. Don't go to bright on tv controls go for contrast. Unlike lcd projectors black is black and not grey, colours are vivid. Result as good as some early crt projectors and without the hassle of aligning the RGB on the screen.

-- (bk@somewhere.com), January 03, 2003.

Surplusshed.com 7 1/2" diam. by 20" FL PCX LENS Item no. L2152 $22.50, $18.10 airmail to UK for ref.

-- (bk@somewhere.com), January 03, 2003.

What will happen if I cut a rectangle whole in the front lens, instead of cutting a circle about 6" in diameter?

-- ¿John Doe? (kazisdaman2@hotmail.com), January 10, 2003.

Hi there, I used 17" monitor with 180mm X 260mm fresnel len The best picture, its getting fairly image in the middle but not enough light, and blurred at the edges. Anyone has any advice how to fix my problem?? What's a best lens to use for 17" monitor??? appreciate for your feedback...

-- Anniez (winfield2002@hotmail.com), January 10, 2003.

I heard that using an opaque projector lens works the best. Does anyone no where I canget one?

-- Adam Salsberg (Adam@NtFF.com), January 15, 2003.

I bought this len:

"Surplusshed.com 7 1/2" diam. by 20" FL PCX LENS Item no. L2152 $22.50"

The result is AMAZING! Much much much better picture quality!!! I recommend it. It's like having a real projector (almost)...

The only problem is the flipping of the picure. Is there any utility that flips the picture AND the subtitles both vertically and horizontally???

thanks a lot

-- Yannis Karampelas (yannis@usa.net), January 18, 2003.

Place tv or monitor on its back and position large mirror at 45 degreeish angle above lense as on a overhead projector. This will reverse image back to normal and is a more compact design. Be careful not to allow lense to fall onto tv screen! On earlier design i used a three sided box to mount mirror using knitting needles to vary position of mirror. Alternatively on tv rewire scan coil, see earlier in forum.

-- (bk@somewhere.com), January 18, 2003.

to all these guys that say this big tv project is a joke and your stupid for trying. How about you relax a little, why so angry? If you dont have a love of tinkering with shit and constantly trying to improve something then don't do this. but if you love learning and experimenting, and have a few bucks to throw to the wind then go for it. who is to say that it cant be perfected for far less than a big screen,littlebigman, or some fuckin bitter angry weirdo like that, whatever i think that anything is possible. lets prove all these assholes who are comin' down on the project wrong.

-- glasssliver (nunyourbizniss@fu.com), January 18, 2003.

This will solve all your blurred projected picture problems. That is if you can get your hands on those lens??

http://www.dewtronics.com/tutorials/lasers/leot/course06_mod08/POWERCO RDSYS3MPDMORPHINGCOURSE06JpegsMOD6-8JPEGSFIG23.JPG

More info here:

http://www.dewtronics.com/tutorials/lasers/leot/course06_mod08/mod06- 08.html

-- Alvin (homeworkman@rogers.com), January 23, 2003.

Good product to make screen available UK; Plasti-Kote brilliant metallic spray paint, use over white primer, will need 3-4 cans over 3 sq. metres.

-- bk (bk@somewhere.com), January 30, 2003.

Some people said quite a while back, to put the 3x lens directly on the screen, what exactly do you mean by this?

-- Ollie (oliverhickmore2k@hotmail.com), February 03, 2003.

Did the project, read all the posts (yes I did) and I've got a question nobody's asked. I'm projecting off a flat-screen computer monitor which is very high resolution. As many of us know, DVD & video resolution is 620x480. So when you use a large monitor (I have 14 inch) it stretches the video to that size. Under the DVD player chioces you can view the "streatched" or the "normal", which is the 640 one. Would it be better for me to "zero in" on the 640x480 to get a truer image to project? Thoughts, comments?

-- Irma Vep (noemail@ekoo.com), February 03, 2003.

Hello to all, I am from Chile and am interested in building these things also with the lcd, I am about to get a very good price on fresnel page size for under US$1.50, I will tell you all as soon as I get it as I could send you the lenses and would be for less than $2 post included, could everyone send me information on the lcd and the tv plans and hints? also all pictures and drawings will be greatly appreciated. thank you all

-- Marcelo Arancibia (arancibia@terra.cl), February 04, 2003.

This site shows how to invert the picture of the tv:

http://geo cities.com/easton17066/screeninversion.html

You have to open up your tv, but if you are willing to do that, it works great, because you don't need any mirrors. There is also a diagram in this forum that shows the same thing.

-- Adam Salsberg (Adam@NtFF.com), February 06, 2003.

Looks like this discussion has been going on for years! Anyhow I built the "100-inch Television" and was pretty impressed considering I only shelled out like $15 bucks in supplies. The Apollo Page Magnifier from Office Depot works fine, and cost about $7 bucks. The rest is just cardboard and duct tape like all the free plans suggest. I didn't make a circular hole for the lens, instead I just attached the entire retangular lens and it seems to work pretty good. My ugly contraption uses a 13" tv turned to face the ceiling, and the two boxes sit on top of it, and then I attached a 12"x12" mirror (6-pack for $9 at Wal-Mart) with duct tape and wire clothes-hangers (so it is adjustable, and the tape acts as a hinge) and this acts to re-reverse the image. I have the older style pull- shades on my windows, so I just point it at a big picture window and pull the shade down. If the room is totally dark the picture is great, if you turn on a lamp you can still see it but it isn't comfortable viewing. My kids love watching cartoons on it (Shrek, Bob the Builder, Monsters Inc, etc), but I can't imagine trying to watch a dark movie on it (The Matrix, Dark City, etc). The project is definitely worth your time and the few dollars you'll invest. If you live in Alaska where it's dark for 6 months of the year this is a must....if you live in southern Florida it's still fun but don't expect it to become your full-time television.

-- Andrew Rausch (andrewrausch@yahoo.com), February 12, 2003.

I found a frensel lens at "Rite Aid" for about $2.50(US). It was in the school supply isle between the school supplies and the computer stuff. I took it home and it works perfectly. I hope to build a projector soon and have a page up by next month

-- Big J the King Pin (jtmnoxville@yahoo.com), February 14, 2003.

Does anyone have a master list of web pages that have projector (and other related projects) info I would apprecate it if you drop me a line

-- Big J the King Pin (jtmnoxville@yahoo.com), February 14, 2003.

I heard that black was a bad color to paint thge inside of the projectir, just some food for thaught. Maby someone could test this theory.

-- Big J the King Pin (jtmnoxville@yahoo.com), February 14, 2003.

check out my site jtmnoxville@yahoo.com), February 15, 2003.

check out my site href="http://www.geocities.com/jtmnoxville/Projection_TV.html

-- Big J the King Pin (jtmnoxville@yahoo.com), February 15, 2003.

ALRIGHT GUYS... HERE IS THE REAL STORY FROM SOMEONE WHO DID THIS FROM SCRATCH. I started this thing from scratch a couple days ago. I'm not going to give specific directions, because they are posted all over here but i'll tell you specifically what did work and what didn't work for me. Now, first of all... DON'T GET UR HOPES UP ON THIS project because the picture will not be as good as any TV, no matter how much you work on it yourself. The only thing that fools some people is that you can't see the lines or individual pixels on the screen when you are watching because they are sort of "blended in", but this also makes for a blurrier picture. I don't think I will be using this thing that much for that reason.

DON'T USE A MONITOR I started out using my 21" computer monitor messing around with that but that is NOOOO GOOD. The picture is not nearly bright enough to be able to enjoy. YOU HAVE TO USE A TV.

WHAT I USED: Starting I used a 13 inch tv and apollo fresnel lens (page magnifier) from office depot for $7. It's 8 1/2 by 11 inches. For the screen I used a shade from a window. This works far better than the wall as it is glossier and flat, therefore more reflective.

KEY POINTS: First, I made a box the size of my whole tv (so i could slide the whole tv in and out) and spray painted the inside black. The picture wasn't that great. HERE ARE THE KEYS: I found you have to seal all the cracks and stuff. Don't let any light leak out. you have to face the bumpy side of the magnifier towards the tv and flat side towards the wall or screen. Even doing this, the picture wasn't that great. I found the problem was the box I used was the size of the whole tv, not just the screen. You definitely need to tape a box together so its exactly the same size as the SCREEN (not the size of the whole tv) so you can fit it over the screen. Anyways.. After i made this the picture looked better than before. To hold it on good I used the other box that was the size of my TV to fit over my tv and the new box and sort of hold the new box in place (along with taping the new box onto the tv). This part is harder to explain but u can see in this pic: http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/boxes.jpg the outer box is in red.

I got pictures of what the actual picture on the screen looks like and of my projector. The picture is about 4 feet wide on the screen... keep in mind my camera is not that good so the pictures are very dark (sorry for that) but this is what i have. There aren't many other pages that put true pictures up of what the picture actually looks like though. Also, i took them in the day time with blankets over my window, so there was a little bit of extra light coming in my room. The red at the bottom of the pics is my alarm clock (its not part of what was displayed in the picture). here they are: (copy and paste them into a browser.. the JPG at the end is case sensitive i think).

http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/projector1.JPG http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/projector2.JPG http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/screen1.JPG http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/screen2.JPG http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/screen3.JPG http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/screen4.JPG http://www.geocities.com/bible_link/100inchtv/shade1.JPG

Something I didn't mention is i turned the tv upside down but didn't use a mirror, so words would be reversed. But, this still gives you an idea of what the picture looks like.

Hope this helps everyone. remember the key points and dont get too attached to this project because a TV is much better quality and much brighter. Also, it's very inconvenient to have to find room on your wall and not be able to sit in front of the projector. I think if you had a professional projector and a lot of extra space it would probably be worth it (over a regular HDTV). But this just isn't professional. Very fun though for just $7. (lucky me i didn't waste money on buying directions)

-- Bob (bible_link@hotmail.com), February 15, 2003.

hi i am still kinda scetchy about this. i mean it isn't a lot of money. but i don't know if it will actually work? i don't think i have a big enough wall for this.:-( it seems like a neat project though. please reply back and help! thanks, james

-- James (jamnsports@comcast.net), February 17, 2003.

I have read the post and it has taked about 8 hours. There are some brilliant ideas. I can only recommend spending hours researching sites like this to gather as much information then test test test.

I have built a few of these projectors and have found..

1, Buy a good quality lens ($15 Australian) as a guide. 2, Black paint is good felt is better.( inside of the projector) 3, an additional flap over the front of the projector will improve contrast will a hole about 1/2 the size of the lens hole 4, As the TV screen ration is 4:3 so your lens panel should reflect this 5, Use a real projection screen a basic home theatre one is $120 Australian (Matte white Magnesium carbonate)

A Mag/cbnte screen when a torch is shinned on it reflects all the light back, that is the least you need.

Go to dalite site and request information about screens. They have an ubundace of information to help you set up.

-- PMD (jkillalea@railaccess.com.au), February 17, 2003.

ues white instead if blakk inside the box

-- Big J the King Pin (jtmnoxville@yahoo.com), February 17, 2003.

- Use at least a 19 inch TV. - Use only 1 GLASS lense/carefully alter your TV's wiring to flip the screen. - Use a quality "bevelled" mirror. - lay TV on it's back, screen facing the ceiling- BY THE WAY, if you want to flip your TV or lay it on it's back then to be sure you might as well let it sit in the new position all night and then plug back in and turn on. Put mirror at 45 degree angle and your picture will be forwards and it should be pretty bright - It seems like you wouldn't want the insides of the box to reflect, so black spraypaint on wood (not sprayed thick enough to shine) might be the best route. anyone ever seen the inside of a camera? Take apart a cheapo 110 camera. you'll see this substance on the metal that is black, but doesn't shine much. Any idea what this stuff is, or where to get it? I bet it would be optimal for this project. - Make sure the lense is as large as you can find. AT LEAST the size of your screen.

