I attended a Bible Study with a group of men for the first time tonight. During the study of Mark chapter three in verse 29 the discussion was "what is the unforgivable sin". If i understand this correctly this is attributing the work of the Holy Spirit to Satan. since all the gifts of the holy spirit are not still working today, is this something that we can be guilty of today? i hope i have stated the question clearly enough, thanks in advance for the feedback.

-- Anonymous, December 17, 1999

Answers

Boy did you ever open up a can of worms. The best answer to that question is found at George Faull's web site. Email George at summit1@netusa1.net. NO offense to anyone here, but he has had the best answer that I have ever heard thus far.

-- Anonymous, December 17, 1999

The unforgivable sin from my understanding is not a sin that an individual can commit. Rather it was the sin that national Israel committed - in their rejection of Christ. And for that sin, the Kingdom was taking away from them and giving to another.

If attributing the works of the Holy Spirit to satan would cause an individual to be lost forever then Paul was lost. Paul when he attacked the church did so because he felt it was not of God...

Later he repented and he the worst of sinners was saved....

Also it is interesting to note; that we never find any mention of the unforgivable sin in any NT letter. If this was something a christian could commit then surely someone would have written about it..

The closest we come to is John in his first letter talking of a sin leading to death....

-- Anonymous, December 21, 1999

Steve, I agree with you as we take that text in context. But we see the unpardonable sin, rejection of the Holy Spirit, occurring every time someone rejects the terms of pardon as given by Christ..

-- Anonymous, December 22, 1999

I would agree with the Godfather (Spinnati) that denial of Christ is rejection of the Holy Spirit, but I believe that to be only in a secondary sense. Rejection of Christ is rejection of Christ. That is forgiveable because all of us at one point or another have rejected Christ and, if we have met the terms of pardon, have been forgiven. I believe rejection of Christ to be the "sin leading to death" ( I John 5:16). When we reject Christ, we reject all three persons of the Godhead.

If I could put Matthew 12 (which is a more expanded teaching on the subject) in the SNIV (Sheridan non-inspired version) verses 31 & 32 read, "You say the Kingdom is of Satan now, but if you continue this when the Spirit comes and the Kingdom is here, if you claim the Church to be Satanic, it will not be forgiven you." This was a national sin for the official Jewish view of the Church was that it was the kingdom of Hell. Therefore the nation was to be judged. They were declaring that Christ's fruit was good, but He Himself was evil (see v. 33).

The sign of that judgment was the Baptism of the Holy Spirit in Acts 2 and the judgment took place in 70 AD.

The whole context of Mt 12 has to do with Kingdom. v. 23, when they are asking about the "son of David" the real question was "is this the promised Kingdom" and the Pharisees were saying it was the kingdom of Satan (v. 24).

Later, the Jewish leaders want a sign from Jesus for proof. Jesus let's them know that an evil and adulterous generation seeks after signs (something the modern Church needs to be taught). The quesion throughout Mt. 12 is the kingdom is coming, who's is it?

-- Anonymous, December 22, 1999

Scott

I agree with your non-inspired version...

keep looking UP

Steve

-- Anonymous, December 23, 1999

I am perplexed by the statement, "since all the gifts of the holy spirit are not still working today", where does it say this in the Holy Scriptures?

I read Romans 11:29 to mean The gifts of God have been given and He has chosen to not withdraw or repent from having given them.

This was part of the scenario we see in the life of Jesus, the "religious" of His day refusing to believe that God would move by His Spirit and do the miraculous. Then, in fact, attribute that action of the Spirit of God to the Devil.

As if the Devil were capable of the miraculous but the Spirit is not.

