I would like to know what to do after you have gone as far as you can go and you are not happy doing it anymore? What happened to all those homesteaders from the seventies? Are they still out there, living off the land? Probably not. One never hears about them anymore. Some people glorify the job of homemaker, yet, it is not what they, themselves choose to be. I have come to the conclusion that it is all a big lie. Live off the land, be independent, fine. I did that. I've been doing it for almost fourteen years. What did it teach my husband and my children? That Mom would take care of everything and they don't have to worry about anything. Mom is responsible for all. Well, I've got news for all you dreamers out there. (And I am one) The real world has a tendency to crash into your dreamworld at the most inopportune moments. Then where will you be? Right where I am. What is the point? Somewhere along the line, I lost the purpose of it all. Take having a milk cow, for instance. I loved my cows. One day it occurred to me that they were emotionally disturbed. Yeah, laugh. I spent alot of time with my cows. They actually have good days and bad days and moods and feelings very similar to humans. One can see it in their faces. Imagine having your children snatched away from you. They get over it. That's what you tell yourself. They get on with life, but I personally think they never get over it. They just get used to it. That's not the same thing, is it? Then of course, every two years we shoot one of their children and eat him. Now, I'm all for cutting down on the population of useless males, but it sure made me feel guilty. My animals enjoy the best life (I think) that I can give them. They always have food, water, and love. This is what I told myself when we ate them. They had a good life. When you become involved with animals whose main purpose in life is to feed you and your family, it hurts.All the people who live in that other dreamland, you know, the ones who buy their meat from the store, have no clue. They eat without guilt because they don't know how that animal lived, and let's face it, most of them don't care. I live like this because I do care. I don't want any animal to suffer so that I can eat. I know what goes on in feedlot operations, and people can deny it all they want, it doesn't change the truth. What is my point, you might well ask. I don't really think I have one. I will not buy any meat from a grocery store. I will not become a vegetarian. Somehow, I've lost the ability to make things okay in my head and I don't really know how that happened. I liked living like this. I loved it. Now that joy is gone and I don't know how to get it back, or even if I can. I thought taking a break might help. For the first time in 12 years, I have no milk cow. She died last summer of old age. I have a heifer coming along to replace her. I feel lost and useless. I got a part time job. My first in 12 years. I don't like it, yet I can't see myself going back to what I had,knowing I will not be happy. Someone out there has gone through something like this, I hope. What do YOU think?

-- Patti Morris (pmorris@ecenet.com), January 14, 2000

Answers

Patti, You ask what happened to the 70's hippies. May I offer you Mike Oehler and his book The Hippy Survival Guide to Y2K. He's still a real 60's hippie in Idaho. Among those pages are tidbits for our survival not related to Y2K. Order from Keokee Co. Publishing, Inc. POBox 722, Sandpoint, ID 83864.

-- Jan Allan (Mudthumb@AOL.com), January 14, 2000.

It sounds as if you need a vacation Patti

-- stan (sopal@net-port.com), January 14, 2000.

Patti, you sound pretty disillusiioned, and I can sure relate. A lot of folks make life in the country sound like the cure all for every social problem. It is sometimes overlooked that homesteading can present it's own unique challenges.Worse, it can be hard to find anyone who can relate to a dilemna such as having a newborn baby and three little kids and nobody to watch them when you do the milking. Others will say " well,get rid of the goats" ( what will the kids drink when I wean them?) or "take the children with you" (have they tried it?!) and it goes on. It has been hard for me to eat the goat kids. I usually sell the males. If a doe has had most of her kids sold in the past, I make a special effort to let her raise up a replacement. I also think that they handle it better if they are allowed to nurse the babies,and wean them, than if the kids are just snatched away at birth or a month old. We don't eat a lot of meat,as most americans do.If they had to kill their own meals,they would stop pigging out on it too. When we eat meat, it is because we have more animals than the place can sustain, and the killing is done with reluctance, but an acceptance that the other animals will not have enough space and feed if we keep them all.It helps to know that while this animal was alive, you cared for it and were good to it,and it led a happy life, a lot happier life than it would have had in a factory farm. There are still homesteaders from the seventies around, my husband is one of them.I think that some have decided that money was a higher priority and gave up homesteading, but others have stayed on.We have a lot of homesteading hippie types in northern Idaho.

-- Rebekah Leaf (daniel1@transport.com), January 14, 2000.