-- Robmeister (keepthecmd@yahoo.com), February 21, 2003.

WOW!!!!! I just received my 7.5 inch plano lens from the Surplus Shed (see messages posted above for more info). UNBELIEVABLE DIFFERENCE! I thought the picture was pretty good with my Apollo Page Magnifier from Office Depot, but it was nothing compared to this. The lens cost a total of $27.50 ($22.50 + $5 shipping) and makes my crappy cardboard projector work as well as one of the cheaper commercial big screens. It's actually a better picture than the bigscreen at the tavern down the street (old reverse projection type). I've noticed that I have to move it further from the screen than I did with the fresnel lens, but it is WAY brighter and clearer.

-- Andrew Rausch (arausch@lydig.com), February 21, 2003.

I just finished reading this forum and it took 3 hours. Wow

I am going to consider this as a hobby thing to do during my freetime (not expecting any quality or brightness) instead of homework (college student), actually just something to do on a weekend.

A few things to note nVidia has a function in their detonator drivers

that allows you to use your gForce Video card to change the orientation of your screen (rotate and stuff including brightness and GAMMA <-- Makes a difference I heard)

I am also probably going to write a little program dedicated to rotating and reversing the screen output of your computer. (not + though)

This forum has been very helpful and I have acquired a great deal of links and faqs being answered.

I have a few ideas to incorporate and will let you know if they turn out. I also will try to document with pictures this whole thing through. Including actual projection shots (even if they totally suck and turn out black). For taking pictures I will also try different exposure and iso settings on my digital camera. I have a nice high quality digital camera I will probably use.

Send me an message via email or icq.

UIN: 2640310

Email: ProjectorForumPost@Highsupport.com

I think this will also make a great content for another domain name I own but havent been able to come up with an idea for content with.

Also I ordered about 5 3x fresnel lens online for about $1.35USD each plus $5 total shipping.

They should arrive soon.

PS I am planning on using Pizza Boxes, and possibly not aiming for a 100" image but a smaller brighter image.

Another idea is I have a small tv designed for a car 5.5" that gets pretty bright, I might see what I can get out of that.

I know the disclaimers and risks and "quotes of being stupid" but

this could lead to something one of these days, even if it is just experience of trial and error with constructing simple optics.

Anything you can learn and be entertained (in building) from is not stupid it is perservariance.

A9 My A-Z, 0-9 box

0Z any misspelling

----shoud have mispelled

----characteres swapped

----out with something

----in the boxes range

-- Locka Gomez (lika thats my real name) (ProjectorForumPost@Highsupport.com), March 01, 2003.

I just read up on inverting the screen via software and have decided not to write a program to do it.

What I have found is it would require a adapter driver to be written,

and in order for it to be universal and not video card specific I need to write a standard SVGA with no enhancements. I am going to keep with the nVidia nvRotate. It flips and mirrors the screen and tvout for me. It just requires a nVidia GPU.

-- Locka Gomez (lika thats my real name) (ProjectorForumPost@Highsupport.com), March 02, 2003.

I've been trying to figure out how to solve the problem of the projector projecting an upside-down, backward image.... instead of using a regular mirror, and wrecking your tv by turning it upside- down, wouldn't a slightly concave mirror fix the whole problem?

-- Mark S. (mark_s10@hotmail.com), March 03, 2003.

to fix the upside down thing, why not use three lens, it will probably fix ur problem, and it will go right on ur wall, no flipping upside down or anything!!

-- not telling (dontemailmeplease@bpau.cjb.net), March 06, 2003.

I JUST FOUND THIS TODAY AND I WANNA BUILD IT IM FROM THE UK AND I CANT FIND ANYWHERE THAT I CAN BUY A FRESNAL LENSE CAN ANYONE HELP?

-- MATTY (MATTYP@PYTTAM.FSNET.CO.UK), March 09, 2003.

I built my first projection tv out of cardboard and a page magnifier. the results were ok, so i decided to build a better one. Using black foam board(can be found at any k-mart or wal-mart for $3 a sheet) duct tape, and a 7 1/2" lens from www.surplusshed.com. It was $22, $28 with s/h. but the picture quality was much better. the only problem is it does have enough light, which seems to be everyones problem. hopefully i can find an answer.

-- derek (derek.smarsh@Verizon.net), March 11, 2003.

HELLO DERIK <> Yes, enough light is always going to be a problem... Not surprizing, when you consider what you are doing when you increase the image size dramatically... For instance, if you are using a 13" TV as your source, its screen is about .7 sq. feet, and you enlarge this, to say, a 10 ft X 7.5 ft image, which is 75 sq. ft, you would be enlarging the image about 107 times... This means that each sq. ft. of the larger image would receive less than 1% of the light that the original has... You can reduce your image size, which will put a larger % of the available light in a given area, or use a more reflective screen surface, or BOTH... A matte white screen has a gain factor of 1.0 (Calcium Carbonate as reference) and the most reflective aluminized and/or glass beaded screen has a gain factor of 2.5... If you are using a white/light colored wall as your screen surface, it will probably have a reflective factor of less than 1.0... So, the image size and the screen surface are the only options to increasing the net screen light, assuming you are running your source (TV) at its optimum brightness, contrast, and color levels, and that you are projecting directly from the source, rather than with mirrors (which have a loss factor, as well) AND that everything in the light path is sqeaky CLEAN... You may also want to double check for any ambient light intrusion, which would detract from the low level of light available... The lens you are using seems to be the best that is available, and I just ordered one for the project I am planning... I plan on building a screen to hang on my wall with 1" framing and a face of 1/8" (Masonite) hardboard... I hope to be able to cover the face with aluminum foil (matte side out) which is the best combination of reflectivity and focusable surface I have found... Foil is somewhat fragile, and difficult to work with, but it is ideal as a screen surface... I plan to build the screen curved in the horizontal plane to mirror the curve of the screen of the 13" TV monitor I will be using as a light source... The 5x3.33 ft screen I am planning will be curved outwards 4" at the R&L sides, which mirrors the curve of the TV's picture tube, enlarged to the size of the screen... This should help the focus in the horizontal plane tremendously... It would be ideal to also curve the screen vertically to mirror the (less dramatic) verticle curve of the picture tube face, but the problems involved in building a compound curved surface, and covering it with foil make this option beyond what is reasonable... I will mask the top and bottom of the picture tube face slightly, cropping it to project an image with a 1.5 to 1 aspect ratio, a compromise which will eliminate the most severe part of the curve, and match the space constraints of where my screen will be located... The 1.5 to 1 screen should still be satisfactory for full frame (1.33 to 1) projection and more closely resemble the 9x16 (1.78 to 1) format which is increasing being used, and will eliminate at least part of the focus problems in the verticle plane... I will also add 4 to 6 inches of flat black masking all around the screen to have a nice clean edge for the picture and contrast the screen to its surroundings... Hope some of the preceeding will be of help to you... Just for the fun of it, take a couple of feet of foil off the roll and tape it to your screen (matte side facing you) in several locations... I think you will be amazed in the difference in light reflection, contrast and color... ;-}

-- Old Tinkerer (scorpio3k@webtv.net), March 11, 2003.

HELLO DEREK... Sorry about mis-spelling your name!... AND, I want to clear up what may be a confusing statement about screen curvature... The screen should curve TOWARDS the viewer at the edges, that is, be CONCAVE... The electron gun in the CRT is also a projector, and is projecting electrons onto the fluoresent coating inside the screen... So, the edges of the screen are further from the source than the center is, and the edges have to be brought closer to the source to be equidistant: focus is a function of distance... That's why the CRT is shaped as it is, and we are actally observing the BACK side of the screen from the source's (electron gun's) point of the view... Hmmmm, this gets confusing when put on paper, but it's the facts, Jack!

-- Old Tinkerer, Again... (scorpio3k@webtv.net), March 11, 2003.

ok, i'm starting to think that the design itself is not the problem of darkness, but the screen, i first have it on a plain white wall, and got ok results. I tried alumminum foil, and it seemed to do nothing. I just bought blackout cloth(buy at any fabric store),and got the same results. I would like to see how it would look on a siler or glass beaded screen, but don't want to pay the cash. If i spend $100 on a lcd screen on ebay and it doesn't work, i'll be pissed. Anyone try it out yet?

-- Derek (Derek.Smarsh@Verizon.net), March 11, 2003.

Is that the lens that you bought? And the best one to use?

7-1/2” DIAM BY 20” FL PCX LENS Item No.: L2152 Optical glass plano convex lens 7-1/2” diameter by 500mm focal length (19.7”). This will make a super wide field magnifier. You could build a stand to hold it and you can easily view an entire 8- 1/2” X 11” paper magnified and quite flat. Of course, if you were able to find the correct Flint lens of this size with the correct parameters, you’d have a dynamite telescope objective (we don’t have any at present that we know of).

Price: $22.50

-- entity (satellite_expert@hotmail.com), March 12, 2003.

------------------------------------------------------------------- Hello, I am working on a site for these projectors. It will have a collection of detailed instructions acquired from many sources, Pictures, and more.

As of now I have a few pictures taken of a quickly put together projector (done in 5 min).

I also have an a few actual pictures of the layout.

the site is http://www.edgeofinfinity.com ------------------------------------------------------------------- AIM SN: A1M5Y50P

-- Zinna Pro (ProjectionTV@edgeofinfinity.com), March 15, 2003.

Here's something for the moderator of this board to consider: This message string has become so long that it takes an eternity to reach the recent posts... Would it be possible to change the format so that the recent posts are listed FIRST, instead of last... [Sorry, no. -moderator] In other words, listed in reverse order... There is some very good information on here, as well as a lot of pure nonsense, and it would be a shame to lose the good stuff, but this thing looks ready to collapse from the sheer weight of all the posts you have to go through to get to the recent ones!... What do YOU think, folks?

-- Old Tinkerer (scorpio3k@webtv.net), March 17, 2003.

Hello,I wanted to if someone knew where to get the screen that covers the lens on my big screen it is scratched,would think it comes in rolls and could be cut to size. thanx.

-- joe matthews (joe_janice65536@yahoo.com), March 17, 2003.

I found this add for 100" tv on ebay and after searchin the web found i could get lens at a department store (page magnifier) i built a cardboard box and after a few adjustments (like putting the rough side of the lens facing in ((i dunno it just seemed to work better)).. I had sucsess with 1 catch . the center of the screen was perfect,bright and clear however the picture seemed to go more out of focus around the edge of the picture .

has anyone figured a way to fix this problem ???

i am using a plastic lens ,could this be the problem ??

do u still get the same problem with a glass 1 ??

i tried to find a glass 1 .but they r very hard to find :( would a curved screen fix the problem ??

is it just a simple fact u cant get a complete focussed picture using this method of projection ??

Please help ..

-- sandman (sandman1@dodo.com.au), March 21, 2003.

ok my bad ...i missed some of the posts that answered some of my questions already... i messed around with this thing again lastnight. if it wasn't for the fact the middle of the screen is so clear and bright then i would have givin up on this thing already. if i could just get the outer picture to focus i would be a happy man. freakin thing .. ive been thinking mabey if i curve the lens to a similar shape as the tv screen .(its not a flat screen tv mabey thats why i lose focus. but then the wall would need to be curved to also huh ? i feel so close yet ive hit a wall..

