The East Tennessee & Western North Carolina sent at least one 4-6-0 to the White Pass, and the Sumpter Valley "turtle back" passenger cars went there.

I have HO kits for the cars, and Bachmann's G scale 4-6-0. I would like to build some G scale SV cars. My question then, is, were the SV cars and the 4-6-0 ever run in the same train?

-- G. Stahlberg (sberg@brevard.edu), December 03, 1998

Answers

Hi,

The ET&WNC sent 2 of their 4-6-0's ( # 10 & # 14 ), to the WP&Y in 1942. The engines were owned by the U S Army Transportation Corps. They kept the same #'s while on the WP&Y. At least one ( probably both ) were rebuilt by the South Tacoma, Washington shops of the Northern Pacific, on their way to the WP&Y. They arrived on the WP&Y in 1942, and ran until December 25, 1943, when both were damaged in the Whitehorse roundhouse fire. They were not rebuilt after the fire, and were scrapped in Seattle in December of 1945. So they ran on the WP&Y for less than 2 years.

Sumpter Valley Ry. owned 6 of the "turtle roofed" passenger cars, all built by AC&F in 1918: 2 short RPO's, 2 combines, 2 coaches.

The WP&Y eventually ended up with 5 of these cars. One of the RPO's never left Oregon.

During WWII The Army acquirred 3 cars: 1 RPO became USA # 932 as a baggage car. The 2 combines became Army # 933 & 934. These cars were retired on the Sumpter Valley on July 29, 1943. They went to the Army after that date, but I am not sure when they arrived on the WP&Y. They are mentioned as being on the WP&Y in a memo written in July of 1944. All 3 cars were acquirred by the WP&Y from the Army at the end of WWII.

The overlap of the ET&WNC locos and these 3 SV cars would not have been very long, if at all. The SV cars may not have been purchased immeadiatly upon retirement, and/or they may have received repairs/rebuilding stateside before being shipped to the WP&Y. This was common with other equipment that the USATC purchased and sent to the WP&Y. I have found no firm date for their actual start of service on the WP&Y.

The 2 remaining SV "turtle roof" coaches were sold directly to the WP&Y in 1947. The unsold SV RPO became a shed in Oregon, later was saved in poor condition by the SV Restoration group, but was torched by vandals in the late 70's/early 80's in Baker, Oregon.

The RPO sent to the WP&Y became a work car on the WP&Y and its body survived until the early 70's when it was scrapped. As far as I can determine, it was not used as a baggage car, nor did it receive a passenger car number under WP&Y ownership (after WWII).

The 4 "long" cars went through various uses as combines, coaches, work cars, and parlor cars while on the WP&Y. All 4 cars remain in service on the WP&Y. This is the best info that I've been able to find on these items, as it pertains to your question. I hope that this helps. Maybe someone else has additional info.

Don Marenzi

-- Don Marenzi (DonMarenzi@aol.com), December 14, 1998.

My guess is "Yes", but I cannot prove this.

However, consider these facts:

- The ET&WNC locomotives 10 and 14 were sent to the W&PY during WWII to move men and materials for building the AlCan Highway - They were certainly capable of both passenger and freight service - They were smaller and had less tractive effort than many other locos either owned by the WP&Y or sent there from other 3' gauge RRs for the same purpose (and therefore more likely to be used for passenger trains than the other locos)

It also might be worthwhile to note that SVRR #50, also a Baldwin 4-6-0 of the same period, was very similar to the ET&WNC locomotives (and perhaps would provide the ultimate object of an interesting kit-bashing project).

My two cents ...

Glenn

-- Glenn Christensen (Glenn.E.Christensen@cpmx.saic.com), December 10, 1998.