Patti, Please consider getting a physical, there might be a chemical imbalance [ throid, ect] that is making you depressed .Go back to school part time and study something that you always wanted to.Take up a new craft[kniting,pottery ect].Do volunteer work with a organization that does work you belive in [teach english, tutor children,work at a soup kitchen].Hope you get to feeling better soon ,and remember we are here if you ever want to talk.

-- kathy h (saddlebronc@msn.com), January 14, 2000.

Patti, everyone, no matter what they have chosen to do in life gets burned out from time to time. Homesteading is very hard work especially when no one seems to appreciate it. We are human and we can not do everything! Quit trying. We aim for the ideal but I don't think anyone ever reaches it. You need a rest and a change of pace. The suggestions to volunteer, get a part time job, just do something different are excellent. Do something for yourself. You cannot keep giving without replenishing yourself from time to time. This might sound selfish but in the long run, it is not. Take some short-cuts, don't try to do everything. We are not failures for doing that. Above all, pray. Our heavenly Father cares about you and will give you strength. Most of us have been there Patti, don't give up! I care too. Barbara

-- barbara (barbaraj@mis.net), January 14, 2000.

I hear you, it can get trying, 12 years without a break is like a prison sentence. whe i got low on my place i woudl take a year and go out and make some money, then be so happy to get home and have a pocket full of bread for the place. I started homesteading in earnest in 1969, there were 5 or 6 fmailies near by at the time, plus a commune, we all workind together etc. When I finally pulled out of that area 5 years ago i was the only one left and had been for many years, I felt like the lone ranger for awhile. Now I am back at it but at 61, I don't have much left but the pony tail. Buck up mother, you have been there done that, it will get better.

-- Mudlover (redgate@echoweg.netm), January 14, 2000.

Hi P, We have quit contributing to the email abyss for the most part, but your plea forces me to attempt some sort of answer. I hope I can touch upon your real question and be of some assistance to someone, as your's is really a wall that we all must face at one time or another.

I bought this place in 77 and moved out in 78, so I guess I qualify in part to attempt an answer. At least you can hear from one of the 70's nature invaders. ;)

The conclusion that I have come to is that one has never gone as far as they can go, unless it happens to be in the wrong direction or for the wrong purposes. We must do a complete re-evaluation from time to time. My goal is to do this re-evaluation on a weekly basis, however, I am still in the crisis response mode at present (knee jerk). ;)

Animals do indeed have a good bit more sensitivities than they are sometimes given credit for. I have seen them welcome one that has been removed from the herd for several months. We separate the babies to wean them, then return them to the herd after two or three months. The young prodigals then buddy up with their mothers and the family is reunited. (The just don't know how to nurse and she is ready to go on with her production.)

We do our own butchering. I HATE killing! My wife, Prisca, will readily assure you that I am one insuferable grouch before any butchering, even those stupid chickens. The way that I deal with it is this: Everything is born to die. Death is as much a part of life as birth. We all celebrate birth and morn death. The problem is to find the proper perspectives.

Is not the sudden death in the prime of life better than the lingering disease and pain ridden death of the aged? To be cared for, appreciated and loved, then to be cut down in the prime of life is the dream of most teen agers. ;) Hey, anyone over 30 is ancient beyond belief. ;) This works for awhile, but grows old. The death toll continues to mount until you can now longer believe your eyes when you stop to look back over your herd records. Then you feel like a serial killer and that you deserve the death penalty. And, of course, you do. And, of course, you truly are under the same death penalty as your animals.

This brings us to the true meaning of the grace of Yahveh given us by Jesus. We WILL die. Some of us will die miserably and some of us will die easily, but we will die. The difference is that we can die under the grace and love of Jesus and have a future, or we can die alone and, eventually, forgotten. Is it not better to have been loved?

Y2k has brought many of these things home to me. None of us could band together for our common defense because of our many differing philosophies and life styles. We can not band together, we must simply stand alone. From certain comments in your post, I would hazard a guess that you have been standing very alone. I discovered long ago that others could learn the value of gathering fire wood when the fire was out. A little temporary personal discomfort beats slavery hands down. Think about it. Does one do all the chores and the firewood also? Or, does one simply wait for others to awaken to reality? "Throw another log on the fire, then come and tell me why you're leaving me." (A truly great song!) ;)

In the end, I do what I do because I believe in personal responsibility. How can I live with myself if I can only live by asking someone else to do that which causes me to look down on them for doing what I do not have the guts to do for myself? If I must join Babylon in order to live with my self, something is terribly wrong with my values.