-- sandman (sandman1@dodo.com.au), March 21, 2003.

www.100inchtv.8m.com

its not that difficult

-- brandon (a@a.com), March 22, 2003.

Ok I've just bought a fresnel lens, it wil be arriving in a couple of days. Also I have just found this site. Why is there so much random info up here? Why do some people say they have a fantastic workin tv, and others say they cant even get a picture?? Please someone give me the facts.

-- Rob Dalton (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), March 27, 2003.

Also is anyone planning a 3rd birthday celebration for the question at the top of the page.

-- Rob (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), March 27, 2003.

Just thought i'd let u know that this page is 173 pages long in Word, and contains 83,000 words.

-- rob (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), March 28, 2003.

wow...I just read the whole thing and through about 11 hours of straight research (including reading this), I'm glad I ordered the fresnel lens. Post-inverting the image, I will repost to give results for any inquiring eyes. JoeShmoe

-- JoeShmoe (joeshmoe@world.com), March 28, 2003.

Hey everyone I have a wicked site that has a bunch of free plans on it. Some of the ones off of Ebay. My site is www.projector100inch.tk I just added Bryans projector guide onto it. Also visit http://groups.msn.com/DIYprojectionTV they have some good discussions.

-- I love Lessies (scott_groenwold@hotmail.com), March 29, 2003.

Hey u lot I've just completed my first (I must admit VERY badly made) projector using the simple box and lens method. I have to say even thought the construction is crap, I am getting amazing results already.

I am using a slide projector projection screen, It was my Dads from the 70's, and I beleive that may be improving the image brightness.

Anyone new to this page and thinking of building one of these I HIGHLY RECCOMEND. Its far better than i thought it would be, so dont listen to all these people who say they can't get an image, just keep messin around you'll get there in the end!!!!

-- Rob Dalton (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), March 30, 2003.

It took me a week to find this website but yesterday i foind it and last night i built my own. however instead of using a fresnel lens i used a round glass magnifing glass off of one of those desklamps thingys. It works good except its just a little dark, The left + right is backwards, (its kinda difficult to play x-box on), and the outsides are fuzzy. but other than that i recomend building one. it took me about a half hour. I could also send you pictures if you want. jdietschweiler@yahoo.com

-- john (jdietschweiler@yahoo.com), April 04, 2003.

Ive just ran into this site while looking at some auction i found on ebay. After 2 hours of skimming through looking at peoples responses ive decided to try this. Im currently studdying electronics in college and ill ask tomarro if theres anyway possible to boost the brightness/contrast past the point of onscreen adjustment. Btw does anyone know if if this will work with a 31 inch tv i have extra one laying around and dont wanna mess with the 19

-- Zach Nelson (nelsonzach1979@yahoo.com), April 07, 2003.

Zach. To get best results, the smaller the TV the better. Also, you dont have to turn your T.V. upside down, you can have it on it's back, facing up, and use a mirror at 45* on top to get a wall projection.

I would like to hear if you have any 'bright' ideas on increasing contrast/brightness, however as long as you have the lights turned off, you get a great picture, it's like watching thye TV on the wall.

Email me if you want any info, I just built my first one a week or so ago and its working great.

-- Rob Dalton (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), April 07, 2003.

to solve all your inside out problems you can make the tv sit straight down then hit a 45 degree mirror then hit the lense and the immage will be as if you were looking at the tv itself. Also you can keep it flat an make it hit the lense then hit the 45 degree mirror to put the image on the celing. I find this nice if you don't have room on you wall. I have got results of 9 feet this way.

If you want to see pictures and instructions of this go to www.100inchtv.8m.com its a great site that will make it easy to build and understand how it works. HIGHLY RECOMMENDED

www.100inchtv.8m.com check it out. peace

-- b (boarderbm@yahoo.com), April 08, 2003.

the key in everyones building is using a mirror, or three mirrors owever you see necessary. by doing that it flips the immage and makes it correctly viewed.

its all at www.100inchtv.8m.com

-- b (boaderbm@yahoo.com), April 08, 2003.

I tried with the Staples page magnifier, with sketchy results (Bad overall focus). I bought a 7.5" glass lens at the suggestion of a previous message on this site. The results from testing have been very good so far. The image can be sharply focused. I'll post more results when I have finished the project. I HIGHLY RECOMMEND THE GLASS LENS OVER THE STAPLES STYLE PAGE MAGNIFIER! ($27.50 for me with shipping)

See message: entity (satellite_expert@hotmail.com), March 12, 2003.

-- Sydney (sfoster@valint.net), April 11, 2003.

Hi people, first of all i have to say this is the most amazing dedicated message post i have ever read on the net. I am glad i bumped into it (by chance). I have just made my projector. I got the fresnel lense from 3DLense.com. When i got it, i took a look through it and noticed it wasnt of great quality and portions of the lense were a little distorted. It costs just $1.79 here. But that didnt dissapoint me. I first made the entire thing using old cardboard boxes just to get the idea of the image i can get. My immediate conclusion was that the picture will never match the quality of a professional projector system and no one should ever expect this in this project. The image is not fully sharp, especially near the corners (I have a flat screen monitor). The image is just bright enough with the monitor brightness and contrast cranked all the way up. I then constructed the whole thing using 4mm thick plywood as mentioned in the BigWoody design i found on the net. Its a pretty neat design. I modified the design further to hold a mirror at 45* angle sideways just outside the lense and inverted the monitor. The image improved slightly from my cardboard box version but not fully. I suspect its my projector screen since i was projecting on to my wall which is a little bumpy texture. I guess the image will improve if i use a semi glossy shower curtain or something like that (I tried a small piece of glossy white wood laminate sheet and the brightness improved significantly). But it still never focuses completely and i am pretty certain that the the cheap lense is the culprit and think that a glass lense will give u a huge improvement. Do ppl make higher quality fresnel lenses with optical quality acrylic material? that would be really great. plus a front coated mirror too would improve the focus since back coated mirrors will have 2 reflections. My next version would be with a better fresnel lense, a front coated mirror and a better screen to project on. I will also try using a TV instead of my computer monitor. Will defenitely update this post when thats done.

Anyways to conclude, this project is real fun and you should remember that this is not a serious projector system but something fun and at the same time quite a productive thing to enjoy for a home project. Just make sure all ur optics - your TV/monitor screen, the lense, the mirror and your projector screen are all perfectly parallel..... and oh yeah...keep this post going..

Cheers HaRi

-- Hari (harinl@indiatimes.com), April 11, 2003.

I read this forum for hours, and a lot of good Ideas. I'm just in the beginning stages of making a projector for my 13" tv.

Here is a site I found that has a ton of LCD projects, Virtual Reality, Flight Simulators, and how to build a nice, quality screen.

http://www.godrules.net/LCD.htm

-- Kevin (kvonmc6@aol.com), April 15, 2003.

Well, I finished a cheap cardboard project and it turned out great. It only took me 20 min. to pull it off. I’m using my wall for the screen and it works great for cartoons and video games.

My picture is upside-down, what do I do?????? Just kidding, I couldn’t resist, I think that question is the answer to why the forum is so long. I saw that question a hundred times.

But on a serious note, I have my 13” tv flipped upside-down, I had the power off and unplugged for hours. I put my tv on aux channel (all blue screen) to test if the colors work, but I get a little bit of purple in the middle. It’s not to noticeable when it’s projected, but I’m wondering if keeping my tv this way is going to cause permanent effects. Could someone give me a little insight on this?

I will be starting my quality projector soon, I’ll keep everyone posted with the results, and new ideas. Thanks, Kevin

-- Kevin (kvonmc@aol.com), April 16, 2003.

After days and days of research, I have finally completed this project. What I used:

8.5"x12" Magnifying Lens (Fresnal) $5.50 Cardboard FREE Black flat spraypaint $0.96 Duct Tape $3.00

All this was under $15. I used a 13" PC monitor, built the cardboard projector, and set the lense in place... I thought I would be playing my PS2 on a nice bright 100 inch. Yes AND no. The picture is too dim, even in a pitch black room. The cause is probabley beacause I am using a PC monitor. The other downside is that the screen is flipped backwards. That's not a problem. With a mirror or two, problem is fixed.

All in all I conclude... Good project, will not replace TV (unless picture brightness is fixed) fun to build... Some blurriness may occur. THIS INFO is coming from a PC monitor. If using a regular tv, picture and brightness would probably increas by 10%. for 10-15$, go for it. There are people experimenting on making the picture better quality. This project can become a real success after time. If there is anyone else tyring to make this project for video game use, email me at xxsicpuppyxx@yahoo.com for questoins or just to experiment on this project.

NOTE TO EVERYONE: Lets all try to focus on making a BRIGHTER picture...

-- SiC (xxsicpuppyxx@yahoo.com), April 22, 2003.

Im going to give this a shot and post some images of my results, since noone has actually shown the finished products quality.

-- Paul (a@b.com), April 24, 2003.

And we approach the 3rd birthday of the "100 inch TV" question. Anyone planning a 100inch tv convention where we can all sit in the dark and watch things on a big screen and laugh at all the people whoi spend their hard-earned cash on a decent projector.

I wish i was rich.

-- Rob Dalton (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), April 26, 2003.

Does anyone know how a real projector works???, like you know the ones in the cinema??? I belive the main flaws in the idea are the brightness problem and the focus problem, The brightness problem is impossible to solve, if the picture from say a 28" tv is right and you make the picture x3 bigger then the brightness will simply be 3x less, plus the loss of light sticking lense's in the way and the the loss of light to the elements when you shine the image over the distance to the screen. The focus is a problem due to a curved screen and a flat lense, therefore the picture will only focus either the centre point or a ring of the picture will be focus and the rest of the picture will be out of focus, therefore the ONLY solution would be to use a flat screen but then you still have the problem with the brightness, and no, the ideas to paint the walls of the projector white will NOT work, white surfaces absord the light made reduceing the brightness and also reflect the light making the picture comletely CRAP. Think back to Physics at school cause thats all this is. I suggest basing the idea on a cinema projector, i.e. using a high resoultion lcd projection panel, an extremley bright light, a round projector lense, and a glass feznel lense. Place the light behind a piece of glass to prevent the heat generated by the lamp damaging the lcd panel. This heat will also need some form of venting to allow it to dissperce, then place the lcd panel in front of the glass and the freznel lense on the lcd panel this will the make the image go smaller into a round lense which you could bounce into however many mirors you like to get the picture where ever you want it to go, then when you have the image pointing the correct way then use another lense to project the image onto the screen, the focus would be perfect as the starting image is flat as well as the first lense and if the two round lense's are also the same then they will cancel each other out resulting in a perfect picture, also the brightness problem is resolved as if that still isn't bright enough for you, simply buy a brighter bulb. And yes loss of light is still you enemy and yes all the interior of the projector still needs to be painted matt black. I admit this way will cost more than the £15 quoted by the scam artists on ebay but it will be ALOT more usable, satisfiying and MUCH better quality and will cost a hell of alot less than actually buying a projector from the shops. Well i hope this helps anyone out there planning on making there own projector on the cheap but theres really no point in trying to make your tv a projector, the idea is fundamentally flawed and the idea has been around for years and no one has ever made a brilliant one, or if they have, i've never seen it, and will quite happily eat my words if i see one better than the one i describe making. REMEMBER : A TV IS NOT MEANT TO BE A PROJECTOR, ITS MEANT TO BE A TV.

-- Timon (cheekiestpaul@hotmail.com), May 08, 2003.

Taking the screen of your tv or monitor spike would do absolutley nothing but break your tv or monitor, probably give u a severve dose of sulphur poisioning and is generally not a very good idea.

