If Kosky is suggesting us citizens make inquiries to ensure readiness at the local level....

Then what is a Pennsylvania citizen to do when the Pennsylvania Public Utilities Commission DENIES the petition of several citizen for disclosure of y2k readiness of all Pennsylvania utilities?

They have absolutely nothing to hide. Yeah right.

We have absolutely nothing to worry about. Uh huh.

http://www.broadcast.com/shows/endoftheline/9911/end1104.ram

The above is an audio file. You need real audio to listen.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 05, 1999

Answers

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001iAt

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001iBG

These are two good threads that not a single "logical" Doomer has yet to rspond to. Hmmm, wonder why.

As soon as I see some good explanations maybe I'll try to comment on this thread.

-- (polly@want.an abacus), November 05, 1999.

If that's you buttnugget, wanting some attention on your threads, then go have a looksee.

They are hardly in the category of concern that this one is.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 05, 1999.

polly@want.an abacus,

I'm really not sure what kind of a response you are fishing for. The two articles seem to be good news, but this supposed good news about South African ports and DOJ mission critical systems neither reflects nor represents any guarantees against the wide-spread vulnerabilities that make up the total risks now posed by the Y2K technology problem.

Sincerely, Stan Faryna

-- Stan Faryna (faryna@groupmail.com), November 05, 1999.

polly@abacus:

RE: compliant port in Durban South Africa - already have Bay-Gen radios, and don't need any SA gold or diamonds. The port authorities themselves are concerned RE vulnerable infrastructure (do the power plants run on 286's or 386's?, etc.), which is precisely the doomer point.

RE: mission-critical DOJ systems - unable to comment, since like public utility commissions or the state of Maine, classification of MC versus non-MC, along with verification of compliant MC systems is not to be shared with the public. You are unable to comment either, for the same reason.

===================================================================== P: "Gary North is not a programmer"

D: "True, but an historian knows that 2000 comes after 1999. Lawyers know it too."

-- (doomer@has.abacus.net), November 05, 1999.

Isn't this like when the mother says "go bug your father" (or brother)...just to get the child out of the way...

-- Mad Monk (madmonk@hawaiian.net), November 05, 1999.

Note: The above link will take you to the Jeff Rense (Art Bell's "Mini-Me") show.

Show begins: ..."I gotta note here from a friend [apparently the petitioner] today.

"OR"- Surely Jeff shared with you how *many* people constituted the "several" he spoke of didn't he? Also, Jeff surely told you what the petition's "demands" were didn't he? I hope at the very least (in the interest of truth and balanced reporting of course) he explained exactly *why* the petition was denied. I'd hate to be left with the feeling that a couple of extremists made a bunch of exhorbitant demands for information the Pa. Utilities Commission was under absolutely no obligation to provide.

Perhaps "OR", you could research and provide us with a link to help us all verify this travesty of justice in the event Mr. Rense was only using this "note from a friend" to hype his rather dubious "show".

Thanks

-- CD (not@here.com), November 05, 1999.

Note: The above link will take you to the Jeff Rense (Art Bell's "Mini-Me") show. Show begins: ..."I gotta note here from a friend [apparently the petitioner] today.

"OR"- Surely Jeff shared with you how *many* people constituted the "several" he spoke of didn't he? Also, Jeff surely told you what the petition's "demands" were didn't he? I hope at the very least (in the interest of truth and balanced reporting of course) he explained exactly *why* the petition was denied. I'd hate to be left with the feeling that a couple of extremists made a bunch of exhorbitant demands for information the Pa. Utilities Commission was under absolutely no obligation to provide.

Perhaps "OR", you could research and provide us with a link to help us all verify this travesty of justice in the event Mr. Rense was only using this "note from a friend" to hype his rather dubious "show".

Thanks

-- CD (not@here.com), November 05, 1999.

You remind me of Clark Kent.

The mild mannered reporter.

-- (not@here.either), November 05, 1999.

Gee CD, I'm sure they did not ask for anything more than full disclosure...as per the U.S. Senate Special Committee recommendation.

Duh.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 05, 1999.

If we knew exactly what was requested, we could make a much more informed determination in this case. If we knew the reason for denial, that would help also. Hell, knowing Jeff Rense, if we knew this *actually happened* we'd be ahead of the game. This one belongs in the silly rumor bucket pending further (indeed, *any*) hard information.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), November 05, 1999.

CD, the difference between you and me is the belief that when people are given accurate information, they will take right action. The chance of those folks who petitioned the Pennsylvania PUC for full disclosure of PA utility readiness being whacko idiots are very small, in my book. You obviously have a differing opinion.

My opinion is that the whackos don't bother to petition governmental entities. They simply hunker down and wait for calamity to overtake them. They do not react rationally, nor do they gather as a group to collect valuable information.

CD, do you think that the following group are whackos, acting irrationally?

http://www.y2knews.com/openletter.htm

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 05, 1999.

Flint: Hell, knowing Jeff Rense, if we knew this *actually happened* we'd be ahead of the game...