I guess that the real question that you are asking is: Where's the future? My answer is: there is only the present, the present and personal responsibility, the future will take care of itself if we only do our part to take care of the present. Man's future considerations can only take us into Babylon. It is Yahveh's plan to take us into the true future. In my opinion, we do best to follow the plan of Yahveh to the best of our ability.

Tie a knot and hang out for awhile. ;) Spiritual growth generally comes in gentle waves. Kerry

bboard@greenspun.com wrote: > > I would like to know what to do after you have gone as far as you can go and you are not happy doing it anymore? What happened to all those homesteaders from the seventies? Are they still out there, living off the land? Probably not. One never hears about them anymore. Some people glorify the job of homemaker, yet, it is not what they, themselves choose to be. I have come to the conclusion that it is all a big lie. Live off the land, be independent, fine. I did that. I've been doing it for almost fourteen years. What did it teach my husband and my children? That Mom would take care of everything and they don't have to worry about anything. Mom is responsible for all. Well, I've got news for all you dreamers out there. (And I am one) The real world has a tendency to crash into your dreamworld at the most inopportune moments. Then where will you be? Right where I am. What is the point? Somewhere along the line, I lost the purpose of it all. Take having a milk cow, for instance. I > loved my cows. One day it occurred to me that they were emotionally disturbed. Yeah, laugh. I spent alot of time with my cows. They actually have good days and bad days and moods and feelings very similar to humans. One can see it in their faces. Imagine having your children snatched away from you. They get over it. That's what you tell yourself. They get on with life, but I personally think they never get over it. They just get used to it. That's not the same thing, is it? Then of course, every two years we shoot one of their children and eat him. Now, I'm all for cutting down on the population of useless males, but it sure made me feel guilty. My animals enjoy the best life (I think) that I can give them. They always have food, water, and love. This is what I told myself when we ate them. They had a good life. When you become involved with animals whose main purpose in life is to feed you and your family, it hurts.All the people who live in that other dreamland, you know, the ones > who buy their meat from the store, have no clue. They eat without guilt because they don't know how that animal lived, and let's face it, most of them don't care. I live like this because I do care. I don't want any animal to suffer so that I can eat. I know what goes on in feedlot operations, and people can deny it all they want, it doesn't change the truth. > What is my point, you might well ask. I don't really think I have one. I will not buy any meat from a grocery store. I will not become a vegetarian. Somehow, I've lost the ability to make things okay in my head and I don't really know how that happened. I liked living like this. I loved it. Now that joy is gone and I don't know how to get it back, or even if I can. I thought taking a break might help. For the first time in 12 years, I have no milk cow. She died last summer of old age. I have a heifer coming along to replace her. I feel lost and useless. I got a part time job. My first in 12 years. I don't like it, yet I can't see myself going back to what I had,knowing I will not be happy. Someone out there has gone through something like this, I hope. What do YOU think? > > --------- > > To post a response, come back to the forum at > > http://greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a.tcl?topic=Countryside > > (which is also the place to go if you want to edit your alerts and > stop these robotically sent messages) > > If you are annoyed by this message then just enter the following URL > into a browser and you'll disable the alert that generated this mail: > > http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/alert-disable.tcl?rowid=AAAAu9AANAAANN pABL

-- Kerry Wooster (kerryw@hctc.net), January 14, 2000.

Five years ago I went through the same experience with my career. My passion in life. I was frustrated, worn out, exhausted, tired of doing it all myself - in other words BURNED OUT. I realized that I had to take a break or major MELT DOWN was going to occur. I didn't even tell my wife before I resigned (bad idea - don't recommed it). I left my calling for a year and did alot of things. I had to take time to re-evauluate and prioritize my life. Most importantly I had to decide(or maybe realize) that I can't and shouldn't do it all myself. It's not good for me and it's not good for those I serve. I also learned to say "NO" (Still working on that one). Now I am back doing what I love. I have been doing it for 4 years now and I love it and will continue to love it. My advice: 1. Take some time off. 2. Talk to your family about the situation. If this dream is to survive then it has to be a family dream. Not your dream that they get to enjoy passively. Even if time off works, it won't for long if you have to continue to carry all the load alone. 3. This possibly should be #1: Talk to a professional, a counselor or minister, someone you can trust, to help you with your depression. Losing sight of a life-long dream is debilitating. THERE IS HELP AND HOPE. Don't give up you can make it through and be a better person for it. Not knowing your spiritual situation I venture to say that the greatest hope is in God and the saving grace of Jesus Christ. His strength can conquer any problem and give hope to a hopeless situation. If you don't know what I am talking about then seek out someone who does. I'm sure they would love to explain it to you. Just remember THERE IS HOPE AND THERE IS HELP AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO CARE THAT CAN GIVE YOU BOTH. God Bless.