A TV or MOnitor works by fireing elctrons extremly quickly at the screen, these electrons then react to the sulphur in the screen, hence giving you a picture, DO NOT Attempt to take the screen off your TV or monitor, you'll only end up crying in hospital being very ill, and have to come back home to a broken TV or Monitor.

Sorry to break the news to ya but thats just the way it is lol.

ONCE again, repeat after me, A TV IS NOT MEANT TO BE A PROJECTOR, ITS MEANT TO BE A TV.

-- Timon (cheekiestpaul@hotmail.com), May 11, 2003.

BTW i hope i haven't killed this forum, what a 3rd bithday eh? lol

-- Timon (cheekiestpaul@hotmail.com), May 11, 2003.

Timon have u actually made one of these?? I put one together and its great! I do expect some people are under the illusion (thanks to the ebay 'scammers') that the projector works in daylight and gives you a big bright 100" picture, which of course it doesnt, i do however have a 50" by about 40" screen which works absolutely great at night, and if you have it hooked up to a sound system movies are fantastic, as are computer games.

A note to everyone new... upside down tv at 90* to wall + mirror at 45* = result. Dont listen to the bullshit!

-- Rob Dalton (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), May 12, 2003.

Rob... what size tv are you using, and which lens?

-- El Curio (nurhadi@gogo.net.au), May 12, 2003.

Curio.. Im using a 14" portable tv and a normal plastic fresnel lens, or page magnifier whatever you want to call it. If you want to email me you can, make sure you say "100inch Tv" in the subject.

-- Rob Dalton (rob_dalton@hotmail.com), May 13, 2003.

Well, I'm another guy that try to get not a 100 in, but a decent 50 in Proyection. I still haven't my fresnel lens, but i was thinking: I have an old proyector of, well I don't know how to said in english, the small square films(pictures?), that are static, but that are transparent and you proyect it with the help of a very potent ligth. Anyway, the proyector have three lenses: One very flat-convexe, other flat, but a little green, the other is flat-less convexe (the firs one is almost 1.5 inches tall!) then it comes the film and in the end, a lens that I can focus. When i see through this lens, I can see the image inverted, and a little far, but I want to know if somebody has try to use this kind of lenses to invert the image of the proyector, after the fresnel. THis is to avoid lose my time trying to do it, and try to finde a better solution.

Thank you all

Adi Corrales

-- Adi Corrales (adicm@prodigy.net.mx), May 21, 2003.

I love this board - just had to say it.

The brightness solution! --> if your dedicated.

1)Determine the position on you wall of the final projection. ie: Get it focused, and get the dimensions how you like. 2)Frame out this section with molding or black paint. Paint the screen area with reflective road paint. This can be pricey, but shop around. Lowes or Home Depot should have it. 3) Paint the rest of the room flat black.

Brightness is relative. As most have pointed out, the picture is best when the room is dark. It is much much better when it is the only bright area in the room. White walls and ceiling will reflect much of the peripheral light from the monitor, diffusing the target area. The only thing you want light you want reflected is the screen. Think of a professional cinema; the only white thing in it is the screen - everything else is flat and dark - they even use fabric on the walls to absorb more light and sound. You will be AMAZED at the improvement this makes. If you are not hardcore enough to paint your room flat black (it's worth it - esp if you buy a real projector in the future) then try buying many yards of black fabric and making cutains that you can draw over the wall surface. The object is to absorb as mush peripheral light (light not hitting the projection area) as possible. The rest is tinkering, but you have to have the right environment first.

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 24, 2003.

I forgot to add that instead of reflective paint, you can pick up one of those roll up projection screens like you used to use for your super 8. You can make this look pretty pro if you cut the size you need and frame it all out.

Long live DIY! Love live cheap-skates like us!

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 24, 2003.

Ok - a slight mod to increase brightness and resolution.

1) build a projector as described in previous posts, using fresnel lens - Let's say you have a 16" diagonal tv tube. 2) focus it 3) measure the focul length(f) from the tv tube to the lens.

Now your going to build a new box, but it is not going to have parallel sides. The sides will be trapazoids. The parallel sides will meet the tv tube and the lens. The angled sides will be the focul length. 1)Cut one piece of card board with one parallel measuring 8.5" (end A). This is a vertical piece. 2)the other parallel of this piece should measure the height of your screen- end B - (about 9.5" if you have a 16" diagonal). 3) Note that the 8.5" end is centered. The resulting angles from either side of end A to end B should be equivilant. 4)Make another exactly like it. (the best way to do this may be to draw a straight line the height of tv tube. Divide it in half. Use either a compass construction or a builder's square to make a perpendicular - (right angle) - line the distance of your focul length. Measure a line 4.25" perpendicular to the left, and one 4.25" perpendicular to the right of the center line. Cut outside lines) 4)Cut the next piece of cardboard with end A being 11". End B should be the width of your tv tube (roughly 13.25" on a 16" diagonal tv tube) keeping in mind #3. 5) Make another just like it. 6) Put the painted pieces together with duct tape - it should look something like a squared-off highway cone or bull horn when you are done. Affix the lens to the small end. If you use tape to do this, make sure you cover little of the lens, and do so evenly.. Affix the large end to the tv tube. A fringe of bristles or many strips of black paper may be used as a light block on the outside where the tube hits the box. A fabric skirt works well also (think old-school photography here.) 7) your still left with an inverted image. If desired. Modify your design to include 6" long rectangular extensions on each side. In this box extenstion, place you 45* angled mirror below or above the lens, depending on your tv angle. - through out this project, keep in your mind the image of those projector keychains from the 70's and 80's. They were tiny little things with a lens in one end and a photo in the other. When you held it up to the light and looked through, the picture look enourmous. This is the same principle, only the tv is providing the light. The shape is going to help conserve light loss by reducing surface area, and focus more of it on the lens. If you are careful, I think you will be impressed with the result. This meathod works especially well with the 7.5" glass lens. Just remember - you want as little cardboard as possible.

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 24, 2003.

Yet more mods.

Cone and Tube. Make a cone box as described above, but this time, use the 7.5" lens. Find a 7.5" tube. Place a second 7.5 inch lens inside of its end. The picture should now have been reversed twice. This means it should appear exactly as it would if looking at the tv alone. You will need to adjust the distance between lenses to refocus, but you should actually be able to focus a bit more accurately. Coming up - how to make a back-lit display.

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 24, 2003.

Don't mean to take over - just excited.

I built the above projector over the weekend. Instead of leaving the entire 8.5x11" lens exposed, I painted all but a cd sized cirlce in the middle. This brought the image into much better focus. I also used a projector screen which made the image brighter. Instead of using mirrors to righten the image, I found that my video card enables display rotation. That made it simple. I also found that by making the screen black, using DivX in compact mode, and reducing picture size all help to bring the film into sharper focus. Another trick that helps is to bend the lens in, so that from the outside, it is concave. since you can block a large portion of the lens, this can be accomplished by placing an eye bolt (small type) in the center of the lens. use a small washer so as not to leave any exposed holes in the lens. cut a coat hanger and push it through the body of the projector. run a string from bolt to hanger in a loop. that way you can wind something up in the loop to increase the bowl of the lens, and thereby adjusting focus.

On a side note: with a full screen movie on a standard 19" tv, I was able to get an image about 7' wide by about 4' tall on my white wall in the darkened livingroom. I used the above design with the masked lens. I highly reccommend the lens mask - it cuts out the lens edges which make the picture blurry, and does not eliminate any of the picture.

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 27, 2003.

Hi everybody,

Does any one know where can I get a 6X lens for this projector. Right now i have just one 2X full page magnifier from staples. your response will bw highly appreciated.

Thanks S

-- SPS (smohal@vt.edu), May 29, 2003.

Hey, just wondering if anyone has set up a two lens box, supposedly sharper focus is avaiable. I just ordered one and im putting it together in about a week or whenever it gets here, lol. Next time i'll try and find a glass one. thx

-- Mark the Jerkoff (j3rkoff69@yahoo.com), May 30, 2003.

SBS, here is a link for an 11" sqaure fresnel for $4.99 I think I am going to pick this one up and give it a shot. It is for overhead projectors and is MUCH sharper and more effecient than the 8.5"x11"

-- (tornomens@excite.com), May 31, 2003.

Guess it would help if I added the link;

http://www.sciencekit.com/products/Display.cfm?categoryid=323413

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 31, 2003.

on this page there is a fresnel 38"x50"!!! now that would do the trick! http://www.alltronics.com/lenses.htm

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 31, 2003.

high quality fresnels

http://www.edmundoptics.com/IOD/DisplayProduct.cfm?Productid=2042

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 31, 2003.

a 12"x12" fresnel for $30! http://people.eecs.ku.edu/~astaples/projector/lensinfo_fresnel12x12.ht m

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 31, 2003.

this is the best projector site i've seen

http://people.eecs.ku.edu/~astaples/projector/index.htm

-- tim (tornomens@excite.com), May 31, 2003.

I have tryed a monitor but the image was to dim the colour was lost so I tryed the tv (but only have a 21", so can't put it on the back) the image was great just upside down and inverted. I've try mirrors but haven't got it right on the wall (cailing was right way). But back to the monitor, someone said that monitors with energy savers cut out the amount of light being projected from the screen how do I turn this off (using XP). Alos does anyone have a mirror box that works.

-- Aaron B (bell_familynz@yahoo.co.nz), May 31, 2003.

My image is always blurry on the edges. I am using a 8-1/2" x 11" page magnifier I bought at Office Max. Any suggestions on what I can do to improve the picture? Thanks.

-- Brady Nock (brady8714@hotmail.com), June 02, 2003.

Its all so easy. You guys have turned this site into a very complicated issue. Just keep it simple and that will elliminate all of your problems.

want an easy design?

want it fast?

just go to www.100inchtv.8m.com

this doesn' have to be difficult people!

-- brandon (boarderbm@yahoo.com), June 03, 2003.

I've just ordered some Fresnel Lenses from http://www.3dlens.com/enter.html?target=Fresnel_Lens.html - only $1.79 for a 7"x10" 3x lens.

Going to start building when they arrive.

I've got a nvidia geforce graphics card, just installed new drivers which include a feature called 'Keystone' which allows you to correct the image, in realtime, when it looks like a trapezoid.

This page might also be helpful on correcting distortions: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=9339

-- Xila (al_segno@hotmail.com), June 10, 2003.

I JUST FOUND A WHOLE LOT OF FRENSEL LENS AT A DOLLAR STORE!!!!! Savings or what~

-- Jorge (jorgetaz1@aol.com), June 11, 2003.

HI, is there anyone from phoenix who tried the 100"TV and got success. I would like to visit and see the results as i am not able to get the good image. thanks

-- sudra (chitturao@yahoo.com), June 14, 2003.

Hi,

Why not you Guys reverse the Horizontal and Verticial Deflection Coil Connections to Tilt the Image .. Let me try to Magnify my 14' TV picture to 40 inches Display it is Enough for me.. Let you kow once i get Fresnel Lens , 1. You can Use Black paper sheet which is used as Insulator in Electric motor winding shops. , 2. You Can use white Mylar Sheet which we will get in Electric motor winding shops. - Sumitha from India.

-- Sumitha (sumitha22@rediffmail.com), June 17, 2003.

guys, dont use fresnel lenses! i have 8 x 11 inch fresnel, and 4 inch glass lens, and picture is much, much, much brighter with glas lens, although it is much smaller then fresnel. glass is much better! second, focal lenth of lens must be at least 1,5 x screen diagonal! that will reduce blur very much! has anyone tried to make projector with those new tv with realy flat screens (sony wega, samsung plano, lg flatron)? with such tv, and apropriate lens there would be no blur and other problems!!!