Sincerely,

Barry Hanson

-- Anonymous, December 28, 1999

1 corinthians 13:8 where there are gifts of prophesy, they will be done away with, if there are tongues they will cease, if there is knowledge it will be done away with. consistently in the scripture the passing of miraculous gifts was done through the laying on of the apostles hands. In Acts 2:43 it was the apostles who were performing signs and wonders. Paul writes in Romans 1:11 he wished to impart some spiritual gift to those to whom he wrote. others did not have the ability to pass miraculous gifts on to others. without the laying on of the apostles hands miraculuos gifts were not passed on. If all the gifts are still working why are there no raisings from the dead? why are these t.v. hypnotists lining up wheel chairs on the stages instead of people who have been restored by the power of God. why is it that Benny Hinn can knock people out with his touch, but when people get out of the chair they must be helped across the stage. i read in the Bible that when Peter and John laid hands on the man at the temple gate "he went walking and leaping and praising God" why are these things not done today? because the apostles have passed away and with them these miraculuos gifts. read through Acts 8:4-20. why did phippip not lay hands on those in samaria and pass along the spirit? through the laying on of the Apostles hands the spirit is given

-- Anonymous, December 29, 1999

Barry,

Is the devil able to do miraculous things?

-- Anonymous, December 30, 1999

Yes, I believe so.

Although, that is a good question, I was attempting to think of an example of the top of my head, my mind must be some where else. I am sure you may be able to provide a reference where the devil did something miraculous or it is stated that he can do so.

My only examples where the calamities that happened in Jobs life. Demon possess, which I am not sure if you want to label that miraculous (?) As far as healing and supernatural acts, I'm blank.

I believe this answers your question.

Sincerely,

-- Anonymous, December 30, 1999

Barry -- there are several instances of instruction in the NT of "testing the spirits". A common interpretation of this is that the first century Christians or we (depending on your position of the modern role of the Holy Spirit) are to test messages (prophecy, tongues, whatever) against some standard -- again, a common thought is that this standard is Scripture. Mark

-- Anonymous, December 30, 1999

Mark,

Without a doubt the Holy Scriptures are the standard! I was trying to think of some references that specifically say that the devil can do the miraculous. I did think of this reference in 2 Thess. 2:9

"Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders."

Again you mention there are references that inform us to test the spirits because there are counterfeits about. I think that goes to prove my point, however, you cannot have a counterfeit without the authentic.

Sincerely,

-- Anonymous, December 31, 1999

Steve Malone,

You said,

"The unforgivable sin from my understanding is not a sin that an individual can commit. Rather it was the sin that national Israel committed - in their rejection of Christ. And for that sin, the Kingdom was taking away from them and giving to another."

The Kingdom was taken away from the Jews and not Israel. Read Acts 1.

(Acts 1:6 KJV) "When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the KINGDOM TO ISRAEL?"

(Acts 1:7 KJV) "And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power."

You do not understand the Kingdom, the Jews, or Israel. Jesus gave the kingdom to a stone nation cut out without hands...(Mat 21:43 KJV) "Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof."

(Mat 21:44 KJV) "And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder."

And where did Jesus get this "stone" idea? (Dan 2:34 KJV) "Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces."

(Jer 51:19 KJV) "The portion of Jacob is not like them; for he is the former of all things: and Israel is the rod of his inheritance: the LORD of hosts is his name."

(Jer 51:20 KJV) "Thou art my battle ax and weapons of war: for with thee will I break in pieces the nations, and with thee will I destroy kingdoms;"

Seems that God is using Israel to crush the nations. Which nation(s) have been used thusly? Israel!

Hint! It is not the tiny little Jewish nation whom The Stone Nation supports with military and economic aid. It is a very powerful, wealthy, Christian (basicly) nation. And it exists today, and no nation can come up against it...yet. They will try and they will die.

-- Anonymous, January 30, 2000

Mark, here is some interesting history. If it were not for the Jewish people our nation would not be here. While, Gen. Washington was at Valley Forge, his Congressional Army was starving, cold, and badly needed supplies. They were going to loose the war. Then some Jewish immigrant rallied together and raised among the Jewish community over a million dollars. To honor, the Jews when General Washington became president he honored the Jews by placing a Star of David over the head of the Eagle on the back with the shekinah glory around it. If you turn the bill upside down, the shield of the eagle becomes a menorah. Cool uh?

-- Anonymous, January 31, 2000