P.S. If I can make it through a similar situation like yours. You can too. I'm a minister.

-- Vaughn (vdcjm@ix.netcom.com), January 14, 2000.

I want to thank you all for your responses to my question. It helps so much to know that there are people out there who care. You people brought tears to my eyes. I found myself in a much better place, after reading the things you all said. I am burnt out, I do need a vacation and me and God, we're tight. It's unbelievable to me that I can get such compassion from people I have never met, and yet my own friends and neighbors show me none. I guess I should have come here a long time ago. Perhaps I would not have felt so alone. I am here now. I started living this way because my three year old daughter was diagnosed with cancer. She had a reoccurance at the age of seven. Thankfully, she is now twenty years old and so far doing fine. She did lose an eye and part of her hearing to the cancer and treatment, but those were the choices I had to make. I was bound and determined that her cancer had much to do with the poisoning of the food chain. I still believe that. I am a strong woman and I know I will get through this. It will be easier now that I have found all of you. Thank you again and I will visit this place often. Patti

-- Patti Morris (pmorris@ ecenet.com), January 14, 2000.

Patti, I was so happy to read your message. Okay..now you think I'm crazy, but let me explain.

We had a cow named Annie that when we got her, she was pregnant and undernourished. We beefed her up (pun intended) and she gave birth to twins. One died and we almost lost Belle, but we got her meds and poured them down her and forced her to drink colostrum and milk from Mom.

Now, the interesting thing was that you said that cows have moods and are like people. I thought maybe I was nuts. When the twin was born dead, Annie moaned and moaned and walked all over the corral looking for it after my hubby put it in a bag and took it away. For weeks after, Annie would not let Mike near her. I loved it when she would moo softly to Belle to let her know it was time to milk. I loved it when she came running when we called her. I cried (and I'm crying now) when she was butchered. We still have Belle, but the vet said she probably was a freemartin and would not be able to have babies. That means I have to go through another butchering next winter. I can't stand the thought. And, I'm not depressed. I am just very sensitive and it hurts to watch something that you loved and nurtured be gone, even if it does benefit you by giving you sustanance.

I understand Patti. I guess I might not be expressing myself as well as I want to, but please know that I know what you are going thru and somehow, someway, it does get better.

Take some time away from the routine. Hey...come visit me up here in cold north I deee hoe!

love to you, Idaho Cher

-- Cheryl Rovang (fullcircle@nidlink.com), January 15, 2000.

I simply do what needs done when needs done, when frustrated i go outside and scream, when sad i hold my children and cry, when i need a reason i look at my wife and beautiful children, thank GOD and go on. IT IS WORTH IT, THEY ARE WORTH IT

-- tom calloway (Calfarm@msn.com), January 15, 2000.

Pattie,

I agree with Cheryl. You are grieving your cow! You spent a lot of time with her and you loved her. This will take you some time to go through the grieving process.

I too ask myself where are the people from the seventies. Back then, we got together and helped each other out. We cut firewood together, we canned together, we bartered everything from childcare to manure. Now, everyone keeps to themselves and their is no support for homestead moms. We're too busy surviving to go out and network like the old days, so we're stuck with isolation. And yeah, we do alot of work!

Soon, spring will come and the opportunity to get back outside in the sunshine, the mud will dry to good dirt and the pea sprouts will be up. With the renewing of the earth, you'll have a renewing of you soul. Until then, go somewhere you've never had time for before. If you are not milking its a great time for a getaway.

We are all here for you.

-- Laura (gsend@hotmail.com), January 15, 2000.