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), June 20, 2003.

Just thought I would let people who keep turning their monitors upside down that their is no need to do this there is a codec out there turns divx movies or whatever video files you are playing upside down although I forgot which one it was it was something like gs400 or sumthing like that anyway search for it and try it out.

-- skander (berryhillguy@yahoo.co.uk), June 20, 2003.

PC users found it install the NIMO BUILD 9 CODEC PACK and make sure its the full installation and not the basic one this should make at least your divx movies upside down you can find at http://nimo.titanesk.com

bye

-- skander (berryhillguy@yahoo.co.uk), June 20, 2003.

Hi everybody,

Originally I've found the 100inchTVthing on Ebay, but I thought there should be a 'free' version of this... :)
Then I've found this site a week ago. Then other 'free' links. Great!
Now, with these informations in hand I can start to work on my version of this project.

Originally I wanted to make an LCD-projector using an LCD-panel plus lightsource plus all the bells and whistles it needs.
But this 'project the TV's picture itself onto the wall'-idea sounds so simple that I've decided to play around with this first.
I've ordered some Fresnel lenses and I've made some preliminary experiments without building any boxes and so. I guess it'll work, but we shouldn't wait for the picture quality of the professional projectors or cinemas.

So, I've started to think before act.

As I thought and read, there are some problems to solve, like brightness, sharpness, focusing, upside-down picture.

Brightness:
I didn't wait the picture will have the same brightness on the wall as on the TV. Simple physics: there are losses of light. We want as small loss as possible.
First, loss between the CRT and the lens: there is some-more distance between the CRT and the lens. The light will weaken a bit while it arrives to the lens, it'll interfere with some bounced lights etc. I don't know if it's a good idea to make the 'main' box to a pyramid shape. I guess there will be bouncing light inside (on the walls of) the box. These bounced rays of light will arrive to the lens from the 'wrong' angle and leaves it to the wrong angle. Maybe the picture would be brighter, but these bounced rays would appear as a noise (blur, shade, ghost etc.) on the projected image. As I remember, we don't want to turn our TVs into a gigantic flaslight. We just want to project the useful light (picture) of the TV, not 'any' of the light from it. :)
So, my first thought on the brightness (and somewhat on the sharpness) issue: We don't need bounced light! The projector's body should be box-shaped, not pyramid. At least not tapering pyramid. (Rather it could be a pyramid that flares out, but it's just an idea, I have to make experiments with it.) The walls inside should be painted flat black. Even more, I'll try to attach some kind of flat black fabric, especially to the front wall that contains the lens. I want to absorb most of the bouncing light.
Then, there are losses 'in' the lens itself. Thicker the lens more the loss. That's why we use plastic Fresnel lenses, that is around 0.4 - 1 mm thin. But... it's from plastic, it's fantastic... :) The quality is not as perfect as the glass lense's. And this 'not perfect' quality is also varying from Fresnel to Fresnel. There are no two plastic Fresnel lenses with the same quality. We have to do trial and error! I guess most of the wrong results were caused by bad quality Fresnels (and sloppy builds ;). If you've got bad picture quality, build a more precise projector. If the problem still exists, then go and buy an other Fresnel. I've bought 5 pieces of Fresnels. I hope I'll find some good ones among them. :) I think that 7-1/2" glass lens or similar would be the correct solution, but we want the cheapest solution here, don't we? So I won't buy that lense for the time being.
Another losses are between the projector and the screen, because of the distance and the medium (air). I guess we simply cannot do anything against this loss. :(
Finally, there are losses in the screen. The screen itself absorbs some-more light. If I select a totally reflective screen (like a mirror), then I'll get a brighter picture, but with a hotspot. If I select another surface, there will be less hotspot and darker image (more losses of light). I guess the plain bright white wall will be a good solution for the first time. Then we can think of some more professional, nacreous surfaces.
One more thing to the brightness issue: I guess computer monitors won't work. At least they're not as bright as TVs, so the results won't be as bright as if I were use a TV.

Sharpness, focusing:
As I mentioned above, bouncing lights playing an important part in getting an unsharp, blurry picture. The quality of the lens is also important.
Then there are the different shapes of surfaces. I mean, the TV's CRT has a curved surface, the Fresnel has a flat surface. The light rays from the corners of the CRT will have to travel through a (bit) longer distance to the Fresnel than the ones from the center of the CRT. This seems to be a little problem at first sight, but we'll enlarge it, along with the picture. :) So, if I set the focus to the center of the CRT, the corners will be somewhat unsharp. If I correct the unsharp corners, the center will be somewhat out of focus. I guess this issue won't be solved totally and perfectly, ever. However I can play with masking the Fresnel (you know, the 'circle' method), bending the Fresnel to the shape of the CRT, using two fresnels (that may incidentally solve the upside-down picture effect) etc.
But I think the most important thing to start with a TV that has a perfect (I mean perfect!) picture. An ugly cockroach won't become a beautiful butterfly just because you're looking it through a magnifying lens... It will be a bigger and uglier cockroach... :) So, unsharp, out-of-focus, dim pictures on TV will produce more unfocused, even dimmer picture on the projecting screen.
I guess I'll use a mid-size TV with as flat CRT as possible. It shouldn't be an ultramodern up to date type. It's enough if it has a 'somewhat' flat screen with crisp and bright picture. Oh yes, the adjustment procedure should be happen using a DVD- or broadcast quality picture. So no crappy VHS recordings for 'testing' around... :)

The upside-down story: Remember the good old (I mean OLD) slide-projector! It has a 'few' lenses and no mirrors inside, and you don't have to place your slides upside-down in order to get a right, properly oriented picture. So, we don't need to bowl over our favorite TV set, either.
But what is the trick then? No, not mirrors. At least not at this stage of the project. Someone above has already 'revealed' the method. We have to use TWO lenses. With the first lens (front of the CRT) we have to produce a picture (e.g. on a sheet of paper) that has the same size (or a bit smaller) as the largest "circle" on the Fresnels. With the second Fresnel whe have to project this small picture to the screen. Of course, the sheet of paper is not needed after we determined the exact place of the first and the second lens. With this method the projected image hopefully will be as same as on the TV. Not reversed, not upside-down. Yes, this will cause further loss of light, but it's still better method than playing with the (below-optical-grade) mirrors or turning the TV upside-down.

Well, I guess I've thouched all the important issues regarding this 100inchTV project.
Let's work on it now! ;)

Well, meanwhile some strange ideas came to my mind. Like what if we were use more TVs with the same picture projected to the same place? Let's say I'd build two projectors onto two identical TVs. Theoretically these may produce twice the brightness than one TV. Of course there are more problems to solve with this, like adjusting (matching) the two projected images into one image, correcting the trapezoid distorsion because the TVs should project the image from an angle etc. But it could produce more (twice?) brightness. It's sure.

Well, I was too long. :) Sorry.
I hope I can post some test pictures soon.

Bye all!

-- Tom (tom@nospamplease.kom), June 24, 2003.

The best surface to project on as I have learnt is silvery greyi colour but not too reflective as you will find it hotspots also try blackout material or why not try a grey wall.

-- skander (berryhillguy@yahoo.co.uk), June 26, 2003.

on www.diyaudio.com you will find that people uses lcd panels with OHP to make projectors! sooooo... you need FLAT tv screen to do the same with TV! you cant do it with courved screen...you can, actualy, but you will need lens system, not just one lens! so, flat screen + glass lens (with focal lenth at least 1.5 x screen diagonal), and you have it... have a nice day!

-- ja (sikterbre@yahoo.com), June 27, 2003.

hey guys you're all doing this in a very complicated way, instead of using this fresnel lens shit and magnifying lens, why not make a box that fits around the tv tightly and instead of the lens use the top of one of those Over Head Projectors used in school, you know the ones the teachers put clear plastics with writing on them, they pick up every bit of colour as well as incresing image size, i now bought a proper projector as i became very rich, u can too go to my site,

www.moneymatrix.freehomepage.com

-- Relo Cool (braziliankid2k@ntlworld.com), June 29, 2003.

Yes but can or has anyone out there tried it if so did it work and how well did it work i am certain that it will work better than the shitty plastic fresnel lens.

-- skander (berryhillguy@yahoo.co.uk), July 01, 2003.

why would any1 pay for the plans jsut serch yahoo or google for projector tv plans an you'll find all the plans you need thnx

-- none of your f-ing buisness (rowley508@yahoo.com), July 02, 2003.

i tried lenses from OHP, both fresnel and lens from OHPs head! forget that fresnel, it is double-fresnel, and it doesnt work!forget fresnel anyway! other lens was other story... great picture, large size image, but PALE! lens is too small, so very little amount of light can pass through it! dissapointing, but true. anyway, it is worth to see, if you can get OHP for free, or cheap! i think that lens from OPAQUE PROJECTOR would give great image, but i cant get one to try! by the way, OHPs lens is not single lens, it contains 2 or 3 lenses, that is why it is giving much beter image!

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), July 02, 2003.

I am going to order a 12" by 12" rigid unbendable fresnel lens from 3dlens.com this I think will fix many issues although I would like to try that lens you are on about from a opaque projector.

-- skander (berryhillguy@yahoo.co.uk), July 02, 2003.

Ok, I tried it. I read everything on the board and went to OfficeMax this last weekend and bought the full-page magnifier. I built the box just like everyone said and it went together fine. I used a computer monitor since I wanted to show the kids something I downloaded off the Internet, plus it has a de-gauss feature that took care of the weird colors when I turned it upside down. Yes, it worked, but the picture was so dim it was unwatchable. Brightness, contrast were all turned up, it was just too dim in a dark room on a white wall. The problem is lumens. Not enough getting pumped out. But it was a neat experiment. I am now looking into making an LCD version with a Halogen or Fluorescent bulb. If anyone has plans or info I would appreciate it. Thanks.

-- Anthony (anthonygarza@yahoo.com), July 08, 2003.

I purchased 5 lens from 3dlens.com, they are in China. But I took a chance and paid 1.79$ each, 7.00 airmail. I placed the order on a thursday, they shipped on friday - and get this, I recieved the order in perfect condition on monday. I was impressed. You will need a mirror for inversion with this lens. I ordered from a kit over a month ago for 25$ from a company (gobigtv.com) It has been 22 days and I have not recieved it yet. Their phone number is incorrect-some guy's home phone number (he was cool about it) - 3dlens.com is where to go! Even better price breaks at quantity.

-- jon pope (jonp@sourcevital.com), July 08, 2003.

Yup, I bought the frensel lens from china, 2 infact.

My Question, they recommend the length of 35" inches.. Is this what everyone else is using?

And what is your guestment from this folcal box to the wall??

Thanks

Dean

-- Dean (stuff@dmmr.ca), July 18, 2003.

ok, i have very good plans i bought from ebay email me and i will give you my website to go to that im going to be setting up, i have made a mock up device to see what works best and how, you really need a light tight box painted flat black inside and also there is a way to make it where you dont have to turn your tv upside down. you can just take the tv you have 'DEDICATED' to this and get a switch installed inside that inverts the picture upside-down and left to right so that it looks right on the wall or screen. im just using my wall in my spare room. not something that you want to pay alot for to make but for just a cheap home theater its very great and usable!!!

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 18, 2003.

Ok, guys and girls wanting their own theater, I have made a short and simple site for you to follow, I mean simple less than an hours worth of work LOL well have fun http://www.geocities.com/apalmatiersr/My_140inch_projection_pg1.html And just remember I could be like all the other A**holes out there and charge for this but its a free world and lets keep it that way!