Hell, Flint tell me about one single mainstream media icon that tells *what actually happened* that you have *actually checked up on* and I will be impressed. You know and I know it, the fact is you do not question what is being told to you by the Dan Rathers and the Peter Jennings of the world. You need to put yourself into a different class from the people who no longer trust the mainstream media.

PERIOD.

You will have your answer soon and you will not like it.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 06, 1999.

Gee CD, I'm sure they did not ask for anything more than full disclosure...

I'm curious as to what your definition of "full disclosure" would be. By your definition, can a line be drawn as to when granting a request for further information places an unreasonable burden on a company which has already met all legal requirements? If so, do you think it impossible that the (alleged) petitioners could have crossed that line when you have absolutely no idea who these petitioners are?

CD, the difference between you and me is the belief that when people are given accurate information, they will take right action.

Your statement implies that I hold the belief that when people are given accurate information they will take "wrong" action. I hardly think so. More accurately "OR", the difference between us is that you assume a piece you listened to on the Jeff Rense show qualifies as "accurate information".

CD, do you think that the following group are whackos, acting irrationally?

I have no reason to believe the names in that group belong to "whackos acting irrationaly". Is that somehow related to our discussion about the Pennsylvania Public Utilities Commission's alleged denial of an alleged petition as "reported" by Jeff Rense after he received "a note from a friend"?

"You remind me of Clark Kent. The mild mannered reporter."-- not@here.either

I'm looking for Lois. Have ya seen her around?

-- CD (not@here.com), November 06, 1999.

OR:

You sound like a little kid, caught doing something wrong, saying "well, he did it too!" Jeff Rense's reliability has nothing to do with the reliability of Dan Rather or Peter Jennings. They're all bad.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), November 06, 1999.

Good job as usual OR.

It's really pointless trying to point know-nothings like Flint and CD in the right direction.

They are both an embarrassment to Americans and the Consitution and Free Speech. and the Freedom Of Information Act...

Shame on you Flint and CD to mock like this with just 7 weeks to go.

Assholes.

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), November 06, 1999.

"You remind me of Clark Kent. The mild mannered reporter."-- not@here.either

I'm looking for Lois. Have ya seen her around?

-- CD (not@here.com), November 06, 1999.

Yep, she's over at that other place!

-- (not@here.either), November 06, 1999.

Andy:

You need to use just a hint of logic, rather than just attacking thoughtlessly. OR was claiming that Rense must be right because someone else is wrong. Do you accept this? Do you really believe that 2+2=9 is correct, just because someone else said 2+2=10? Who cares what anyone else said? Rense must be evaluated on his own merits. And Rense is a master of Doomer Selective Amnesia Syndrome -- he's wrong about something, someone demonstrates this, and he forgets all about it and goes on to the next thing. And retains what popularity he has because some people hear what they want to hear. Like you.

-- Flint (flintc@mindspring.com), November 06, 1999.

"Yep, she's over at that other place!" -- (not@here.either),

If you see her before I do, could you give her a message for me? Tell her I found the ear ring. It was snagged on the pillowcase.

Thanks

-- CD (not@here.com), November 06, 1999.

Flint suggests, "some people hear what they want to hear. Like you."

You mean like YOU, Flint? Mister 'banks are OK but oil will have problems'?

asshole.

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), November 06, 1999.

CD: "I'd hate to be left with the feeling that a couple of extremists made a bunch of exhorbitant demands for information the Pa. Utilities Commission was under absolutely no obligation to provide...

"I have no reason to believe the names in that group belong to "whackos acting irrationaly".

extremists = whackos

acting irrationally = made a bunch of exhorbitant demands

CD: Is that somehow related to our discussion about the Pennsylvania Public Utilities Commission's alleged denial of an alleged petition as "reported" by Jeff Rense after he received "a note from a friend"?

Only if you can read.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 06, 1999.

By the way, this PA petition issue was a few days old. The "friend" who spoke to Rense was pointing the issue out as salient to the subject at hand. The friend was Scott Portzline of the Three Mile Island watchdog group. Go up about 45 or so posts to read the article.

-- OR (orwelliator@biosys.net), November 06, 1999.

If you see her before I do, could you give her a message for me? Tell her I found the ear ring. It was snagged on the pillowcase.

Thanks

-- CD (not@here.com), November 06, 1999.

Hmmm, sounds like a private issue, Clark.

And, I know she has a great sense of humor, but you better tell her that yourself.

-- (not@here.either), November 07, 1999.

Hmmm, sounds like a private issue, Clark. And, I know she has a great sense of humor, but you better tell her that yourself. --(not@here.either)

Hmmm. I like your attitude "not@here". Whaddya say I fly over to your place sometime and pick you up? We could do lunch and maybe take in a movie. By the way, just dress casual. (That x-ray vision rumor was just a scam made up by some vendor to sell gullible women lead-lined underware.)

-- CD (not@here.com), November 07, 1999.