Patti, I want you to know that I stepped into the 21st century and got myself an E-mail address just so I could send you a message. Man, have I been there before! I live in a suburb in So. Cal. and have been living a 'very interested in homesteading life but unable to fully immerse myself in it because of our location, etc.,etc.' I find that trying to live in both worlds to sometimes be very exhausting, so I end up getting burned out. The only way I can regain my energy and joy is to back off for awhile. But I always come back to the homestead way of life, because IT IS SO FULLFILLING and the only way of life that makes sense to me. I find that the winter is hard (yes, even here in Calif.) because the shortened days are somewhat depressing. But, as the days get longer and there is some sort of baby, either goat, chick etc, I start feeling happier. I think we all go through the 'eating meat' thing to some degree when we keep animals. I am a vegetarian at heart, but cannot do without some meat on a regular basis. I start feeling very weak, and depressed. Please, keep the faith in our way of life to whatever extent you can do it. Read some inspirational books, take a break (however long you need), take some vitamins (or maybe natural hormones) and I'll bet you feel better before too long. Love and prayers, chris

-- christine allen (cfallen@hotmail.com), January 15, 2000.

Hurray, Patti! You are going to make it! Remember, we've all been there at one time or another. You are in my prayers, please take time to talk to the God you are tight with! Best wishes. Barbara

-- barbara (barbaraj@mis.net), January 15, 2000.

I'm sometimes surprised how many of the old hippies from the 60's are still out here. Those of us who have survived living in the country have sometimes taken jobs in town, moved to different homes, raised families who are now out on their own, too, and we still get excited about planting seeds in the spring, watching the new chicks hatch, etc. I thhink that one of the things that keeps my wife and me going is that we have a number of friends with similar interests that we get together with on a regular basis for an evening of potluck supper and visiting. We also help each other out with projects when an extra hand is needed. And we aren't always really close, some live 30 miles apart or more, but it helps to know that kindred folks are out there.

-- Jim (jiminwis@yahoo.com), January 15, 2000.

Hey Patti, I agree with all of those other folks and would like to add a little thought for you...Sometimes we strong women have to accept that we have taught our children, spouses, and neighbors that we CAN take care of everything (when we really know better), so can we then blame them for not recognizing when we need a helping hand or a tender word of encouragement? For me, I had spent almost fifty years saying "that's ok, I'll do it dear", or,"you go ahead and sleep,I'll get up and do the chores".For years that was really OK with me, not only didn't I mind, I enjoyed it.I enjoyed those moments of solitude...I enjoyed stepping back and looking at the finished product and giving myself a little pat on the back.A few years ago when I started having some health problems, I really needed help, but where was everybody????? They were where I had encouraged them to be, firm in the belief that "Mom will do it".My neighbors always thought of me as a very strong and capable and self-sufficient woman, so why would I need any help?..Low and behold, I learned to ask for it without any guilt, and there it was. Folks came over with meals, helped with chores, and held my hand when I needed it..Surprise! Just as the folks on this site have responded to you with love and support,I hope that you have reached out to those who truly know you and have told them honestly that you need them now.Take it from one who has been there, when you are perceived as the "rock of Gibraltar",you really need to tell folks when you are feeling more like gravel.....

-- Lesley Chasko (martchas@gateway.net), January 16, 2000.

Patti, I was a 60's/70's hippie who homesteaded for about 12 years and burned out. I loved the life; loved the animals, but I just got plane ole' tired of always having to invent a way around costs and expenses and mechanical breakdowns, butchering/culling, etc... I was younger in my late teens to late 20's early 30's.I sold out and moved to the city where: I went back to college; got a degree; found a great paying job and guess what? Here I am back at it again almost 20 years later. Don't have an answer for you. It is easier for me this time around. I know I'm not missing out on anything because I went back to find out what it was I felt I wasn't getting by living the life I thought to be so idealistic...so, sounds like a nice vacation would do you some good. Take a break. Try not to be so serious about the whole thing. It isn't about success or anything like that. Relax and know you are doing what you are because you at one time had total conviction that it was right...it still is but you've lost the fire. A break is needed, maybe.

-- Jim Roberts (jroberts1@cas.org), January 20, 2000.

Patti, I'm glad you're feeling better from reading the wonderful responses folks have given you.

I just want to add one thing; maybe it would be a good idea to figure out a couple of chores you've been doing "the old fashioned way", and do them "the modern way". I don't know what your actual homesteading lifestyle is, but I used to live WAY back in the woods, built my house with a hand saw, pumped water with a hand pump (fifty good hard strokes to get it to the surface, then fifty more strokes for five gallons of water.