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 20, 2003.

Well.. This is a question for all of you guys.

someone say that there are no products like 6x frensel lenses in the market(actually he shows a reply from a frensel lense manufacture. The manufacture says that it is impossible to make 6x frensel lense with 0.4 thickness and 6x frensel lenses on ebay are actually 3x frensel lenses!

on the other hand... sellers and some ppl claim that there are 6x frensel lense in the market..

so.. Which side is correct? I was going to order two 3x frensel lenses from 3dlense.com... but now i'm confused.. please let me and all others know whether there are 6x frensel lenses in the market or not

Thank you!

Saint ps: i know my name is weird... :(

-- Saint :) (secretnabiki@hotmaill.com), July 21, 2003.

You are right... there's no such thing as a 6X fresnel lens. The people who are selling these lenses on ebay are in the main using the 3X lens from 3DLens .com Supplies in Taiwan. They cost $1.79 and anybody can order them from 3DLens. Don't waste your money by buying from these guys on ebay. I have used the fresnel lenses from 3DLens and they are very good quality.

-- Prof (nurhadi@bigpond.com), July 21, 2003.

WEll ok im not going to argue with that cause i just bought it as it was advertiesed but there is a much better lense at office max, i just bought one today. Its called ultraoptix handi-lens magnifier sheet and it is thick plastic and it is scratch resistant-light weight- and high powered distortion free and shatter proof is how it is advertised and its absolutely correct. I have not had a better image than what im getting now. It costs a whopping 9 bucks (rounded up) but its well worth the investment!

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 22, 2003.

So, hows this working for everyone, any new ideas how to make it better? well anyways lately i was mounting mine on the wall and if your going to do this be very careful and dont try it alone cause it can fall and hurt you very badly I know that personally lol!

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 24, 2003.

well i have dumped this project now after about 3 months on it I have moved upto the lcd and ohp setup and its awesome anyway if anyone wants a meniscus lens which is much sharper then I am able to supply you one quite cheaply.

-- skander (berryhillguy@yahoo.co.uk), July 24, 2003.

Ok guys sorry about the advertisement but it would really help if you would check this out, earn money just surfing the net, something you do anyways right? Why not get paid for it? just click here to sign up!http://www.cashfiesta.com/php/join.php?ref=apalmatiersr

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 26, 2003.

i see in 3Dlens web site:"Large Fresnel Lens 250 x 250mm" 250mm x 250mm Item: #A250S Thickness: 2mm Weight: 170 grams Material: inflexible optical acrylic Groove pitch: 0.5mm Focal length: 210mm Magnification: 4x Protective case: No The highest quality unbending rigid large fresnel lens is excellent for TV projector home theater with more clear picture. " Anyone tried this in a projector design? what s the difference with 7"x10 ones? What about a 29" Tv as source, it need lower magnification and has higher bright than small ones...greetings from Argentina...

-- George (avangelis@yahoo.com), July 28, 2003.

Dude, hook this up in your crib. I just did! It's dope!

-- John Longfellow (Jlong@hotmale.com), July 29, 2003.

What about those Homemade Projectors for $9.95?

I've seen plans on e-Bay and elsewhere that show you how to build your own projector for only $9.95, what gives? Do they work?

What these plans will show you how to do is build a box, cut a hole in the front, put a TV set in it upside down (yes, upside down) and cove the hole with a fresnel lens. The fresnel lens specified is a flat sheet of plastic often used on the rear windows of RV's and trucks to enable the driver to see behind him when.

This scheme does actually work, if you fiddle with it enough you will get a washed out, out of focus, low resolution backwards picture. After the novelty wears off, like in about five minutes, you'll take it apart and likely never reassemble it.

Visit http://myhometheater.homestead.com/videobasics3.html

-- Ed (harkie@usa.com), July 30, 2003.

you know maybe your right but i set mine up in a spare room added a 5.1 surround system and i watch movies on it have partys in there and its not lost its value yet but the lense and the box is exactly true cause i bought the kit from ebay and have since made it much better i have to update my site cause of it and i can get a very good focus cause of some things ive discovered by messing with it and a very cool new "accidental" discovery of how to bend the lense to get a good focus.

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 30, 2003.

Hi Allen. What is this "accidental" discovery. I'm building a proyector with nice results, but as all may know, the edges are blurry unless you try something.

J@vier

-- Javier (construsol@hotmail.com), July 31, 2003.

well we had gone to the store recently and bought a box of cheerios and if you have seen them they had pc games in them with a hole cut so you can see the game, well i had got an idea that by putting that piece of the box over my already round hole that i could cover some of the edges and use the focusing power of the middle of the lense. It was expected that it would also darken it but i just had it taped on there and the tape wasnt holding too well so i made a new one from another piece of box, a bit sturdier and had no way of putting it on there except with screws and so i did. By doing so the screws went threw the front and bowed the lense toward the tv and in turn made it all one focus not just the middle good and the edges s**ty but it all looks very well focused now. So now i dont have 8inches of blurr all around but maybe 1 or 2 inches of blur which is very good!

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 31, 2003.

hey guys i made my projector and everything is fine but when i turn my TV upside down to see image on wall properly, the TV gives me these funny colours, the picture turns like purpulish and greensih in some areas, any help? thanks.

-- Soulja54 (toocool_863@hotmail.com), July 31, 2003.

as said before you have about three choices. 1. You can unplug the tv for about 15mins upside down and it can fix the colors but the bad thing is that the board inside isnt meant to handle all the stress of being upside-down so in the future there are going to be problems. 2. Buy a degauser coil which will get rid of its natural electronic field around the tv itself and the tv will react as normal or 3. You can spend about $70(if your serious about this whole thing!) to get the image inverted upside-down and left to right by getting the wires on the yoke changed around or the yoke itself turned but only if its a movable yoke vs the non-movable yoke in which changing the wires will HAVE to be done and then by method 3 your tv can be upright and the colors wont run. any questions email me and i can possibly even get the instructions for this but dont do it yourself unless you have been properly trained!!!

-- Allen with 140 inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), July 31, 2003.

i just found this page. it looks cool i might try it someday. it would be intresting to have a full page frensel lens to play around with anyway. i hear that moast all tvs except for the hdtvs have the same resolution, because of a set resolution that was set back when evryone had 9 inch tvs, or were they smaller? i wasnt around back then, anyway you probably would get more light out of them, but dont expect more resolution. now about the polorizing lenzes. if you take 2 polorizing lenzes, or sheets and put one upside down it will block the light from comeing through. you can rotate one and it will go from black to clear. you can make a 3d progection system with these. you need to make glasses with the polorizing lenzes, one needs to be turned opisite of the other one. then you get/make 2 progectors, and make the progectors shine through the polorizing sheets (one upside down). they need to be shineing at the same space on the wall. then you need a strerioscopic video. and mabye vcr i dont know where to get these(you might have to make the video), but they would baseicaly produce an image for both eyes. one for each progector. if it works correctly the right image will be blocked by your left eye and only come into your right eye and vise vresa i think this is how the professional pepole show 3d movies. at least thats how they did it at sea world. if i had one of these things, i would only try to watch it at night, not on a full moon (more light), and you can turn off all of the lights, and just sit there in the dark for 30 minutes. this allows your eyes to adjust to the dark. if i were desparate i might also try useing a orange lens, or set your hue on you tv to orange, if you have a hue setting on your tv. orange light is higher in wavelength and might travel farther, if you could stand watching an orange tv. i think a lcd progector is a better option. i would like to try takeing a old working laptop, and takeing the back off, and puting a huge halogen or floressent light behind it, (it would have to be placed far enough away from the laptop screen) and makeing a box around it with a frensel.

-- turtle (bubbyparker@fcmail.com), August 02, 2003.

IS anyone here in Australia

-- Folk (19640411@student.amc.edu.au), August 02, 2003.

Yes... I'm here in Adelaide.

-- Prof (nurhadi@bigpond.com), August 03, 2003.

Hello People, I was wondering if any one was from england here. I am having problems finding the 'fresnel lens' for the 'projector'. I have asked iin my local Staples store but they do not supply any thing of this sort. I have also asked at a local Photograpy store and they had no idea as to what it was or where to get one. Could any one tell me where i could get one in the UK and also how much it will cost aproximitly. Thanks in advance. Keep up the good work lads

Andrew

-- Andrew T (thekidy_yahoo@hotmail.com), August 04, 2003.

OK! 100 inch TV is basicaly reversed photographic camera! If you look at the camera (not digital camera), light is coming from outside, through the lens system, into the black box, and then falling on the film! This is the same thing, only the light is coming from inside, from tv display (instead of film), going through black box and lens, and falling on the screen (wall).

Now, why is projected image bad, or at least not so well?

1. If you look at any camera specs, you will see that there is not one lens, but system made of multiple lenses, even 15 of them in the top cameras! You dont have lens system, becose you are using fresnel lens (wrong)!

2. Glass lens gives much better image than plastic fresnel lens, with better sharpness, brightness and contrast.

3. You need apropriate focal lenght of lens. It has to be about 1.5 x tv diagonal, meaning you need lens with 500mm focal lenght to project image from 37 cm tv set.if focal lenght is shorter, lens will not pick up whole image from screen, resulting in distorted corners of the projected image. You are chasing fresnels with 6x magnification to use it instead of 3x fresnels! 6x has shorter focal lenght than 3x, meaning even worst result! Forget it, forget fresnel lenses!

4. You need diaphragm on the lens, just like photographic camera, to cut off distorted part of the image created in the lens corners, and to cut off light that comes from tv display to the lens from wrong angle.

5. You can project image from pc monitor, but with poor results, becose pc monitors are deliberately made to give less brightness than tv sets, becose you sit much closer to them than to tv screens. Turn off the light in your room, and look at the ambient light produced by monitor and by tv. Tv gives much more light.

6. For bigger tv you need lens with bigger focal lenght, go for smaller tvs, it is easier.

7. And finaly, you need flat surface to project from, which means you need tv with real flat screen. If you use tv with courved screen, you will need aditional lens to corect image before it hits the wall.

Conclusions! You need real glass lens(es)! If you use tv with courved screen, you will need aditional lens to corect image before it hits the wall! BLACK BOX, not white or silver! Diaphragm (it cant corect all the problems, but helps a lot)!

So, is anyone here willing to find and read something about optics, so we could resolve this problem, or you still want to argue!

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), August 07, 2003.

dude people its all at

www.100inchtv.8m.com

all questions will be answered after u see it TRUST ME!!

-- brandon (boarderbm@yahoo.com), August 09, 2003.

OK Allen!

lets get to work! does anyone have links to some pages about optics! i searched myself a little, but english is not my native language, so it is hard for me to understand some things! it would be great if someone could find some diagrams of lenses used in rear projection tvs, or diagrams of lenses used in opaque projectors! i think i read somewhere that early rear projection tvs used courver CRTs, if thats true they must have some sort of corrective lenses in them. on the other hand, opaque projectors use realy big lenses, becose intensity of light that is reflected from paper (that is projected from) is very low. i dont know about focal lenght of RP TVs lenses, but i saw one opaqus projector and it had lens with focal lenght of 500 milimeter, which is great for projecting from 37 cm tv.unfortnately, couldnt get my hands on it. two years ago i borowedoverhead projector and used its lenses (lenses on the arm,not fresnel at the bottom), result was impresive, but image was pale, becose diameter of lens was small, and couldnt pass much light throug it. i experimented with 54 cm tv, i dont have 37 cm set, but now i think that result with smaller tv would be much better, if someone of you can get OHP try it, its much much better than ordinary fresnel! thats it for now!

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), August 11, 2003.

ok, I can get an overhead projector for fairly cheap i guess (brand new little over $150) and im willing to just tear it apart, someone had brought up an idea about taking the guts out and just placing the tv inside or towards the fresnal so i will try that first before i fubar it! It might take me awhile to get one but i'll do it and until then i'll try to find some optics info, or info on rear projection tvs and projectors!

-- allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), August 11, 2003.

allen, you dont have to tear it apart, just take of the lens from the arm, use it instead of your fresnel, and you will see the diference! that would be like placing the tv inside of it! forget OHPs fresnel, it is double fresnel, cant use it! beleive me, i tried! check this out, maybe some optics from it could be useful:

http://www.herbach.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv? Screen=PROD&Store_Code=HAR&Product_Code=TM89OPT4296&Category_Code=OPT

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), August 12, 2003.

CHECK THIS OUT: 60 YEARS OLD TV PROJECTORS!

http://www.tvhistory.tv/1940sProjectionTVp2.htm

THEY MADE THEM IN 1940s, AND WE CANT TODAY???

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), August 12, 2003.

here is the diagram of rear projection tv and lens system:

http://www.hedus.com/productpage03.html

it explains a lot!

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), August 12, 2003.

Hi every one .Here is a zip file. Extract it and the plans are there. http://www.angelfire.com/ex/michaelfarkas/150inch.zip

My results are not as good as the results on most website. My picture is blurry and i cant focis it(I tried to focis it for a whole day).But my picture cant get any more clear. And i also want to know wich way the smooth side of the lens faces (I tried bothe sides and if the smooth side faces the tv only the middle is clear and nothing els). I was wondering if anyone can tell me what im doing wrong.

-I have the tv 5 feet away from the screen -white shower curten as screen -tv is on the ground pointing up -no light is geting out of the box -lens is about1 foot away from my 13inch tv -the inside of the box is painted flat black. -rouph side of the lens is facing the tv -i am using a 6x lens from www.maxtheater.com Thanks

-- Michael Farkas (cool_dude_killa_69@hotmail.com), August 14, 2003.

If your looking for older and cheap projectors, check with your state auctions. I've gone to several state surplus auctions in Ohio and have seen many, some going for as little as $20. Computers, radios, and lots of junk. It's definitely worth a trip. Here is a link to the one in Ohio that I go to: http://www.state.oh.us/das/gsd/surplus/Ware_House_Auction.htm

-- BargainHunter (BargainHunter@USA.$$$), August 14, 2003.

you know, there are alot of autions around my town, it never even occured to me to go check there, thanks for the insight! I would suggest this highly to all even if there arent any "projectors" there could still be parts to use!

-- allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), August 15, 2003.

hey it does work, have a curve screen and put glass in front of the screen it cleaned the image up (before it was in focus in the centre but faded out, Watched movies no problem, family love it. using a 14' tv, running computer throught tv out card, so Divx run on the big screen

-- Aaron (bell_familynz@yahoo.co.nz), August 18, 2003.

Hi Aaron. How did you say that the screen was cleaned? Putting a glass in front of the screen? Can you explin more?

-- Javier (construsol@hotmail.com), August 18, 2003.

really i would like to know more also. and i went back to office max today and i was asking about a large magnifying lense and if they could order one but they couldnt and then the guy said i dont know how much you really want to spend but those lamps that have the lenses built in to look at electronics you know, the ones you use to see whats letting all the smoke out, lol. well its lense is about 6 inches diamater and i was wondering if anyone has tried one of those yet? they are curved but its curved on both sides () wouldnt that make it react as a flat one? if somebody has tried one please let me know the results!

-- allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), August 19, 2003.

ok, i found this way back on this site, i put a 3mm glass up to the tv screen, because the screen is curved the centre is the only point that is being focused, so by making the image flat using glass you are focusing the whole image. someone also said to me today that if you use fabric inside the box and paint that black it block light inside more as it absorb more light that is boucing around inside (this light does affects the image, lighten the colour)

-- Aaron (bell_familynz@yahoo.co.nz), August 19, 2003.

ok, like window glass?

-- allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), August 19, 2003.

i tried the glass idea and saw no change whatsoever! It did nothing for mine! but then again it might help others that have different lenses than i do.

-- Allen (apalmatiersr@cox.net), August 21, 2003.

check out this, might be useful! http://www.ic.sunysb.edu/Stu/livanova/ http://www.uspto.gov/go/classification/uspc353/defs353.htm

-- the whiner (sikterbre@yahoo.com), August 22, 2003.

Awesome project for the kids and probably the next project for their science fair. I haven't seen this question yet. I saw a mirror design I am going to use and was wondering what people are using to seal the lens box into the larger box so no light escapes, yet give a smooth slide for focus? As for all the whiners out there... Give me a break you spend more money at the drive thru and more time picking out a video game than putting this projcet together. Keep up the good work guys.

-- Techno Mom (pulilover@hotmail.com), August 30, 2003.

Actually techno mom, alot of us have spent alot of time and money on this project and we have just recently decided to work together, it would be nice to have some of the original people working on it still too but they have gone on to bigger better things like this isnt important to anyone anymore and i have spent hundreds of dollars and hours on this and you know i have a very good picture but i dont have a cam to capture it or else i would post it on my website to see if anyone elses looks like it or better so it would help someone could post their best pics of quality!

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), August 30, 2003.

Thanks guys for yr input, I am still working on mine but I do have some video footage. I'll send to anyone that want to have a look and I tell you the rugby world cup at my place this year is gonna be life sized. Fan Fukn Tastic.

-- mekeman (tejo@itconnect.net.au), September 03, 2003.

has someone seen the 3d projector plans that were in ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&item=3043398543&category=20385

-- Aaron (bell_familynz@yahoo.co.nz), September 03, 2003.

Hi. Can someone tell me how to split the two glued lenses that come together in overhead projectors? I want to experiment and afraid to brake them.

-- J@vier (construsol@hotmail.com), September 08, 2003.

Well guys i havent really been working on mine lately or watching it for that matter but the family continues to get their fun out of it, i have people coming over all the time just to watch a movie in there or a show on tv that they want to see. But anyways i found this really cool site called superdudes where you make your own card and play games all for FREE and you can win things like posters, shirts, your own personal cards that you create and more. check it out its worth the while and might as well do it considering its free of charge and worth paying for! http://www.superdudes.net/templates/html_email/images/visit_my_hq_06. jpg

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), September 11, 2003.

sorry that link is wrong, its http://www.superdudes.net/HQ/index.php? sdid=399754

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), September 11, 2003.

Check out this board for more discussion on $9 100 inch projection TV and also some great DIY plans.

http://www.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/3/1107.html

-- Steve Holmes (saholmes@comcast.net), September 16, 2003.

man, nobody gets on here anymore, what happened to everyone?

-- Allen with 140inch theater (apalmatiersr@cox.net), October 02, 2003.

I think everyone is tired of reading the same old thing over and over again. THE FRESNEL LENS IDEA IS DEAD. Others elsewhere have moved on to the latest designs incorporating quality lenses and improved projector designs. Having read every post since this forums inception, I know I've had enough !!! P.S. Whats the point of having a forum that you can't post any photo's ??

-- Floggingadeadhorse (hadenuf@ hotmail.com), October 02, 2003.

Nice to see after all this time that a few are still having a go. We all ultimately conceed defeat. I bet the sales of projectors has soared. I for one was bitted by the big screen having tried to solve this problem and have now bought a Infocus X1 projector. Wouldn,t turn back to normal tv for watching films. But i don't think it is ultimately about producing a perfect answer, otherwise the fun would go out of the project and this forum would have ended long ago. It has been very educational and informative. This is a good example of what the internets about. Liked minded people from around the world trying to solve a problem. Its a pity other world problems could be solved the same way. But... perhaps some things are unsolvable

-- bob (shoothedog@doggone.com), November 02, 2003.

they work pretty good...just DON'T PAY FOR THE PLANS!

these plans are pretty good...

http://www.doesyourroomsuck.com

-- Brandon Yates (byates147@hotmail.com), November 13, 2003.

Well, since there are so many posts, I can't say that I've read them all. I have read a great deal of them and there seems to be one thing missing. If one lense causes the original image to be inverted, would it not be a logical assumption that a second lense would fix the problem? It's simple science of optics; perhaps reading a little about how telescopes work would aid.

Newton's plans on the reflective telescope comes to mind.

-- Knucklehead (slygrifter1170@hotmail.com), December 18, 2003.

I agree with you bob,

THE TRUTH IS, at least the one I've endured, WE all get caught when we see this huge TV ad and our reason just fades away. I'm an electronic engineer and we won't be able to get a big TV without spending a considerable amount of money; but if you want your projectors working read the following: Some projector lamps often creates bright, round areas on the surface of the screen, also known as hot spots. Also, the video is frequently grainy. You can deal with both problems by placing a large panel of plastic (available in specialty stores) in front of the projector screen. But you won't be able to improve the video quality much unless you make use of a glass screen like the one offered by Video Optik Brähler. This glass projection screen is non-granulated and contains an embedded waxy layer of paraffin in the glass pane to reduce the hot spots.

But all people here is doing it by themselves, so... you can create your own alternative screen. Just set up a screen template in Photoshop (or another graphics program) made out of several sheets; in the middle, place a radial gray wedge that gradually fades away as it approaches the end. This gray wedge also reduces hot spots. If that still doesn't fix the problem, Virtual Dub can save the day with a hot spot filter that darkens the center of your image in the shape of a circle, while its radial luminance filter brightens the edge of the screen.

And follow the Bryans directions found in this very same page (for those who haven't read it yet)

And that it will be the MAXIMUM sharpness you will get, nothing more, nothing less.

Regards,

-- Rickter (rickter@ignmail.com), December 27, 2003.

BEFORE YOU BEGIN THE PROJECT OR DURING, VISIT WWW.HOWSTUFFWORKS.COM YOU WILL GET THE LATEST INFO.ON PROJECTION SYSTEMS AND SHOULD RECEIVE NEW INSIGHT AND IDEAS IN THE PERFECTING EFFORTS.

-- mark (fly90mph@netscape.net), January 05, 2004.

OK, this may be stupid, but I have a burning question before I move on with this project --- from the diagrams I've seen, it appears the larger box is a tight fit on the front of the TV, sealed to allow no light in-- so, my question is, how do you change channels, adjust volume, screen settings, etc. if the front of the TV is all covered up??

-- Scottie (hornet99@swbell.net), January 06, 2004.

looking to make one of these for my kids ps2,,,,,,CAN someone help cant find a frensel lens anywhere,,,,tred staples,,,,here in essex,,,dont sell them,cheers

-- tattoo (royuk1@hotmail.com), January 06, 2004.