Many of my friends were convinced that we were "independent" if we weren't hooked up to the power line. Well, I decided that we were just as dependent, just dependent on the oil companies instead of the power companies. We burned kerosene lamps, because we didn't have electric lights. I ended up putting in a gasoline motor which pumped my water for me. I'd pour a gallon of gas into the tank and start the motor when we'd go to town, and have a nearly full 750 gallon storage tank when we'd come home

Just "automating" the water system this way meant having enough water to take showers, wash dishes, and have enough water to grow a big vegetable garden. Without spending literally hours every day pumping that damn pump by hand. Was I somehow less pure? Maybe. Maybe not. I do know that if I'd of had to keep pumping that thing to get a bare minimum to grow stunted plants, I would have had to give it all up.

Maybe you can find a couple of things like this to get some help with. Maybe an electric pump, refrigerator, or something. Use your imagination, and think about whether having a few modern conveniences will make you feel better about your lifestyle. You can still be socially conscious, you can still be environmentally responsible. For instance, is it really somehow more environmentally aware to use five gallons of propane to run a Servel refrigerator than it is to use a couple of dollars worth of electriciy to run an electric one?

Best wishes from a pagan, who lives by the golden rule...

-- jumpoff joe (jumpoff@echoweb.net), January 20, 2000.

Have to agree with those last two posts from Jim Roberts and jumpinoff Joe. Both of those posts are about not getting into "bondage" to facets of the homestead life. Easy test to tell if you have allowed yourself to get into bondage. -Is it robbing you of your joy?- Is it bossing you, instead of you bossing it? If it is, back away from it, and look at it. Ask, "What is wrong with this picture."

I don't mean that everything has to be fun. Far from it. But, if you are not enjoying any of it, - because of some part of it, change it. Like jumpin-off did about the water.

We have seen so many homesteader wannabe's come and go, and you would not believe how important the water is in the whole picture. Everything on the homestead revolves around water - for the house, for the livestock, for the garden. If the water situation is inadequate or a hassle, everything else becomes more difficult. It will wear you down.

To learn to "lighten up" about some aspects of the homestead life can be the life saver. We have been homesteading for 21 years. For years, we had no luck with lima beans (a favorite of ours). We once went without lima beans for seven years! Anything we didn't raise, we didn't eat. Bondage. Guess what. They sell that stuff in the store and lightning doesn't strike if you break down and buy some.

We started out butchering 400 chickens a year to sell. We butchered chickens at night, under the pole light, in the snow, in the rain, the week the baby was due. Hated it. Light bulb came on. "We don't have to do this!" Today, we butcher 25 to 30 chickens for just us.

Another thing. We know many fine people whose livestock are keeping them broke. Sometimes we just need to accept that we have to cut our numbers down to what we can afford, if they aren't paying their way. And, a lot of animals do not pay their way. Put the pencil to it. If your animals are putting you deeper in debt or taking the extra money that might let you do something nice for yourself, consider letting them go. Maybe not permanently, but until you can better afford them.

Learn to recognize bondage when you see it. You will be surprised how much of it you will see in other folks' lives and in yours. When you realize you are in bondage to something, only you can take the steps to free yourself. We were in bondage to the idea that we would only eat what we raised. We were in bondage to thinking we had to raise, butcher and sell 400 chickens a year. I could list many more things that got ahold of us over the years that we had to shake off.

Remember, it doesn't all have to be fun, but some of it has to be, - or you might as well be punching a time clock at a job that you hate. You can be unhappy anywhere. You don't have to move beyond the sidewalks to do it. Determine what brings you joy and determine how many of the less pleasant things you can tolerate without diminishing the pleasure. Get rid of the rest.

-- homestead2 (homestead@monroecty.net), January 20, 2000.

homestead2, you hit it perfectly. I knew what I wanted to say and couldn't get the correct word...bondage. Yes sir, that was exactly what I was experiencing back in the 70's. There were my "friends" the "homestead police" who would pass judgement on me for selling out and buying a ton of coal to suppliment my wood heat, etc...there was a pressure to stay within accepted limits of what was the ideal level of homesteading...now, I don't care. The pressure is off and I do what I want at what level I want. Funny thing is I am more "off grid" than my judgemental friends who used to jibe me for having an electric light in my barn! And yes, I have several electric lights in my barn now!! You have to set your own standards for comfort levels to maintain and be happy and content...no one else matters. You do what you do because you enjoy it--when it becomes uncomfortable and job-like, then it is time to reevaluate and make changes.