I've been tuning up my ghetto-ass fresnel projector for a few months now and here's what I found out. Fresnel lenses are a great way to get started on this because they're cheap, easy to work with etc. You can get them at office supply stores for under 10 bucks, usually much less. If you use a fresnel lens, only use the 8x10 lenses, as smaller lenses have lower powers and will give you dark, oversized pictures. The problem with the fresnel is that it bleeds some of the light in random ways, giving the overall picture a cloudy tone. This is especially noticable if the screen is black with a white title in the center, the letters have a hazy halo. This is intrinsic to fresnels, so even if you paint the inside black, or get a better screen or get it exactly in focus, you will always have these bleeding halos. A glass lens will not give you halos and will actually enable you to focus your picture much more clearly, down to the phosphor color element clusters on your screen if you like. However if you use a glass magnifyer, it must be quite large (5" to 8") and ideally have a power of around 4x-8x. You use a large glass and more light gets through giving you better brightness and better colors, smaller lenses waste light, are dark and make the edges totally blurry. The more powerful the lens you use the further away you will have to move your TV back to get a bigger picture on the wall. If you have a small room or a big TV, consider a less powerful less. If you have a small TV or a big room consider a more powerful lens. (TV small = 9" big=20") If you use a bigger TV you will get a brighter, higher resolution image on the wall, but use a more powerful and bigger lens or the picture will be too huge for most rooms. The best combination is a 17" screen with 6-8x lens, 8-10" in diameter. Wall distance = 15ft. Paint the inside of the box BLACK not white. White will cause unnecessary random light to come through the lens and gray up the wall. If light hits the side of the box it is useless to the lens, so absorb it into oblivion with matte black paint or velour fabric. Mirrors and upside down TV's getting gaussed up with purple blotches are unnecessary and inelegant. Flipping the TV video is totally easy. Turn off, unplug and go inside your TV and look for a plug coming from the tube with red,blue,green,and yellow wires. These are the H/V control yokes. Flip the yellow and green wires around. Now your picture is upsidedown, you don't need to flip it left/right. It's perfect now. If you want go buy a DPDT toggle switch at RadioShaft and you can wire it up to switch the polarity whenever you want. I've done it already, there's a switch on the back of my TV now that says "up/down". For a screen, go get a real screen. Even an old film projector screen is better than most things. Bleached printing paper gives awesome colors and fair brightness, white wall was yellowed and dark, tin-foil is to shiny, even of the matte side and viewing angle suffers. If you use silver paint make sure to get a "bright" silver, not chrome, not "silver", and paint a foamboard or plastic sheet. Take your time painting the screen! You have to dust on silver paint a little at a time to form millions of tiny solid spheres of paint on the surface. The screen is the only real way to get good color and brightness. The best material to use is white roadsign reflective sheet which can be bought in small doses at hobby shops, sometimes surplus stores have great rolls of it. Such material is designed to take small light sources and capture and radiate as much of ot as possible. Get a bunch of it, plaster you wall, it will be real flat and super bright. A curved screen is good, a partially hemishperical screen is best, you can make one easily using wooden rods and geodesic frame construction. If you must have a brighter picture, use 3 TVs of the same type, or at least the same size. Place them close together and focus them all exactly, this is as good as it gets. 9 TVs would work in theory but I mean really. More TV's than that and you start having serious focal angle problems. Also consider building a rear projection TV. Get a big ass fridge box and put a large sheet of paper at one end, focus the screen to the paper and watch from outside the box. The picture will be brighter as it doesn't have to reflect off a wall to get to you first. Well, hope this helps. I speak entirely from personal experience, my projector is running ten times better than the first day I got it running and I watch it all the time. Large glass lens, medium TV and roadsign reflect screen are fully the way to go.

-- Scabaroth (XZQVenus2@aol.com), February 07, 2004.

Scabaroth,

So why don't just post your work so that we could see what are you talking about. Can you provide us the real picture of what you have?

rgds, james

-- (james31@yahoo.com), February 08, 2004.

I have seen alot of post for screens. I have found that a white glossy pull down window shade works great.

-- (theremper@yahoo.com), February 18, 2004.

I find it amazing that people are still working on this thing (like me) and this thread hasn't been pulled down! haha. Well, it's been a long time but I finally got around to updating my own free plans! Please check them out!

http://www.originalplot s.com/100inch.html ht tp://www.originalplots.com/images/bryans_100inchTVguide.pdf

-- Bryan ONeill (bryan@originalplots.com), February 28, 2004.

I found if you line the inside of the cardboard with velvet it cuts out more of the "milky washed out" effect and other ambient light in the room. Also does anyone know a way to stack lenses to get better focus?

-- Gordon W (223Zaquil@Forberton.net), March 09, 2004.

I have tried this projector and followed the instructions exactly. I am sure I am not the only one who has encountered that the quality o f the picture that is projected is just terrible. These fresnel lenses (plastic 8x10) don't work well. Any alternatives to at least geting a decent picture that you can actually focus?

-- Pete (planesimplegolf@aol.com), March 10, 2004.

Don't forget the groved side of the fresnel has to face the tv tube.

-- KC (Jennor@castilan.net), March 14, 2004.

finally a site with pictures of how the homemade projectors look, and how the picture quality looks on a white screen.

http://groups.msn.com/diyprojectiontv/

-- RG (finally@sorry.com), March 17, 2004.

I made my TV and it's AWESOME, I used an old 1950's 12" black and white Magnavox console TV along with an array of four magnifying panels all precisely lined up together to make a nice bright 200" image digoanlly. It cost me $780 at an antique store but it was well worth it. I chose the Magnavox because of it's reputation for brightness and it didn't disappoint, at 80 Roentgens of radiation output this thing not only produces a bright image, it can cook a turkey too.

I found that for lenses, if you alternately black out every alternating band on the lens, it makes the light waves interfere with each other just like in the famous double-slit light experiment. When the beams divert around the barriers and meet on the other side, they combine and focus, and actually make the image BRIGHTER! Doing this 4 times makes the image progresively larger and brighter at the same time due to laws of physics. You can also get better focus by putting each lens in a sliding rail in the light box, for easy adjustment. I found the spacing to be logarithmic mostly, the first lens gap is .5", the second gap is 1" and the third gap is 4". Also, having an even number of lenses means you don't have to invert your TV. Odd numbers=invert.

Finally for color, I devised my own color-wheel assembly like in modern projectors to alternate red, green, blue, black, and fleshtone over and over in front of the lens. For this I cut 5 1" holes in an AOL cd and glued the 5 Leica color lenses inside. I chose Leica because of their superior optics, but at $370 apiece plus taxes and shipping it was a chunk of change. Still, I can definately tell the difference optically between the Leicas and some lenses I made myself from ice and food coloring to initially test the concept. I strapped my color wheel to a blender with the top cut off by gluing the CD to the blade assembly. This gave me the flexibility of having 15 different speeds. Personally I prefer "puree" for movies but "grate" seems best for TV.

Anyway I hope this helps, I would give you a link to my website but the flying ice lenses from my early failed color wheel testing ruined my webserver, but I'll try to get some pics online soon.

-- Rodney Allen Murphy (J10@newsmax.com), March 31, 2004.

Would a cheap LCD monitor from www.mp3playerstore.com and an old overhead projector work? Could you take the screen apart and lay it on the projector to project the image super-bright and have focus control?

Rob in NJ

-- Rob Evans (xrobevansx@hotmail.com), April 04, 2004.

http://www.officedepot.com/ddSKU.do?level=SK&id=327016

-- John Klowski (offthehook21@aol.com), April 06, 2004.

http://www.b-adeals.com/index.HTM You can buy plans for $4 if you want and they give a 30 money back.

http://www.bigtv.spyw.com/

http://www.playntradeonline.com/projector.html

http://www.maxpages.com/freebigscrntv

http://www.100inch.orcon.net.nz/downloads/index.html

http://www.homestead.com/klyckproductions/projectorscreenbuild.html

http://www.dddac.de/op07.htm

These are the ones I found but I am still looking. If anyone has any different one, could you please email me and put the subject as projector tv.....Thanks..I am just starting to build it and wonder how it will turn out....hopefully good....

Jeff

-- Jeff Birge (motocrosscwby@hotmail.com), April 13, 2004.

hello - this question was scoffed at earlier I saw without providing an answer, so hope I dont get the same.. I dont use those frensel lenses.. I brought some lenses a while ago that are about 7 inches wide - both lenses aree round.. one side is flat and one rough.. I have heard various ways as to what side the lenses should face.. ie.. smooth faces the screen and rough the TV. So can someone please tell me what way they actually go please? I have tried variuos ways but it doesnt seem to make alot of difference (which I pressume it will when I start tweaking it). I am also using a mirror on 45% angle so the monitor sits on its arse facing the ceiling.. then reflect off the mirror onto the wall.. with the danger of screwing my monitor is this an ok way to do it.. just looks smaller in my room.! any help would be greatly appreciated..

Thanks

-- c j mcd (mcdm@hotmail.com), April 14, 2004.

Can anyone tell me if a 3 or 4 inch portable LCD color tv could work and project a larger image?

-- Surf Rider (jtsherman@hotmail.com), April 16, 2004.

I am wanting to know if anyone has found any different site taht they could let me know about.

-- Jeff Birge (motocrosscwby@hotmail.com), April 17, 2004.

See below:

http://www.audiovisualizers.com/madlab/lcd_proj.htm

-- Jim Bobbbb (yeahkungfu@lycos.co.uk), April 19, 2004.

Ok I just finished reading this whole post. WOW That took way to much time. Im ready to do this now...think I can actually do this right with all this information. One question. Where to get glass lenses???? This is about the only answer I can not find... Glass IS Better...

-- R K (dvdeez@msn.com), May 07, 2004.

I cant beleive people are still posting on here. Come on just read it and make it it only cost a couple of bucks!!!

-- Bobby D (rob_dalton@yournotspammingme.com), July 08, 2004.

Heres something better guys.... I just finished mine. use all same plans except I am using a solid glass lens from an overhead projector. The picture is crystal clear. U just have to mess with it to get it focused right. This lens make the picture huge so the further away you put the projector is worse. You loose color. So put it kind off close and focus you got it, mines like 100 inches...

-- Jeff (jeff63111@yahoo.com), December 03, 2004.

http://www20.tomshardware.com/howto/20041113/projector-06.html

Toms Hardware guide to making your own lcd projector including a video. I made mine a few weeks ago, i love it, ended up costing me about AU$250

Its not worth making the cardboard box one, ive been there done that. Dont worry about frensal lenses etc Just grab an cheap lcd mointer, projector and some fans and your got your own HI-RES lcd projector, although not as compact as one broght from the store but $2000 cheaper.

-- Naylo (naylo@wsapyouth.com), December 27, 2004.

ok, simple question, does it work if you use a crt tv and a fresnel lens with plans?

-- Dev (foothill94022@hotmail.com), February 10, 2005.

I WAS WOUNDERING IS THIS A JOKE, IT IS BIGGGER THAN A FLOOR MOTEL

-- SHELLY PRELL@MSN.COM (SHELLYPRELL@MSN.COM), February 17, 2005.

its probally a scam they dont understand the phisics they sell cardboard to u heres all u need to know go buy my instructions u can make one like me its perfect and its 7.49$ CHEAP! what u need is a cardboard science project like it folds 3 times mesure ur tv screen by with and bye hieght cut out 2 pieces 46 cm long and the width of ur tv screen the cut out 2 the same 46 cm long and the hieght of ur tv then tape them toghether till there a squarelike a long reqtangle then make the same thing with 4 more planks exepted 23 cm long and wdth of tv and height then tape the same way then cut out a square out of sum card board the size of the sqaure on the smaller box make a perfect retangle on the square with a pencil,marker,pen dont matter then cut it out it dont matter what size dont make small just right size then tape the paper size frensel lense that u can get from staples or other name for it is page magnafiyer it 7.00$ tape it on the square then slide suare in smaller box tape in place. slide smaller box in large box the smaller box will be ur focus then plce tv up to the end with nothin and turn on tv ad turn off lights and make sure no light is comin out of no where besides lense if there is tape it duct tape recomended and the letters will be backwards if u wish to fix turn stand to the left and stick a mirror in front of lense and turn it horazonial letters will be strait welcome to answer ur prob anytime questions email me @ rember_96@yahoo.com ill send pics after april 30 email me then when u want pics thank you , keagan

-- keagan (rember_96@yahoo.com), March 14, 2005.