-- Jim Roberts (jroberts1@cas.org), January 27, 2000.

homestead and jim,

I had to laugh! And I wanted to shout: "Right ON!" I am still chuckling.

I tried to do a lot of things (some right, some pretty marginal) in terms of being more self sufficient in the 70's but was always measuring myself against the purists (!) who seemed to have an answer to everything (including what kind of music to listen to, how fast to hike, etc). It was hard to feel a lot of confidence in even trying stuff out with the "Homestead Police" or equivalent setting impossible standards. And the "HP" always felt like reminding everyone...

I'm glad I am older, more confident and could mostly care less what anyone thinks of me or how I do things. But I can still remember feeling that pressure. And I am a lot more tolerant of how other people do things, too!

Most importantly, I have learned to ask for help when I need it. That is critical to my mental health. This forum is a great place to get it.

Still trying to get it right, but optimistic that I may get some of it!

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), January 27, 2000.

To Sheepish: Ah yes, the Homestead Police! They came in all sizes and shapes. Getting caught red handed by these purists was a disgrace. I can remember throwing a loaf of store bread in the cupboard as they came in the house. Once, in the grocery store, I stepped in front of my shopping cart so the HP wouldn't see a bag of noodles. So funny today, but it wasn't back then.

After a HP taught me to clean hog intestines for stuffing our sausage, I can remember thinking, "How badly do I want to do this?" I don't know if it was the manure that had to be squeezed out of them, or the time one of the hogs had worms in their intestines,- or the hours and hours of scraping for the satisfaction of saying I did it all, but it clicked for me. I figured that the important thing was that I did know how to collect and clean the casings, and if I HAD to, I could. But, as long as $15.00 buys enough commercially cleaned casings to stuff two hogs, I'll be buying them.

The list of sorting what is worth it and what is not, goes on and on, and in the end, we must each do what is right for us.

-- homestead2 (homestead@monroecty.net), January 28, 2000.

Patti, I'm sorry you felt so down, and I'm glad that you're doing better. Thank you for your post, that generated so many wonderful replies. For the first time in years, I feel connected with people who understand my chosen lifestyle. (I'm a middle-of-the-roader, I guess!) I had given up trying to find anyone, locally, who wasn't either a member of the H.P. or "stuff-worshippers".

Where are the '70's people? Right here, on this board. With the spirits of the '30's people and the 1860's people and the, etc., ad infinitum, watching over our shoulders and laughing and crying right with us.

Hope you find your balance point. I'm still looking for mine, too.

-- Sylvia (slydy@intrstar.net), January 29, 2000.

patti, wow! what a tragic letter, and what great letters of encouragement you got from so many. hey i am one of those homestead hippies you were wondering about. well girl, i went thru a lot of changes just like you are doing. i did the whole routine carrying water, woodstove, homebirth, etc. so now i am one of those "modern" homesteaders. i have indoor plumbing, i also have electricity in the barn, and a real washer and dryer. ok the compromises; i can't raise bottle calves from my goat milk. the reason? i cry when they go to the locker. they trusted me and it seemed to me that i left them down. i still raise my own meat. i live is kansas, and know what goes into the beef you buy at the store. i try to raise my animals with love and concern. they are treated well from birth to death. i do not kill and eat my breeding stock. my best goat died of old age. my rabbits are the same way. what iam trying to say is living in the country is the only way to live, but you have choices as to how you live. be good to yourself, if you can't get your family to help you then cut down on what you have to do. my kids are grown, some of them still think i am silly to have all this stuff to care for. i do it alone cause there is no one else who is here to do it. patti take a break,get rid of everything go back to work, school, or anything to increase your own sense of self worth.. you can alway go back and start new and refreshed, when you realize it was all for something. being at eace with yourself should be your first priority. you have the right to be happy. ps i work full time now and it sucks!!! the rat race is still out there and so are all the rats. take it easy,give yourself a break, stop and smell the roses, the kids will grow up and you will like them again. i had 5 go thru puberty, not a fun experience. peace and love karen

-- KAREN MAUK (DAIRYGOATMAMA@AOL.COM), January 31, 2000.